FWR more unpleasant than ever

[Snappity]

The Talk Guidelines have done little to improve things. The majority of threads are about trans matters and very few, if any, positive. Misgendering is increasingly rife. "They" for a trans woman is as bad as "he".

Even the sex of trans women with female birth certificates is not respected.

There is post after post that trans women are not women and that sex is biological and cannot be changed (totally ignoring that many aspects of sex can be changed).

Then increasingly material from elsewhere which is anti-trans is being linked.

While individual comments are fair enough, the sheer volume means that FWR is a thoroughly unpleasant place for the majority of trans people and those of us who have trans family members.

Intersex women are also repeatedly disrespected with frequent posts that women are XX or are those with female reproductive capacity. It is hugely offensive.

I am going to be here less. The harassment - and I think that is what it is - has driven me away. It is a shame because trans and intersex feminists - indeed trans inclusive feminists - should be as welcome here as any other feminists. If MumsNet believes in debate that means ensuring that one side isn't shouted down - and the sheer volume of people saying that trans women are not women and belong in male spaces (because anyone "male" is a risk to women) is shouting down the other side of the debate.

FWR needs to regain a balance.

Mogle let's flip it - biggest tear, loudest delivery room scream, longest wait till someone realised we were in transition stage (baby stuff not gender stuff!) longest wait for c-section when all signs pointed to the need for it, crappest comment about sewing you up after delivery?

So funny. To think women could just redefine sports so that they had the advantage and men would have any incentive to compete.

I have actually had a good laugh at this thread and I'm sure any lurkers have had too.

Popchyk what about the neatest eyeliner? Speed not necessary just a steady hand. So obvs no gin the night before

Watching TV whilst browsing mn AND talking on the phone, all from a supine position on the sofa with a cat on my ribcage. HA! Beat THAT!

Quickest tampon change while holding the toilet door shut with one foot and trying not to bang your hip on the sanpro bin...totes open to low T individuals of all genders, obviously

With different leagues depending on girth of arse.

Thanks Snappity - you certainly did your job of keeping on making total fools of the TRA movement.

OK I am queen of swinging on my hammock in the garden whilst encouraging my children to entertain themselves. Extra marks given if said children are introduced to the category of who can make mum the best drink.

I love women. You are fabulous.

Isn't the very nature of sport exclusive anyway? And therefore wrong?

I wasn't even invited to play at Wimbledon this year which just goes to show how crap and corrupt it all is.

Not that I'd have gone anyway. Got a lot on.

Oops, sorry Popchyk and your sedate-laydeez needs!

-Calmly-having-a-cup-of-tea-in-a-garden-centre league table.

• Debating-women's-issues-on-Mumsnet Champions' league.

-Having-a-real life-conversation-about-concerns-you-have-about-women's rights-due-to-trans right activitists Local Fixtures Tables

• 'Knitting a vulva to remind people they belong to biological females' Yarn league table.

I've in no way ever done this, but I've been led to believe that its entirely possible to fire ping-pong balls out of a fanjo. So...competitive fanjo-firing, anyone?

There is already a champion at that in Benidorm. She has been practising for a long time

We could ease all those sportswomen into it with a 5k2couch app where you start off running and gradually decrease speed and distance until you end up reclining on a chaise longue sipping babycham while admiring your shellac and contouring.

flipinfury Really??? Now I am going to HAVE to give it a go....

Oops got your name wrong flippinfumin sorry!

New sport

Serial Apologising.

No darn way a man or trans woman would enter that...

Have you never heard Socio? She is called Sticky Vicky. To be fair she has retired now and her daughter has taken over.

So u on the longest goodbye ever snappity ?

Sticky Vicky........I think I just wet ma pants

Cos u been posting for such a lon* time since u done ur goodbye

Can I be in the 'Knowing where things are' event? You sit in a chair and solve random requests such as "Where is my PEZ dispenser?" And "Do I have any clean socks?". Could be an endurance event or a sprint event.

Apparently she fires all sorts from her fanjita. We have a long way to go to catch up

Am not piling on u by way. Just though5 u said adios

To refocus on the OPs original claim. That FWR is more unpleasant than ever before.

In brief: lots of other posters said 'yeah, but it only feels like that if you desparately need to start from the gate of 'transwomen are women' and lots of people here, because they're biological women who see the dangers in that statement, can't do that'

Other posters: Yeah, but no. Transwomen are women. No Debate.

Other posters: Erm, nope, that's not the case, and how are we going to have a discussion if you shut us down and demand that we start at your starting point of belief? Come and talk to us and let's debate this. What do you think about a? How about b? Please tell us why you think c?

Other posters; La la LahI By the way, women need to start ducking under the bar.

Other posters; Pffft.

Could we please refrain from the Sticky Vicky discourse?

I am a sedate laydee.

No wonder Snappy has only posted 426 times today with that kind of talk going on here.

But it’s cool if u want to hang wi5 us bu5 u kinda need to bring better stuff to the chat.
Like u know convincin* stuff

Otherwise say adios