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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminist Pub XXI - The Pub with No Name

796 replies

erinaceus · 09/09/2016 12:22

Welcome, everybody.

Happy Friday.

OP posts:
QuentinSummers · 01/05/2017 21:14

It's OK errol. guardian won the thread so it's amusing rather than annoying now. Cheers Wine

GuardianLions · 01/05/2017 21:18

Thanks Quentin Wine

Tartle · 01/05/2017 21:18

She's certainly did. Cheers to all WineGinGinWine

OlennasWimple · 02/05/2017 21:12

Anyone want some light reading? Try this REddit thread - my favourite post so far is:

This is something I have very real experiences with. I've had multiple female partners who at first were extremely welcoming of being trans, but when it came down to it, made extremely cis-centric comments about what it is to be a woman, effectively erasing my womanhood, and in a lot of ways, my existence as a woman.

It has been very difficult to deal with this. To continue on, fighting against the thought that I'm some kind of poser, that I'm some kind of extreme mysoginist that is using my male body to undermine womanhood. That I'm some sort of abberation and threat to womanhood because of my male body, that I am not now and will never be a real woman.

First off I would like to start from a position of compassion, with the recognition that there is significant trauma in the female body experience that is caused by masculinity and those with a male body; not only individually, but as a historic socio-cultural experience. As much as we are women as well, the experience of women with a female body is unique.

That being said, we don't enjoy the privilege of having being born with a female body to define our womanhood, and our experience of being women is unique and valid as well. We must actively fight against and reject our inborn masculinity in order to even be seen by cis women as being worthy of being women. For a lot of people, this is HRT.
As much as HRT and physical alterations help us become the women we feel like internally, externally; our womanhood is not defined by conformity to the female ideal of womanhood, much of which is defined and shaped by historical misogyny. Our womanhood is internal, it comes from who we are, what we feel like, the deep disonnance with being a man, and masculinity. We do not get our 'membership' into womanhood from the cis female identity, but from ourselves.

This helps get me through the tough days. That thinking of myself as a woman brings me real happiness. That the more I get to know myself and undertake the sometimes violent internal ripping of ingrained masculinity from my consciousness, the more alive I feel. I go from a tin man with rusted joints, struggling to move and feel in my body to a dancer - feminine, alive, free, vibrant, and loving.
This is my personal experience and how I have dealt with what you touched on, hope it can help in some small way.

You are the woman you feel like.

OlennasWimple · 02/05/2017 21:16

Though I'm thinking of starting a file of posts like this for when pp tell us that there is no such thing as AGP...

GuardianLions · 03/05/2017 16:36

Oleannas

I just came to the pub a bit early because I need some Gin I clicked on your link and then saw this:

"Even when I was like 8 months in and buying my first bras, I was erect the entire time. It's hot to be yourself."

Now I think I need Gin Gin Wine .... to suppress my erection for feeling so hot being myself...

OlennasWimple · 03/05/2017 16:44
Grin

I really don't know how women manage to get anything done at all, what with being permanently aroused by being ourselves

ChocChocPorridge · 03/05/2017 16:58

I'm normally strong of stomach, totally able to be detatched, but I was actually disgusted by this one - I've no desire to read any further than the first few posts - it's a group of male 'lesbians' discussing the issue with only being attracted to women, but also finding the idea of degrading sex with men a turn on. You'll note that it's from a 'lesbian' sub - not that any of these people are lesbians, but I'm sure there's an extra thrill taking over a (supposedly - I think it's pretty much completely converted away from women now) lesbian space to talk about it.

more_agp

OlennasWimple · 03/05/2017 17:17

Urgh.

That's REALLY hot. I've never met a lesbian or even personally met a straight girl who feels this way and I fucking love this too - wonder why that is, mate?

Oh yeah, because enjoying degrading sex with women is a particularly male and misogynist kink. And shows us what they really think of us

NeverEverAnythingEver · 05/05/2017 16:33

Hello!

Haven't been here for ages! I'm missing out on interesting stuff, I see.

Tartle · 07/05/2017 03:55

Oh god this shit is fucked up. That thread makes me feel sick in my own mouth. Ugh!

But AGP isn't real Hmm

StHeathensGrammar · 29/05/2017 12:42

Ooh, it's quiet in here.

Just popped in to air a random though I had. Something on another thread made me think... It was about non-binary potentially being offered as a gender option on driving licences. Someone pointed out that surely the sex on official documents is supposed to actually help idenitfy the person.

When the police arrest someone, they write down a description of the person - distinguishing features etc....
I was just pondering what they write for TiMs? Presumably the pretence doesn't continue there?!

