'Get the L Out' Statement by the lesbian protesters at Pride London

[R0wantrees]

getthelout.wordpress.com/blog/

Why “Get The L Out” ?
July 5, 2018
Angela C. Wild
Who We Are

Get the L Out is a group of lesbian and feminist individuals and organisations, opposing the increasingly anti-lesbian and misogynistic LGBT movement and the erasure of lesbians

Why We Protest

We believe that lesbian rights are under attack by the trans movement and we encourage lesbians everywhere to leave the LGBT and form their own independent movement, as well as to be vocal and take action against the proposed changes to the GRA.

Get the L Out believes trans politics (with uncritical support from the LGBT movement) does the following:

Promotes the social transition of lesbians, encouraging them to present as straight men thus favouring the pretence of heterosexuality over lesbianism – this is nothing more than a form of conversion therapy.
Promotes the medical transition of lesbians and pushes harmful drugs (untested hormone blockers, Lupron etc.) as well as unnecessary medical practices on perfectly healthy bodies – these are a form of misogynist medical abuse against lesbians.
Promotes the rights of heterosexual males who “identify” as women and lesbians (despite most of them still retaining their male genitals) over the rights of lesbians to choose their sexual partners. This new ‘queer’ LGBT politics thus coerces lesbians to accept the penis as a female organ and promotes heterosexual intercourse between male and female as a form of lesbian sex. This is simply a new facet to rape culture and compulsory heterosexuality." (continues)

Snappity do you now acknowledge that cross dressers are trans according to Stonewall?
Yes but they are not trans men or trans women.

@snappity They definitely do not because fetishistic cross dressers and part time transvestites are male

Their definition of trans men and trans women does not include cross-dressers.

Wrong: Stonewall says:
Trans: An umbrella term to describe people whose gender is not the same as, or does not sit comfortably with, the sex they were assigned at birth.
Trans people may describe themselves using one or more of a wide variety of terms, including (but not limited to) transgender, transsexual, gender-queer (GQ), gender-fluid, non-binary, gender-variant, crossdresser, genderless, agender, nongender, third gender, two-spirit, bi-gender, trans man, trans woman, trans masculine, trans feminine and neutrois.

"Crossdresser" is right there in the quote.

Pips Bunce is gender fluid and therefore not a trans woman

Tell the Financial Times that, because they put Pips as 21 in their Top 50 Women list. Pips is yet another middle-aged IT guy, I notice.

YOU.ARE.WRONG
I am not. You are confusing trans men and trans women, which are subsets of the trans umbrella, with the whole umbrella

Do you think Stonewall should be clarifying this in their trans inclusive training Snappity?

www.stonewall.org.uk/sites/default/files/first_steps_to_trans_inclusion_2016.pdf

Extract from link above

Oh, I see what you're doing.

Your definition of trans only encompasses 'transman' and 'transwoman'.

But instead of acknowledging that Stonewalls definition is a lot wider, you prefer to insinuate that other people are wrong.

I get it.

You're very disingenuous.

How do you know that a cross dresser does not believe themselves to be a woman, and therefore gets to be your definition of a transwoman?

Who are you to judge the sincerity of their belief?

@snappity - Stonewall, Pride etc do not argue for transwomen or trans men specifically - they argue for all trans. For trans people to use the toilets, changing rooms, prisons, hospital wards, shelters of their choice. That includes cross dressers and everyone else under the trans umbrella.

If Stonewall wants to fight for the right of transmen to join the Garrick club or inherit peerages I'll be right there with them. But they don't. Wonder why 🤔

Who are you to judge the sincerity of their belief?

Californian courtcase which starts in August:

'Nine homeless women signed on to a lawsuit against Naomi's House, saying the shelter forced them to shower with a person who identified as a transgender woman and sexually harassed them.'

By Corin Hoggard
Wednesday, May 23, 2018
FRESNO, Calif. (KFSN) -- A prominent Fresno charity, homeless women, and the transgender community all say they're experiencing a nightmare come true.

Nine women homeless women signed on to a lawsuit against Naomi's House and its parent company, the Poverello House, saying the last place they could go to feel safe is now dangerous because they're forced to shower with a transgender woman.

