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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Are we the baddies?

454 replies

DJLippy · 09/07/2018 18:27

Are we the baddies?

Are Terf's as bad as everybody seems to say?

Are we on the wrong side of history?

Anyone ever stop to ask themselves this or is it just me?

OP posts:
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DietCoke87 · 11/07/2018 20:42

Thanks for waking me up Nick Matte. I now understand that there's no such thing as biological sex... to dare to say out loud that there are such things as human females and human males is to be a cisnormative-heteronormative-patriarchal-imperialist-bigot... well fuck me... guess I need to retake A level human biology because it seems my current qualification is now out of date if in 2018 all you need to create new human life is two human bodies that have differing (not sure of the degrees of difference required because I don't have an MSc in Gender Studies) internal gender identities*... GinGinGin

*You know that feeling that permeates every single cell of your physical body and doesn't stop reminding you that at your innermost core you have a) a pink, irrational ladybrain that seeks out heels, makeup, fashion, hair trends and submissive roles. b) a blue, logical, courageous, stable, male brain. c) a non-binary spirit d)... z)... a1)... z∞)...

GardenGeek · 11/07/2018 20:57

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howlsmovingcastle84 · 11/07/2018 21:04

Ooh fun-I did university research too! Though ours was funded by the ESRC. Can't remember the exact figure but it was around 1.25 million. Now, admittedly, we focused more on obtaining and disseminating results than awards, but we did pick up a few shiny objects. Can I ask what the impact factor of the journals you were published in were? Did this improve your department REF?

BettyDuMonde · 11/07/2018 21:13

How does Nick Matte think babies get made?

GardenGeek · 11/07/2018 22:03

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Melanippe · 11/07/2018 22:13

I believe gooseberry bushes might have something to do with it Betty

Or some fairly awkward conversations after an evening out

HerFemaleness · 11/07/2018 22:24

Going back to the OP. No I don't consider myself a baddie for my unbelief. I don't think I'm an awful person for not believing that sex change is possible, or in the existence of masculine and feminine souls

If compelling evidence were to be produced ...well, I'll cross that bridge if I come to it.

KataraJean · 11/07/2018 22:25

I was going to write something in response to that Nick Watte quote, but decided it was not worth the brain power

I was reading an article about intimate partner violence in the LGBTIQ community.

Statistics were given referring to male-identifying people, female-identifying people and trans people.

The article was mainly about having to look beyond heteronormative understandings of domestic abuse as male perpetrator, female victim.

Almost twice as many male-identifying people experienced physical violence as female identifying people - which, looking through my heteronormative lens gave me pause. But on reflection, in this community, male-identifying people and this language means male homosexuals, I think, which means both victims and perpetrators are men?

So the language really just obscured and it seemed to me that male violence was still the problem, but by talking about male or female-identifying people and a general trans category, it was difficult to properly understand.

That may be my cis-het-normative analytical framing, but it seems to me feminism is about understanding relationships of power and if it is not even clear which groups of people are meant, the way power operates is opaque at best.

AngryAttackKittens · 11/07/2018 22:40

Why is the talking smiley @ing me? They don't seem very committed to the whole people are what they say they identify as thing given their comments about us and feminism...

Hypocrisy, it's what's for breakfast, lunch, and dinner in telling off the uppity women land.

Offred · 11/07/2018 22:44

Well, yet another poster asked to actually make their argument rather than defame and personally insult who is suddenly ‘busy’ then doesn’t come back...

AngryAttackKittens · 11/07/2018 22:46

Are they icing a cake?

Offred · 11/07/2018 22:50

Who knows?

I waited till work times were over, then I thought ‘oh maybe they are watching the match’ now I’m grasping with ‘early to bed?’...

Icing a cake? Don’t ‘much more educated’ people who have won awards for their big important work have people to ice cakes for them or am I being classist there?

Offred · 11/07/2018 22:51

Maybe it’s far too complicated to be adequately explained in a few hours...

Dragoncake · 11/07/2018 22:54

We are probably not educated enough to understand, Offred.

GardenGeek · 11/07/2018 22:55

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Bi11yOneMate · 11/07/2018 22:59

In answer to the OP, yes I frequently doubt and have to run through the reasoning and logic again. I'm surrounded by people who think I'm a bigot as we have a late transiting trans woman in the family.
But everything I still come back to "do /be /dress however you want unless it harms others". And breaking down safeguarding is harming.

AngryAttackKittens · 11/07/2018 22:59

I want smiley to tell Bowl she's not educated enough so I have an excuse to make popcorn for tsafkaerb.

GardenGeek · 11/07/2018 23:01

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Offred · 11/07/2018 23:02

But if that were the case we’d surely at least then see that smile was The. Authority. and we’d have to just accept what they said as The. Objective. Truth. wouldn’t we?

TallulahWaitingInTheRain · 11/07/2018 23:03

🎵 if I'd known you were coming I'd have iced a cake 🎶

Is it the same as doing pa knitting

AngryAttackKittens · 11/07/2018 23:04

Nah, Bowl is pretty good about getting on with the smackdowns nice and early in the morning.

(What are we calling morning now? Wouldn't want to be discriminatory against evening.)

GardenGeek · 11/07/2018 23:06

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Offred · 11/07/2018 23:07

We have to ask morning how morning identifies I think...

Offred · 11/07/2018 23:08

Maybe that’s why smile hasn’t been back TBF... MN’s concept of time is timephobic...

thebewilderness · 11/07/2018 23:14

This is the thing, there are not 12 million gender critical mumsnet users.

Given that over 80% of the general population is gender critical I would guess that the MN numbers would be much higher.

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