America would rather be led by someone who boasts of assaulting women, than a woman

[noblegiraffe]

And some people think we don't need feminism any more.

Why does he need to prove his innocence? Whatever happened to "innocent until proven guilty"?

Seriously?

What part of he has admitted to sexually assaulting women are you having trouble understanding?

Person wears stupid t shirt has zero to do with anything.

i said it on another thread but I'll say it again for any US MNers - if you are a woman and you don't want kids, or don't want any more kids, get sterilised while you still can. You won't have any abortion rights very soon.

Is that possible in the US? I mean, I have heard from lots of people that they were refused this on the grounds of "You will want to have babies in the future!", even women as old as 35 ... and then women over that age were told to just wait until menopause.
Or is the US similarly liberal with that as with cosmetic surgery?

Pretending to be trans and getting a "gender reassignment surgery" would probably be a safer bet in many countries. Though of course that would mean you have to have all your bits removed, which is not good for health.

Not quite yonic, I don't imagine it was a t-shirt you just could buy off the shelf...

Err, so?

It really is amazing isn't it? Even when a man admits to sexually assaulting a woman there will still be people defending him and claiming the woman is a liar, it didn't happen and she's making the whole thing up.

It reminds me of what happened to Katie Koestner back in the 90's. The man who raped her admitted that she had said no and that she didn't want to have sex with him but he went ahead and did it anyway yet people still sided with him and called her a liar.

Yet people still insist that as soon as a woman makes an allegation against a man then that's it; she's automatically believed and his life is automatically ruined. Bizarre.

People are sick of politicians. Trump isn't one. It's more to do with that than gender.

Being sick of politicians doesn't mean you are not making a racist, misogynist choice when you vote for a fascist sexual predator because he is "not a politician".

Abortion won't suddenly become illegal and there won't be a war. He'll be absorbed into the system like they all are and he won't have total dictation on everything.
In fact he's probably bricking it now and will calm down.

If you hate politicians as much as they do you will overlook all of his talk, as he's proven it to be bollocks anyway so many times. They know he's a shit stirrer and not a politician.

Yeah, you can really see how much he has been absorbed by the system since he became a part of it.

It's really toned him down.

If you overlook his racist and misogynist talk and vote for him anyway, then you are being a racist and a misogynist.

You don't et to elect a fascist and then whine that youbwere just having a tantrum.

That's why we don't let toddlers vote.

Clinton made a choice to stand by her husband - it's not a choice I particularly like but it's a choice hundreds if not thousands of women make every day - just look at the relationships board. She chose to prioritise her family and lifestyle over her pride and self-esteem. Like I say, not pretty but hardly illegal - and the person it hurt most was probably herself.

Likewise the actual ins and outs of the criminal justice system aren't pretty - and while I abhor the way victims of sexual abuse are treated in a trial, she was a defence lawyer defending her client.

That doesn't compare to the things Trump has admitted to: he's a sexula predator, she's a woman who stood by her man and was very good at being a defence lawyer.

'They fucking hate us don't they? '

Oh I wouldn't say that - we're very useful in many ways. Cleaning, bringing in extra money, making life comfortable, sex on tap. Some of us are quite decorative and free to grope.

I think as long as we put up and shut up and know our place most will tolerate us with just a little light contempt.

Fascism is on the rise. It's a consequence of 2008 and never ending battle since.
Throughout history when people have been subject to crisis, mass unemployment, austerity, people start to move to the populist far right.
We're seeing it in the UK, In Europe, now the USA. Don't blame the voters, blame the decisions made by those in power leading to this monumental shit storm. Blame the people trump is blaming. The bankers. The establishment. The elites.

Doin He hadn't been absorbed yet you realise. He's only had half a day. He bet on Clinton too.

Like Brexit, calm down, I'm sure it'll all be OK.

doinit excellent post.

Oh, is Brexit going ok then? Given that it hasn't actually happened yet?

Fascism is on the rise to the extent that a fascist has just been elected the President of the world's most powerful country, but we should calm down because nothing bad ever happens when fascists come to power.

'and the person it hurt most was probably herself. '

Dear lord, you can say that again. I feel absolutely sick for her. The years, decades of being blamed for her husband's behaviour, the humiliation of Bill's rotten behaviour, people apparently thinking that her and Bill are the same person, insisting she wasn't good enough, was crooked, was too short, too fat, too dumpy, had awful dress sense, was a liar and she took it all on the chin. People insisting that a woman was not fit to be President. Fighting it all, keeping her head down, grafting, tunnelling through shit, grafting some more, showing up to the 9 / 11 memorial with raging pneumonia on a hot New York day and still being crucified for it, listening to the non-stop nastiness from Trump and his supporters. It has been endless. I felt nauseous after watching the second debate, with him interrupting her and prowling around behind her. Yes, she's had nearly 70 years of practice at dealing with this kind of shit but it surely has to take it out of you. It must feel like it was all for nothing. Devastated for her and all of her supporters

Vestal - my (limited) knowledge is that getting sterilised in the US is difficult, yes, just as it is here. But that's even more reason - start consultation now because it could take time to find someone to agree.

Fucking hell, if I was living in the US now I'd be so fucked off. I'm obviously hugely fucked off as it is. I realise the 2 candidates weren't great choices but seriously....!

If these fascit throwbacks really were interested in a "strong man" rather than a swaggering racist bully, they woukd have cast their vote for the toughest candidate here has ever been.

Hillary Clinton is nails hard.

She has come through years of abuse to get where she is and she never gave up.

Sarah Ditum (Independent journalist) on the radio just described the US election as 'a referendum on the place of women in public life'. And the result couldn't be clearer. So true, so depressing.

Great posts Lottie.

If anyone is even slightly unsure of what Trump thinks of women, there's a list of his more offensive comments here. Warning, it is a very long document.
www.telegraph.co.uk/women/politics/donald-trump-sexism-tracker-every-offensive-comment-in-one-place/

And people saying 'well, Hillary was awful so I had to vote for Trump even though he's a racist misogynist arsehole' are lying. There were other candidates on the ballot.