Where do we draw the trans line....?

[loveyouradvice]

Really interesting reading all the Daily Mail comments on latest Man Friday article.... most seemed quite happy with the idea of transsexuals using women's facilities, but no transwomen with dangly bits.

This used to be my position - and may still be so... but I am really concerned the more I read about certain transsexuals (the previously macho late-transitioning type).... those with rampant AGP which leads them to fetishise women's bodies and being in women's spaces in a very mansplainy way.... I feel very squeamish about sharing space with them.... and was deeply shocked by learning that some comb bins for used tampons and pads and wear them to "feel more like a woman" and then celebrate and share this online with other fetishists.....

My suspicion is that for the sake of what one might see as the transsexuals we have long shared space with, out of courtesy and respect, that yes it is okay for them to be in some women's spaces .... But my concern is that with TRAs being so active and the transgender movement steamrollering ahead, that more of the aggressive AGP type are going to feel liberated to come out of the closet and into our spaces....and the balance will shift

I know this is just academic - given that focussing on No Self-Id is our priority - but would be very interested in hearing what other's think as I try to clarify my own position

"Trans men are biological female and as such included in female spaces."

Probably irrelevant because if someone has medically transitioned F2M they probably want to use the male toilet

No need to @ me picasso. I am not going to bother answering that question. You refuse to see that anything is wrong with your stance, so you just crack on. I am sure nothing I could say would make you remotely change your mind anyway.

Good night.

Probably irrelevant because if someone has medically transitioned F2M they probably want to use the male toilet

That's up to them ( and if men welcome them into their spaces ) however they are still female and are welcome in female spaces.

DameFanny

I'm going to assume you are being genuine. You suggest the self ID document will gatekeep single sex facilities. However for that to work trans women would need to evidence that everytime they want access. Trans people will robustly oppose that as they will say it is demeaning and outs their trans status. So we will just have to take anyones word for it.

In any case the boundaries of this are already being pushed. You say people can't switch between the two. What about travis alabanza who self Id's into women's changing rooms on the day s/he feels like a woman or Pippa bunce who self Id's as a women on Fridays and has just won an award for women in business.

What about the self ID of male born teens into the guides? Self ID into women only swimming sessions. No GRC or legal document is required they literally self identify into women only spaces.

Or the police officer who IDs as male and female on different days?

TerfsUp that one really unnerves me.

Sarahconnor1

Kyaniteah another one of those things that never happens

www.literotica.com/s/tampon-training-for-tg-women

Hackedoffwoman

I don't want to open that link do I?

Look at the comments below if you can stomach it.

Hhhmmm no thanks. Your braver than me if you read them.

It's up to you Sarah however as you say it has never happened perhaps you should.

Hackedoffwoman

You misjudged my reply I was being ironic about all the things GC women are told don't or won't happen

I got a far way down. PeakPants should read it. It might help with her stance. And don't mean her viewpoint.

This sums up my stance

archive.li/zTrKE

Sarah Sorry for mis reading your post and for the requirement of bleaching your brain if you looked at that blog!

"however they are still female and are welcome in female spaces."

So if a to all intents and purposes male/masculine looking f2m (facial hair etc, mens clothes) came in the ladies, that's ok for you?

I however would love to hear peakpants view!

Hackedoffwoman

No worries. Useful link maybe dime could read it, it helps highlight women's concerns

*So if a to all intents and purposes male/masculine looking f2m (facial hair etc, mens clothes) came in the ladies, that's ok for you?

Yep

all intents and purposes male

They are not male for all purposes! Their intents maybe.

My 'line' is that sex change is impossible and that it is rude, boundary-violating, disrepectful, selfish, deranged and a big fucking red flag about other disorders of personailty you have to cross the line and go into the spaces where your sex doesn't belong.

People who want to do this need help with their mental health and perhaps to fight as activists to get their own mixed spaces and to stop dicking the rest of the world around to suit themselves.

Hackedoffwoman I managed the first few sentences of that and gave up.

Wow, I presumed that the tampon thing was trans women with surgical vaginas, it never occurred to me that some folk would think sticking one up your bum was a feminine experience. I still doubt it's done by many. Someone mentioned sport and I feel more strongly about that than any other issue.
If you have a Y chromosome for whatever reason you compete with the men. Tough on the very very small minority of genuine intersex folk but the Y chromosome does change physiology which is why people with it competing against women win. There are lots of things you still can do with a Y chromosome but competing as an equal againstwomen without a Y chromosome shouldn't be one of them.

oh my god that link.

every day's a school day, but I did not enjoy today's lesson.

also, don't stick tampons up your bum ffs.

@PermissionToSpeakSir, well put.