Female body hair / husband- help?

[wishfulthinking1]

Since the birth of my son I've considered feminist issues much more deeply- particularly inspired by 'hair:not the musical', I've begun considering hair removal as a choice- and have chosen not to at the the moment.

My lovely husband (and he really is lovely) is struggling with this- says he doesn't find it attractive / is embarrassed when we go swimming etc- he doesn't mean to be ignorant, but he's really struggling with it.

I'm trying to find something for him to read that could help him get his head around it. Most internet searches come up with articles along the lines of 'eww, gross, if your partner loved you, she'd shave blah blah'.

Does anyone have any advice?
Thanks

Branleuse, the whole argument behind feminism is that society's expectations of women are harmful.

Shaving is not an optional activity. If it were, then when you go to the beach you would see at least some women going around with hairy legs, pits and bikini area. You just don't see that. Shaving is expected, it is the minimum you are required to do in order to be "beach ready." Of course, you're also supposed to be thin, tanned, toned, etc etc.

The culture around shaving is harmful because, along with all the other standards women are required to meet, it says to women that their natural, normal bodies aren't good enough, they need to be modified, changed, brought under control. Women's time and effort are taken up trying to meet these standards, when in fact even if they do meet them, they will still be criticised for something.

It is very rare for a woman to be happy with her body just how it is. And that is not the situation I want my daughter to grow up in.

I don't shave my eyebrows off because I don't wear clothes on my eyebrows, so how would I feel the smoothness? I just don't enjoy the feeling of hairy legs! I already said why I don't shave my head - I enjoy dying my hair and styling it so why would I shave it off?

Again - I never said nobody shaves because they are influenced, I said I personally don't so it for those reasons.

So you entirely came up with the idea to shave all by yourself, out of the blue? You never saw a single ad for razors, never saw other women with smooth legs, never discussed it with friends?

Luckily it just happens that the kind of grooming you personally prefer happens to coincide with the standards usually expected of women in our society, although i know you personally don't care about that.

My mums legs are naturally very smooth and hairless and when mine started to get hairy I wanted that smooth feeling back, worked out that could be achieved through shaving.

No, never discussed it with friends as most of my friends have always been male and they wouldn't have noticed nor cared if I turned up with a beard tbh. Not sure about ads for razors. Often seen articles etc about waxing and that it's "better" than shaving somehow, but never bothered with it.

Do you actually read posts or just pick the bits you want? I have already said I have practically no hair on my arms to start with so they are already smooth! Hence why exfoliation is enough. It wouldn't be enough on my legs because they get a full blown bloody carpet on them if I leave them, so exfoliation would do nothing! Why is that so hard to grasp? I have already said I agree some women do things to conform, I just personally don't. Read the posts!

So you, as a teenager, suddenly discovered you could shave? No one told you about razors, or showed you how to use them, it just came to you suddenly like a bolt out of the blue?

Cailindana, no I saw my dad using them for his facial hair and asked my mum about them.

MyEmpire I'm not disagreeing with you though, I already said some women do it for those reasons - I'm not disputing that at all. I'm disputing the fact you're telling me you know my mind better than I do!

So seeing your dad shave was the one and only time it ever occurred to you that you could shave your legs? You never realised other women shave, or saw other women/girls with shaved legs before that? It just suddenly occurred to you, out of the blue, that you could shave your legs and it was just total coincidence that practically every other woman in your country does exactly the same thing?

"I don't shave my eyebrows off because I don't wear clothes on my eyebrows, so how would I feel the smoothness?"

Really? Sorry, that has to be the single most bonkers piece of grasping at straws in an attempt to shore up one's position that I've ever read.

Look, I don't care which hair you remove and which you leave be, and what you think your own reasons are for doing that - the fact is that other people police women's hair removal in a way that they just don't with men. That's what this thread is about.

FWIW OP, I have been trying to shave much less frequently since I had DS, because I want to create a world where hair removal is seen as optional, is a genuine free choice (in the way Blueberry seems to believe it already is). I don't want him to grow into a teenager who passes remarks on the girls at school's hairy legs. Of course, it may go the other way, I may leave him with a phobia . But at least I'm trying to undermine the bloody cultural process.