The Naomi House bills itself as a gentle haven of healing and a safe haven for single, homeless women, but a new lawsuit says it put a lot of women in harm's way in a very vulnerable spot -- the shower.

It says the shelter requires them to shower in groups, and it opened its doors to a person who identified themself as a transgender woman who made lewd and sexually inappropriate comments, and leered at them while they were naked.

"This is the biggest fear they bring up, that you're going to have people who may not even be transgender in bathrooms and settings where people are naked and their privacy rights are being violated," said Peter Kapetan, who filed the lawsuit on behalf of the women.

Poverello House administrators tell Action News federal law says they have to treat a person identifying as a woman as a woman -- and there's no way to test whether it's true.... (continues)

concludes:
"This is like their last safe haven to go to," Kapetan said. "If they're not there, they're out on the streets and like one of them told me, the streets are dangerous here in Fresno."

Leaders in the Valley's transgender community tell us this is a nightmare for them too because if someone who calls herself a transgender woman is sexually harassing people, she put an already marginalized community in a bad light.

Karen Adell Scot, a local transgender advocate, even offered to train Naomi's House employees on how to recognize people just pretending to identify as the opposite gender.

One possible solution is already in place: Poverello House administrators say they added shower curtains about four months ago."

thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3266198-No-True-Transwoman-transadvocates-question-whether-TW-is-genuine-after-said-TW-sexually-harasses-women-in-homeless-shelter

You are confusing trans men and trans women, which are subsets of the trans umbrella, with the whole umbrella

No, I'm not. Your version of what trans is conflicts with Stonewall, and with pretty much every other mainstream pro-trans-rights organisation.

So don't bother telling me that I haven't understood. If you had the basic decency and ability to articulate your own position, rather than just lob your dead-eyed grenades at others, then we could have a proper debate, and you just may manage to convince people that you have a point.

But no. Pick, pick, pick. Deflect, obfuscate, confuse, rinse, repeat.

Look at the likes of Travis Alabanza & Pips Bunce, Snappity. Whatever kind of trans they identify as, they're using women's spaces with impunity. Do you think that's acceptable?

Snappity: I am not. You are confusing trans men and trans women, which are subsets of the trans umbrella, with the whole umbrella

So glad Tara Hewitt's speech is doing the rounds again, to counter someone's personal crusade to tell us that 'transwomen' and 'transmen' are the only subset of the word 'trans' we should be focusing on.

When laws are potentially being made about transgender people, they are not being defined and delineated by 'as defined by Snappity of Mumsnet'.

When spaces are potentially being made open to all transpeople, they are not being defined 'as defined as trans by Snappity of Mumsnet'.

Stonewall, activists and 'advisors' such as Tara Hewitt, and others, are the people setting the boundaries and definitions, not 'Snappity of Mumsnet'. (Unless you are Tara, Snappity?)

Snappity:- in Tara's definition, where do the 'men who dress in women's clothes due to a sexual fetish' come in your definition of 'trans'.

Are they not in your 'subset' defined as 'transwomen'?

I suspect many of them would be very offended by your apparent exclusion of them from this category?

Here is the BBC complaint response.

Thank you for contacting us with your concerns about the BBC News article (www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-44757403)

We realise you feel that the title of the article is misleading and homophobic.

We would like to assure you that is certainly not the intention. This article aimed to inform how London Pride organisers have issued an apology after members of lesbian and feminist group Get The L Out demanded to march behind the rainbow flag, which marks the start of the event.

The article mentions how the group argues the trans movement is attacking lesbian rights and said it protested to protect those rights.

The piece also includes the response from a spokesperson for the group - "We protested to protect our rights and on behalf of all the lesbians intimidated, threatened and silenced by the GBT community everywhere. The GBT community today, by supporting the rights of males who "identify as lesbians" (also called "transwomen") over the rights of lesbians to choose their sexual partners (on the basis of their sex, not how they "identify") is in fact enforcing heterosexuality on lesbian. "This is a misogynistic and anti-lesbian manifestation of the rape culture we live in."

The BBC cannot, and does not, take a stance or hold an opinion on any public issue - as an independent and impartial broadcaster and news organisation we are prohibited through our Royal Charter & Agreement from expressing any view on any issue.

