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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Do you think some of the driver for "a woman is anyone who says they are a woman" is to do with bad science teaching in the US?

369 replies

QuentinSummers · 07/04/2017 11:26

Just reading this thread on Reddit and loads of the posts are very scientifically naive. I can't decide if posters are being disingenuous or are just very uneducated about basic science.
It got me wondering whether the American thing of teaching creationism as equally valid a theory as evolution has generally undermined science and critical thinking.

OP posts:

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BeyondUser24601 · 07/04/2017 13:38

"mentally-handicapped"

SS is clearly either a disablist troll or one of the kind of Americans mentioned in the OP. Not really any point engaging with either.

SSR24479 · 07/04/2017 13:39

Sexual violence and sexual assault is a gendered crime. 98% of sexual assault is committed by men. 90% of violent crime is committed by men.

Statistics. Illuminating little devils.

So statistics only matter to TERF's when it suits them. Nice. A whole new level of narcissism.

FerdinandsRevenge · 07/04/2017 13:39

Um OP. Creationism still wouldn't explain transgenderism as it's unnatural in the eyes of the religious. and No, creationism is really really not given equal time with evolution in schools!

I was raised in the south and it was never discussed in school as we have a very defined separation of church and state. Unlike the many CofE and Catholic schools located near me in the UK. We are also required to take biology in secondary school and unlike in the UK we have always been required to go to school until the age of 18.

As for reddit you'll see people bending backwards to accept trans ideology because people are stupid. In fact most of those people doing their best to bend reality will be from liberal cities where creationism isn't even whispered of.

BeyondUser24601 · 07/04/2017 13:39

(Because "handicapped" is only acceptable language in America. Everywhere else it's a disabilist slur)

SSR24479 · 07/04/2017 13:39

SS is clearly either a disablist troll or one of the kind of Americans mentioned in the OP. Not really any point engaging with either.

Good thing it's neither then!

Datun · 07/04/2017 13:40

So statistics only matter to TERF's when it suits them.

Again, no argument here.

BeyondUser24601 · 07/04/2017 13:40

As I said, handicapped is only deemed inoffensive in America. Everywhere else you might as well say retard
Oh yeah, that's acceptable in America too. Land of the free.

FerdinandsRevenge · 07/04/2017 13:41

Unfortunately even here in the UK women's health charities and shelters are using the words "self defined women". It has nothing to do with education and everything to do with people refusing to engage their (highly educated) brains.

FerdinandsRevenge · 07/04/2017 13:42

No in the UK they just say spastic.

BigDeskBob · 07/04/2017 13:42

SSR, if you are genuinely are ftt, why are you fighting MTT battles? Why aren't you demanding ftt are given man of the year awards, why aren't you questioning the lack of ftt representation on TV, in the boardroom, in male sports? Why aren't you demanding anything from men?

SirVixofVixHall · 07/04/2017 13:43

Neither of my children has (so far) decided that they are trans, but if they did, no, I wouldn't support them in believing that it is possible to actually be the opposite sex. I think that is a cruel lie. I would encourage them to accept the body that they have, and tell them that they can dress or live however they want*.
*As long as that didn't involve tie-dye, or "celtic" tatoos....

BeyondUser24601 · 07/04/2017 13:43

This reply has been deleted

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SSR24479 · 07/04/2017 13:44

70% of trans people have experienced conflict related to bathrooms

7% of women have received abuse by trans people in bathroom.

The argument seems to be 'I'm a woman! I'm fragile against the big bad men!' But that contradicts literally everything that feminism stands for. Hypocrisy at its finest, all to justify prejudice against people because you don't understand them or care enough to learn.

BeyondUser24601 · 07/04/2017 13:45

Sorry, made my thoughts a tad too explicit there - I imagine that post will be going!

Datun · 07/04/2017 13:46

SSR24479

There are numerous threads here about the trans issue. With valuable contributions from both trans-people and parents of transgender children. Why don't you read them?

You are just repeating the same old tired arguments that have been addressed countless times already.

SSR24479 · 07/04/2017 13:47

Neither of my children has (so far) decided that they are trans, but if they did, no, I wouldn't support them in believing that it is possible to actually be the opposite sex. I think that is a cruel lie. I would encourage them to accept the body that they have, and tell them that they can dress or live however they want.
As long as that didn't involve tie-dye, or "celtic" tatoos....

That's absolutely vile that'd you'd rather your child be dead or out of your life than 'different'.

Your comment doesn't even make sense, 'believing that it is possible to actually be the opposite sex'

'They can dress or live however they want'

Which one is it?

venusinscorpio · 07/04/2017 13:47

Perhaps SSR identifies as an MRA, Beyond.

SSR24479 · 07/04/2017 13:48

SSR, if you are genuinely are ftt, why are you fighting MTT battles? Why aren't you demanding ftt are given man of the year awards, why aren't you questioning the lack of ftt representation on TV, in the boardroom, in male sports? Why aren't you demanding anything from men?

If you are genuinely a woman or man, why aren't you fighting cis battles? Why aren't you demanding equal pay and diverse representation? Why are you so concerned with trans politics?

Datun · 07/04/2017 13:49

The argument seems to be 'I'm a woman! I'm fragile against the big bad men!' But that contradicts literally everything that feminism stands for.

Sigh. No it doesn't. It forms the basis of feminist argument. The inequality between the sexes because of biology.

venusinscorpio · 07/04/2017 13:49

But that contradicts literally everything that feminism stands for.

No, it really doesn't. Feminists accept that women as a class are oppressed by men as a class. This is an issue of sex, not gender identity. Feminism is a movement for the liberation of women from this oppression.

venusinscorpio · 07/04/2017 13:50

Cross post

QuentinSummers · 07/04/2017 13:51

Um OP. Creationism still wouldn't explain transgenderism as it's unnatural in the eyes of the religious. and No, creationism is really really not given equal time with evolution in schools!
Thanks ferdinand. My exposure to US school scientific teaching was based on what I've been told by a very small number of Americans so could easily be total cobblers!
I don't think creationism explains transgenderism, I think that the kind of person who has been schooled to believe that creationism is a theory equally valid to evolution would have difficulty analysing the concept of a "gender identity" as they haven't been taught those critical thinking skills. As creationism doesn't stand up to critical thinking and neither does gender identity.
Maybe more people everywhere don't think that way. I am possibly being unfair singling out Americans

OP posts:

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SSR24479 · 07/04/2017 13:51

Sigh. No it doesn't. It forms the basis of feminist argument. The inequality between the sexes because of biology.

Yeah. I don't get it? Feminism started to fight the inequality between the sexes, but now feminists use the biological inequality to victimise themselves.

venusinscorpio · 07/04/2017 13:51

If you are genuinely a woman or man, why aren't you fighting cis battles?

What? That literally doesn't make any sense.

venusinscorpio · 07/04/2017 13:52

No it does appear very much that you don't get it, SSR.

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