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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Paris Lees just been hugely dissed live on TV

182 replies

Wobbleslikeaweeble · 15/03/2018 10:23

Ok sounds gossipy but PL is on the Wright Stuff right now and disagreed with Anne whatshername from the chase and Anne just said “you should know you used to be a boy” - huge Awkward silence.

Tbh, I don’t like Anne and her reply to Lees was harsh and unnecessary. I really don’t like PLs either to be clear. It was quite a 😱 moment.

OP posts:
AngryAttackKittens · 16/03/2018 17:54

So what? It's true.

It would be great if TRAs could admit that "rude" and "omg they hate me and want me to die!" are different things. Not holding my breath, but it would be nice.

Iamagreyhoundhearmeroar · 16/03/2018 17:59

Who was the apology actually issued to? Most of us can understand that it's a factually accurate statement so no libel/slander laws were broken?

thebewilderness · 16/03/2018 18:02

It was far too close to a personal attack for my liking, and when we get into that territory, we've lost.
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Paris Lees just been hugely dissed live on TV
Ellenripleysalienbaby · 16/03/2018 18:03

It would be great if TRAs could admit that "rude" and "omg they hate me and want me to die!" are different things.

This! Tweeting, 'you are a man, women don't have penises' is NOT 'hate speech', 'horrific abuse' or 'harrassment'. Nor does it mean that someone who writes the above wants all trans people 'exterminated' or 'wiped off the face of the planet'.

derxa · 16/03/2018 20:44

I actually phoned TWS about this. I got through and said that not everyone agreed with this apology and garbled something about infringement of women's rights. The young intern or whoever was a bit stunned but perfectly polite. I put the phone down as I was shaking. MN you have turned me into a TERF. Anne was rude but said the truth.

AngryAttackKittens · 16/03/2018 20:55

Also - a woman being rude is not somehow less acceptable than a man being rude. Women should not be held to a higher standard, and attempting to do so is sexist.

LostArt · 16/03/2018 21:02

Well done, derxa. It feels good to do something, doesn't it?

derxa · 16/03/2018 21:06

yes LostArt it does. Even if I feel a bit odd.

IhaveChillyToes · 16/03/2018 22:01

I am glad you did that DEXTRA

I was watching yesterday and today

I said to DH that I completely agreed with Anne yesterday

PL did grow up as a male

I don't understand how that fact is disputed

IhaveChillyToes · 16/03/2018 22:02

Sorry DERXA

Mouthtrousersafrocknowandthen · 16/03/2018 22:23

I can't see what is wrong with that. P Lees looks like a boy still in that piece.

I have no idea what the apology was for.

They are apologising for gendering. It's all going totally bonkers. No one knows the rules. Honestly it is now becoming hilarious. Its like an Austin Powers movie.

Milliepede · 16/03/2018 22:35

@ Mclady.
It always makes me laugh when Wrighty criticises MN, yet his researchers seem to scour the boards for topics for his show.

CadyHeron · 16/03/2018 22:36

The Wright Stuff apologised? Missed that. Really? What for?! Anne was correct, only stating facts, in context, FFS!
Really feeling uneasy about the whole not being able to state facts any more, and being labelled bigoted if you do.
Good on you derxa for ringing up.

Mouthtrousersafrocknowandthen · 16/03/2018 22:43

I've decided I'm really happy with the word bigot on this one. Words can now mean what we want. Bigot means person that talks sense in this context. Gender bullshitters are soft in the head.

LadyMcLadyCrisps · 19/03/2018 19:05

Well well well, I wonder if this is true? If so, I take back everything I said about MW.

A round of applause is needed here if this is factual!!!

www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-5518957/Matthew-Wright-embroiled-bitter-showdown.html

CadyHeron · 19/03/2018 19:30

Well done, Matthew!!! If you read the article just linked, sounds like it wasn't him who apologised, and that's why he was apparently not on on Friday as he refused to apologise as "Anne has nothing to apologise for."
Brilliant!

derxa · 19/03/2018 19:31

They are taking the . P.iss out of real women
One of the comments under the DM article. Anne Diamond presented the show and gave the apology. Twit.

Jayceedove · 19/03/2018 19:35

The point everyone is missing though is that Paris herself said she had not been offended. And not one person complained to the show.

So this was not, as being presumed, the trans agenda making them issue an apology. It was the show's own fault for presuming they would get complaints but didn't.

The only thing Paris should have been mad about is that paper aging her by decades and saying that she is 54! I would have wanted an apology for that.

AssassinatedBeauty · 19/03/2018 19:37

Ouch, 54!

Sanderz · 19/03/2018 19:41

I noticed that and I believed it!!! I was starting to think they could do truly amazing things with surgery these days

Sanderz · 19/03/2018 19:42

Which of course they can, but you know what I mean

CadyHeron · 19/03/2018 19:44

So this was not, as being presumed, the trans agenda making them issue an apology. It was the show's own fault for presuming they would get complaints but didn't

One has to ask, why are they so afraid of a backlash and complaints then...... hmm.....

Jayceedove · 19/03/2018 20:27

Cady - it has become a vicious circle fuelled by a few activists on both sides and some media sources who are playing up the divisions to create stories which they are printing every day.

The existence of the fear of retribution is causing pre-emptive action out of expectation that then creates a new story that leads to further escalation.

Remember the spat about the London train announcements last year. A trans woman objected to being mistakenly gendered by a station staff. Complained. The staff member was told not to presume gender next time.

That ought to have been the end of the matter. No publicity. No story.

But to try to defuse any anticipated future reaction from trans activists - some of which no doubt might have come - an out of proportion decision was taken to abandon all pre recorded announcements saying 'Good morning ladies and gentlemen' on the grounds that this might offend someone who is either, neither or both.

Or possibly to not offend any guide dogs travelling or Martians if they failed to include them. Not sure. In any case it was bonkers.

The point is it was a totally needless OTT reaction born out of fear of a possible backlash. Not an actual backlash.

Just as with The Mathew Wright Show.

I cannot imagine who even listens to these train announcements let alone who could possibly get annoyed at one phrase clearly not directed at any individual let alone them.

But, of course, the act plays right into the hands of the media who have that days story ready to go and endless disgusted complaint posts on line. Click bait.

I am not saying there would be no backlash or that idiots are not saying stupid things. Because some clearly are.

However, this whole mess is spiralling out of control partly because of the agenda driven not by either side but the media who are using some incident to promote themselves with very powerful consequences given the numbers involved.

ReanimatedSGB · 19/03/2018 23:34

I've heard it mentioned quite a few times that some of the people who are stirring the pot on the issue of trans rights in general are people who actually don't care about either women, feminism or trans people - their agenda is to destroy what they consider 'identity politics' and promote the idea that the only people who can be trusted in positions of power, trusted not to be silly and have bitchfights are.... heterosexual cis men. Preferably white ones.

LostArt · 20/03/2018 05:49

It's true that trans rights wouldn't get anywhere without the support of powerful men, and I do believe that if anyone is going to be blamed for this, it's going to be women's and lgb groups. I can also see that trans visibility will diminish once the media get bored of it.

But all of that doesn't mean trans are innocent victims in all of this. Many TIM are not that dissimilar to those powerful men.