Datun · 02/06/2017 00:29

StHeathensGrammar

As far as I know, if the person is legally a woman, they will say they are looking for a woman. There was a case recently of a transwoman who had discarded all their feminine clothes to present as a man again.

The report said they were looking for a woman dressed as a man...

ChocChocPorridge · 09/06/2017 17:53

On the hunt for more info on DUP following today's events, I went pink and read the FT's article on it www.ft.com/content/0fa04ca8-4d07-11e7-a3f4-c742b9791d43

I'm having trouble figuring out how this is a good move for the conservatives given the DUP's policies, rather than just a desparate grab for power, and it can only be even worse for the women of NI to have the DUP's policies reinforced by being part of a coalition government? Or will it be the kiss of death as it was for the Liberal Democrats? Will bringing their anti-woman, anti-gay stance into the sunlight actually do some good?

BasketOfDeplorables · 11/06/2017 18:47

I can't imagine it's good for either of them. The DUP toxify the Torres, and being in this arrangement will mean more media attention on the DUP, and I imagine a lot of shady stuff will come to light.

BasketOfDeplorables · 11/06/2017 18:53

I'm loveing the autocorrect from Tories to Torres!

VestalVirgin · 15/06/2017 21:15

The transidiocy has reached Germany. A major German newspaper made a several pages article about it that was almost entirely anti-woman and pro-trans, with the author only acknowledging reluctantly that no, women aren't going to be happy about this nonsense. (But actually just pretending it was about gender working just fine for most people so they don't want it changed, which is utter nonsense.)

I got so angry I would almost have broken my hand hitting the table.

And the worst is, I don't even dare writing to them because we all know how dangerous and violent the male translobby is.

... also, about a fifth of the people I know online identify as agender (despite obviously being women) and two of them already harm their bodies because of it.

This makes me so fucking angry!

QuentinSummers · 06/07/2017 22:42

Just cleaning the cobwebs out and making some pimms

SilverdaleGlen · 06/07/2017 23:10

Oh thank you I can post here safely ☺️

I've been on in various guises over the last 3 years since DH had a breakdown and turned from normal man to financially destructive, lying, emotionally draining person (crib notes), I stopped posting when he came on and read everything 😔 We split up a year ago formally, haven't lived together for 2 but I've held out for him that whole time thinking we'll get better. He however has had dates and met up with a woman while we were still together though days all innocent. Things have been getting better so I was seesawing but spoke to him last week and said I was a bit yes (kids together, we get on etc.) and a bit no (trust issues, financial destruction, emotional manipulation) and he basically said I was giving false hope but he didn't trust me or want to live here any way. Parted as friends, great.

Over the weekend I got drunk and had a stupid inappropriate conversation with a man I met online on the phone who I genuinely like. This is the ONLY thing that changed. Now ex has flipped, says im a liar, he know she things about me, I am the one who has messed with his head, he hates me, wants nothing to do with me and has gone totally no contact, we have 3 young DC.

I have NO IDEA how or if that's what he knows? Also I panicked spoke to a family mediator who then texted him by accident Angry and he called straight back and said "don't tell people I bugged your house". I didn't tell anyone that other than the people on the phone and my best friend. There were other bits and bobs like he's been through my solicitors emails and synced my phone to my iPad which was with him. I ended up apologising for what I said to the solicitor.

I guess I need support not to contact him. I really like this other person (though my friend says he's a creep) but darent meet him in case he's actually a plant by ex. I darent speak on the phone, have changed my locks and wifi (the password had been changed), it's all just weird. Yet inside all there is is a desire to "behave" stop talking to other man, try to get hold of ex and apologise, though I don't know what for as he wouldn't say just "you are a liar and I know things about you" but what? Why can't I defend myself? Why not just tell me?

I'm worried he's angry, I'm worried he's alone and feeling depressed. I feel guilty I acted in a way that will have hurt him. I'm paranoid my best friend has told him as she's been meeting him in secret and he's lied to me about this (she told me she sees him they are friends). I can focus on work. I can't sleep.

Ok that's long and rambling and I feel scared even now he'll see this and I'll hurt him again saying bad things Sad

ISaySteadyOn · 07/07/2017 06:46

Flowers I am sorry that is happening to you. Bumping thread so maybe some more knowledgeable members might have advice.

QuentinSummers · 07/07/2017 08:07

Oh that sounds scary silver
I think he had bugged your house, as they say on relationships "when someone tells you what they are, listen".
I would borrow someone else's phone and call the police from outside your house, tell them you think your husband bugged it. Alternatively there could be private security firms that can check your house is clean.
Please don't get back with this man. This isn't normal behaviour and you deserve better. It's not you feeling guilty, it's that you are scared and trying to make it better by trying to be in control of why it happened. But you aren't.

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