Another trans whine

[Milliepede]

Oh DFOD

<a class="break-all" href="http://archive.is/2017.03.29-213732/archermagazine.com.au/2017/03/terfs-gatekeeping-womanhood/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">archive.is/2017.03.29-213732/archermagazine.com.au/2017/03/terfs-gatekeeping-womanhood/

This really sums up the attitude to me. At the women's march: 'Whenever a pro-trans chant began, it was automatically reverted back to the same monotonous chant about sexism.'

If you attend an event organised to defend women's rights and try to subvert it don't be surprised when everyone else ignores you in favour of the cause they are actually there for! If you think that cause is really boring, why the hell are you there? What a dick.

Can you imagine a white dude in black face attending a black rights rally and whining because they are singing the wrong songs?

the fact that she finds the pussy hats exclusionary because they refer to a certain set of genitals is just - weird

The funny thing about the pussy hats is that (obviously) they reference Trump's "grab 'em by the pussy" speech, so presumably her real beef is with Trump for not objectifying her. Cotton ceiling anyone?

But it's so much easier to bash women for being particular about who they do and don't want to have sex with

Whenever a pro-trans chant began, it was automatically reverted back to the same monotonous chant about sexism

Protesting sexism at the Women's March when a sexual predator has been inaugurated as POTUS and reproductive rights are being destroyed. That's just monotonous. Change the fucking record!

I know right, venus? It's almost like they think they have the right to protest whatever fucking issues they like, instead of doing what someone else who has no experience of growing up female tells them!

Anybody know if there's a link between narcissistic personality disorder and AGP?

poppy

There is a well established link.

Results: The frequency of personality disorders was 81.4%. The most frequent personality disorder was narcissistic personality disorder (57.1%) and the least was borderline personality disorder. The average number of diagnoses was 3.00 per patient.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4301205/

Why do MTT have to try to co-opt feminism? They are Trans women who need their own -ism. Their struggle is real but it isn't feminism.

Sorry if this makes no sense/isn't my place to say but something else which gets to me about those who shout about "TERFs" a lot which is also touched upon in that piece is throwing in "white cis feminist" into the group they're deriding. This seems like they're trying to suggest WOC must be on the side of TRAs or that disputing the "anyone who defines as a woman is a woman" line is the preserve of "white feminists", insinuating those who do so are also racist. This was brought up to me by one of my best friends, who is a WOC and is one of the only people I talk openly about the trans issue with (and who agrees with me/most posters on here on it) - sort of trying to co-opt WOC and conflate it with their cause.

Again apologies if this is misguided or not relevant but it's something my aforementioned friend and I have noticed happening a fair bit.

Maybe he should have crocheted himself a big pink dick hat to fit in better at the women's march

Should have read the entire article before posting that as I don't think my comments are wholly relevant to this actually, sorry.

I agree. There's an assumption that 'intersectional' feminism covers all bases and that black feminists are on the same team as TRAs.

I've no doubt there's a crossover, but when TRAs use white as an insult it's a bit worrying.

You know what? I'm okay with centering the trans. Let's all declare some butch lesbians transmen at the next march (actual butch lesbians, not anyone who took testosterone. Don't want to have them be mistaken for cismen, right?) and centre them.
And call it "Pussy March".

That should be trans-inclusive enough, right?

... only that, of course not, because in fact, it is all about men, men, men, men, men. The male kind of man.

But I'd still like to try.

For extra confusion, why not invite someone like Peach Yoghurt to perform in drag? She's not a cis-transwoman, but a trans-transwoman, and to my knowledge only lives as transwoman part-time whenever she makes her videos, but hey, let's not be trans-exclusive.

Hi IAmAmy
MTTs have totally hijacked intersectional feminism and believe that they are lower down the privilege gradient than WOC who are oppressed both for 'race' and sex.
Their reasoning is that they are oppressed both I kid you not as women and as trans, this reasoning is that trans people face worse oppression than POC or women. So these white, middle-classed men get to say that they are the most oppressed group of all.
Sadly I have heard this supported by WOC - (at least fairly convincingly claiming to be online) - who say they understand the whole feeling of 'trying to pass' as white and how this is what it is like as trans.

Morris Indeed. I've noticed that from those I know who call themselves "intersectional feminists", they conflate all those groups and see them as intrinsic to one another. Then basically everyone else is a "white feminist" (even if most of those using this term seem to be white).