We have issued detailed guidelines to our staff in order to try to minimise the risk of offence. However, choosing the headlines for our online articles is a subjective matter and one which we recognise not every member of our audience will feel we get right every time.

This is often a very difficult decision for our editors. Our readers do not view things in the same way and it is inevitable that headlines which many users of our site might find acceptable will occasionally strike others as inappropriate.

We hope this explains our approach, though we have forwarded your concerns to the news department for their consideration.

That's not even true. They do take a stance on the issue! Somebody on twitter linked the bbc guidelines hang on

Ok found it, it is publically available

description for a transgender person. If in any doubt, ask the person involved how they would like to be described so basically that is Self ID. So that is definitely a one-sided stance.

Sorry screenshot

Pratchet

I complained because I didn't like the way the women were treated and how they were misrepresented. I am not complaining further, in part because of the way I was spoken to on here, I don't feel like putting myself out further at the moment.

I shared the complaint response in case it was helpful to this group of women, and I send them my best wishes.

Thanks Look. It's kind of you to share.

Not at all, I complained on their behalf and was happy to do so.

This charmer has calmed down.

www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/news/local/dundee/685759/childrens-convener-issues-grovelling-climbdown-over-expletive-laden-twitter-outbursts/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

@LookTwoFingers thank you for complaining and sharing the response.

I wonder how that person can stay in role. Admitting to that level of response should lead to dismissal.

The article says 'Councillor Philip Scott, who also sits on the children and families services committee, said the latest actions “do not look good at all” for the administration.

He said: “You would have thought Gregor would have learned from previous occasions that this really is not a good example to be setting.'

I think this person has simply learnt they can get away with it.

www.independent.co.uk/voices/anti-trans-protests-london-pride-transgender-transphobia-terf-lgbt-feminist-a8448521.html

The independent has totally gone over to the dark side

A blog by Maria MacLachlan

Oops - I've had too much to drink! Meant to say London Pride 2018: Fearless Feminists vs Misogynists & Lesbophobes. A blog by Maria MacLachlan

www.peaktrans.org/london-pride-2018-fearless-feminists/

Sarah Ditum New Statesman article:
'Why were lesbians protesting at Pride? Because the LGBT coalition leaves women behind
Misogyny doesn’t vanish at the flicker of a rainbow.'

(extract)
'The LGBT campaign group Stonewall had harsh words for the annual Pride march through London, which took place on 7 July. The parade, said Stonewall, was too white; it would not be attending this year. The criticisms, which Pride described as “inaccurate” and “disrespectful”, won praise for Stonewall, which has been credited with taking a more radical direction under the leadership of Ruth Hunt. Meanwhile, Pride has also been criticised for being more about corporate “rainbow-washing” than sexual freedom: floats sponsored by high street banks dispense branded face paints, straight couples having a look-see outnumber the leather daddies, and you can’t even march without a wristband.

So when a small group of lesbians disrupted this year’s Pride, perhaps you’d imagine that Stonewall would be on their side. These women, too, think that Pride has grown stale and conservative. Like Stonewall, they accuse the march of letting down certain members of the LGBT coalition – specifically, lesbians. But instead of backing the protesters, Stonewall offered condemnation, saying they had put “people in danger” and “have no place at Pride”. In the calculation of my-enemy’s-enemy, Stonewall had decided that these women were the greater evil.

To understand this reversal, you need to understand why these women were protesting in the first place, and how their message slams headlong into the most intractable divide in today’s LGBT movement. The group, which calls itself Get the L Out, carried banners proclaiming “lesbian not queer”, “lesbian = female homosexual” and “transactivism erases lesbians”. For Stonewall, which has made trans inclusion a central part of its renewed mission since Hunt took over in 2014, this was beyond the pale. Stonewall’s position can be summed up in one of its popular T-shirt slogans: “Some people are trans. Get over it.” Get the L Out was resolutely failing to get over it. (continues)
www.newstatesman.com/politics/feminism/2018/07/why-were-lesbians-protesting-pride-because-lgbt-coalition-leaves-women

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3307665-new-statesman-article

Anyone else seen this petition... Lesbians have had enough!

I’m just waiting for the ‘it’s only x number of transphobes’ from the people who say ‘transpeople are only a tiny group’... 🙄