Feminist Pub XXI - The Pub with No Name

[erinaceus]

Welcome, everybody.

Happy Friday.

Hi, I've not been in the pub for ages but it looks nice in here.

I hate the sexism associated with weddings. People were shocked at my wedding that I walked in with the groom, nobody gave me away, even though my dad was available. Loads of women took my answer of "I'm not a possession to be given away" to be personally insulting about their choices at their own weddings. I got very sick of defending my choice not to change my name too "what's the point of getting married if you're not going to change your name?"

I suppose this is one reason why it would be good for civil partnerships to be available to hetero couples, removing the cultural expectations and not the same direct comparisons.

Someone else had to point out to me that my not having of bridesmaids might offend other people who had chosen to have them, which I found strange. I also got a lot of "wasn't your dad upset?" because my DF did not walk me down the aisle, to which the answer was, no, I talked about it with my DF beforehand.

The best was the bloke in the pub who wanted to phone my DH up and give him what for because I did not have a ring, despite neither DH nor I wanting rings .

It is one of the things that I am sad about out our marriage ceremony, that we got married just before same-sex marriages were made legal, making my own wedding the last one I went to where the wording referred to one-man-one-woman; by the following summer the wording referred to two people. But I am lucky enough not to need to time my life choices around the law on this issue, and I suppose it is part of history, just as when mothers' names are added to marriage certificates mine will always only have my DF's and DFIL's names and occupations and my DM and DMIL as witnesses. It is part of history.

What do children of same-sex parents do about putting their DFs names and occupations on marriage certificates? This must have come up by now, surely?

I changed my name and I was given away. I got married before my feminism lightbulb went on. I have toyed with changing my name back, but I'm happy as I am, for now (I don't work so have no 'identify' tied to my parents' name)
I have started using Ms instead of Mrs though

I'll drink anything btw...

I don't like beer, whisky or anything aniseed-y, but I'll drink them if they're offered.

I am partial to a blue wkd

I had a very trad wedding - it was back when it was either a church or a registry office, and the latter was unheard of in either of our families. No 'obey' at least!

We are not married so we get constantly asked when he'll make an"honest woman" out of me I'm pretty fucking honest already thank you very much

Rebel Perhaps you should start conning your friends and family out of large sums of money. Then you can buy us all drinks.

I remember when DH and were about to get our first joint mortgage, after we were married, as we were buying our first home. A colleague commented that we would be "properly married now".

Will I never be "properly married" without a mortgage then?! Oh noes!!

So you are not "properly married" unless:

• you get a joint mortgage.
• you change your name to your husband's.
• you wear a ring.

What else must one do?

i can't wait this friday

BeyondASpecialSnowflake I did give my colleague short shrift about that one. DH and I are married. We have the paperwork to prove it.

I hate that fil is named on my wedding certificate. Dh doesn't see him, his parents divorced when dh was 18 and his dad hasn't done more than Christmas cards since then, whereas his mum is amazing yet she is "just" a witness.

Tbh, most of the sexist crap was coming from my immediate family. I would have loved to be brutally honest, but I have a fraught relationship with my dad and step-mum so decided keeping quiet was the best option. DBro was great tho - we get on dead well and he generally agrees when I go on a feminist rant at him. He kept winking at me and smirking through dinner so I managed to keep my comments lighthearted.

Work yesterday was annoying too - my boss announced the outcome of the Poldark trial at an after school meeting when I hadn't watched it yet! Apparently he needed to mention it "so the women don't feel left out" after talking about rugby. (I love rugby btw.) Yet another work meeting where he was unable to talk for more than 5 minutes without making some reference to how men and women are just soooo different.

Is there away around it? Can one write "not worth the ink" under "Father" on a marriage certificate? Not that I would do this. In my case, I am happy to have both DF and DFil on there; I also do see that it is part of the family record, historical record and so on. I do think that the sooner mothers' details are added to marriage certificates the better. I hope that it comes in my lifetime.

If one rebelled in this way (wrote "my mother did it all" under "Father" or something) would that invalidate the marriage, never mind the joint mortgages and wot-not? Just curious.

I assume that annotating an official doc is a problem? It's a good question, and Google is unforthcoming on the topic...

Has anyone seen this? Some fascinating possible implications re bodily autonomy, reproductive freedom, body shaming etc in terms of women's health.

Just what did you google sentia?

I tried things like "UK official documents invalidate" and "UK certificate annotated" and "Can I invalidate my marriage certificate by writing on it" and so on. I didn't get anything that answered the question though 😕

The registrar writes the certificate I believe, the couple getting married only seem to be allowed to sign it. That's why you have to have a meeting with them beforehand, so you can do all that stuff and they know what needs to be on the certificate before the day. Plus checking that it's a proper marriage rather than just for immigration purposes or a forced marriage (dh and I almost failed this check as he couldn't remember my middle name and I couldn't remember his birthday )

So what happens if you say something untrue to the registrar, vis à vis your father and their occupation? Is the subsequent marriage - if there is one - null and void? There is probably at least one registrar on MN. We could try to find the answer to this thorny issue.

For today though, it's been a long day. Nearly Friday.

NB: The Bluestocking is open 24/7, please do not let the goat on the bouncy castle.

sentia - was that the link you meant to post? It's about the 'rubber hand illusion' - fascinating stuff but I dont see the relevance to the subjects you mentioned.

I'm pretty sure you can put a step-father's name instead of biological father provided he is married to your mother. But I was told I definitely wouldn't be allowed my mother. Another reason I'm glad I didn't get married - why should my step-dad be given more prominence than my mother?!

Yes, in the context of this. I'll be the first to admit I may not fully understand the full implications (or lack of), I just thought it was a fascinating potential connection and not one I was aware of.

I gather that the basic point is that what you believe about your body can actually become how you experience your body.