GuardianLions that's what I was thinking. As far as I know, intersectional feminism was coined (if that's the right term) by a WOC and created as a very important way of ensuring WOC were centred in feminism. Now as you say, MTTs have hijacked it and taken it as their own, demanding they be centred and in my opinion using the "white cis feminist" insult to infer WOC are by default on their "side" and that those who don't agree with the trans mantra are also racist.

I suppose just as some white "cis" feminists go along with it (the majority of those I know unfortunately), some WOC will, but I think many feel the same as my friend, that this is quite an insulting inference.

I've read quite a few articles written about trans women on how they felt excluded when they went on the women's march -whether that be because there weren't enough trans women speakers (actually there seem to have been proportionally a lot of trans women speakers given how few people are trans) or because there was too much focus on uteruses and pussies.
I mean this march was in protest of a president who boasts about groping pussies and who has made it nigh impossible for many, many women to now get an abortion. But no, our reproductive systems are apparently irrelevant to womanhood... It's just a shame most women don't have the luxury of believing that.
Bleeding monthly, living with the risk of unwanted pregnancy which we may or may not be able to terminate depending on the whim of whichever man happens to be in power at the time, and having our genitals grabbed by people much stronger than us is what most of us will experience, and the idea of playing that down so women with penises don't feel excluded is frankly crazy.
It was a sodding march! It wasn't a dinner party where we go out of our way to make sure all guests feel welcome and where we know, for example, if a friend is going through a 5th round of IVF, that we'll probably tread sensitively around the area of reproduction. It was a march to address women's issues. If you truly are a 'real woman' then stand alongside the other women for whom this is an issue -even if it isn't for you.
Does anyone else get the idea that iris lee wanted to feel excluded? I mean the hat -feminism without trans women isn't feminism, or something like that. It's confrontational. It's already trying to control what feminism is rather than just going in there and trying to learn what it's about. Iris was already trying to make it all about them before they even got to the march.

ProcastinatingSquid2 I concur entirely with your post.

It's just so terrible isn't it. I mean imagine if men were the 'gatekeepers of manhood' and thought they were more manly than say, a woman?

Why, there would be outrage!

Does anyone else get the idea that iris lee wanted to feel excluded?

Yes in fact the Green Day lyrics came to mind.

"Minority"

I want to be the minority
I don't need your authority
Down with the moral majority
'Cause I want to be the minority

I pledge allegiance to the underworld
One nation underdog
There of which I stand alone
A face in the crowd
Unsung, against the mold
Without a doubt
Singled out
The only way I know

'Cause I want to be the minority
I don't need your authority
Down with the moral majority
'Cause I want to be the minority

the hat -feminism without trans women isn't feminism, or something like that. It's confrontational
Exactly - its like they get a perverted kick out of confronting and sparring with women and satisfy a very male primal urge to dominate women which is generally made taboo by male socialisation's adages like 'pick on someone your own size', 'boys should never pick on girls', 'be a gentleman', treat a woman like a lady' etc. They can only get away with seeking out and being so blatantly domineering of women by putting on a dress and unconvincingly feigning female vulnerablity.

Goodpie, yeah, it's almost a desire to be one of the victims, isn't it? I do wonder if some people who are trans kind of embrace a victim narrative, and become extremely uncomfortable when suddenly they're not the ones who are being oppressed/victimised. They then have to try and centre themselves as the victims again -in this case, by making out that the women are the oppressors. There seems to be this desperate attempt to stop women talking about anything that not only highlights that they are biological women but also everything that makes them vulnerable which trans women, due to biology, can't go, "Yeah, me too!" to.

It was a sodding march! It wasn't a dinner party where we go out of our way to make sure all guests feel welcome and where we know, for example, if a friend is going through a 5th round of IVF, that we'll probably tread sensitively around the area of reproduction. It was a march to address women's issues. If you truly are a 'real woman' then stand alongside the other women for whom this is an issue -even if it isn't for you.

Transactivists don't actually believe they are women, though. It is very obvious in their activism. If they actually felt like women, then they'd not clamour to take away women's rights.

Just tried to ask some simple questions on Twitter of someone writing pro-trans stuff and got put thoroughly in my place for being a terf. I feel pretty done with social media now. I feel very alone. I may as well have announced I love Theresa May and can't wait for Brexit.