Why is it such an issue for you that I shave my legs?! That's like me asking you when did it occur to you to wear deodorant or brush your hair.

The conversation has completely veered off track.

OP, your husband will get used to it. He will love you hairy or hairless and you will be teaching your son the values in which you want him to have. It's entirely your business and your business alone if you wish to remove hair or leave it be. If you realised you were only shaving to please society then good on you for making the decision to change that, it is a great example to set for your children and I wish you every happiness in your hairy venture

It hasn't veered off track, op posted it in the feminism section and has stated that she thinks it's a feminist issue! I don't care if you shave your legs, I shave mine occasionally. And now I think I personally will have to agree to disagree with you Blueberry

Liurcio why is it bonkers? I already explained many times that the reason I like to have smooth legs etc is mostly to do with the fact I like the way it feels when I wear my clothes - it feels smooth. Armpit hair, I don't like the way deodorant makes it sticky and I don't seem to get that problem when I have no armpit hair. I have no reason whatsoever to shave my eyebrows. I can't remember the last time I touched my eyebrows..

I have no problem with you shaving your legs Blueberry. I shave my legs from time to time. What I have a problem with is you claiming you shave your legs because of divine inspiration (or something) while everyone else does it because of society. It makes no sense.

This is a feminist discussion. Part of the feminist viewpoint is that women are informed, influenced and controlled by culture. So it makes sense that we would challenge your argument that you somehow escaped that influence and yet at the same time made exactly the same decision as millions of other women.

the trouble with these sorts of threads is that instead of actually helping the OP by answering her questions or empathising and exploring the expectations placed on women by society that are far and away more than those placed on men, the whole thread gets taken up reassuring women who do conform to society's expectations that yes, they can be feminists too

and i say this as a feminist who depilates. not all the time, but when i have to expose the usual flesh that is expected to be hair-free i will usually conform. because i am not immune to the pressures of expectations placed on women, and i am not always brave enough to challenge it

I've had blue hair, before it was fashionable in an ultra conservative area. It gets the odd look but it's no where near the same as not playing the femininity game.

No one is saying you doing chores or wearning makeup or shaving your legs doesn't make you a feminist. Just that is impossible for you to pretend you live in a bubble. Or that you are such a cool girl and so not like those other girls that you are uniquely unaffected by the rest of the world.

It is impossible for you to categorically state you would do or not do something no matter where you lived because you can't prove or know it. Because you did grow up in this society.

Most peoples natural bodies arent seen as ok by themselves though are they, thats why we wash and comb our hair and wear clothes that make us feel we fit into society. If you want to be more individualist then of course you can go against the grain in anyway you like. OPs husband doesnt find it sexy, and finds it actually embarrassing so its up to her if thats a price worth paying. Ive always known lots of women who dont shave all my life, including my mum, so i dont really identify with it being something expected. Its just a choice

FuckOffFerret I'm under no illusion that I'm not influenced by society in any way - I wear make up in a certain way because I've seen it in on the TV etc, and I lose weight because society says attractive = thin. I'm under no illusion whatsoever that I am completely unaffected by society and culture. However the reason I shave my legs etc is not because I'm scared of what people would think of I didn't, and not because all the slebs do it, but because I personally find it more comfortable being smooth.

Surely the smooth feeling is more pronounced the longer you leave it between shaves?

You've actually got a point there YonicScrewdriver this thread makes me sound like some smooth obsessed weirdo ha! I'm not I swear I'm just crap at getting my point across. And I'm pregnant. And hormonal. And in a shit mood

OP, I just want you to know that you are not alone in feeling a bit uncomfortable about not shaving, but not shaving anyway. I don't shave either becaus a) I am dyspraxic and it is an irritating faff and b) I want all my children to see it is ok, but I do feel a bit odd about it.

As to the rest of the thread, I am going to leave this here.

terrariamum