Is sexual orientation a choice?

[WidowWadman]

Julie Bindel seems to think so.

Is it just me or is that actually fairly offensive?

Eats, you said this at 11:39 - 'It is the right thing to do. Women should have their needs met in society too. It would be selfish if I wanted women to be in a better position than men - I don't. '

So if you don't want women to have it better than men, you want them to be equal don't you? How is that not equality then?

The reason I talk about the liberation of women rather than equality is because talking about equality inevitably ends up focussing on men rather than women. Feminism is about women. Also equality is a bit of a misnomer. There are differences between men and women - women give birth, can breastfeed, etc - so women do need some things in society to be different to accommodate their needs.

The focus in feminism is very much is on women and a liberation from attitudes towards them towards an equal role and place in society, as far as I see it.

I also see a freeing from gender expectations of women as a natural part of this. Separate to this is a freeing from gender expectations of men as well - separate to feminism but in someway inexorably linked as liberation of women requires men to free themselves from gender expectations of how men are supposed to behave.

Right-o.

Men will get some benefits from women's liberation in terms of gender roles/expectations. But women's liberation does not exist to benefit men, it is about benefitting women

namechangeguy what is your point?

Your posts come across as being harassing to EatsBrainsAndLeaves.

And that strikes me as highly inappropriate given the context. (I'll spell it out to you - as a man addressing a woman on feminist issues).

HTH.

I'd go on step further and say it's about benefitting society and making society a better place.

It does not exist to benefit men - but men will benefit (well some men :) ). Women will benefit.

Ultimately society benefits in the long run.

have not read thread (just scrolled for a thousand miles to get to the bottom) but wondered if anyone had seen the studies about 'gay faces', apparently is in journal of nonverbal behaviour?

Yes you are right, society will in general be a lot better.

No Alameda - what is that?

Eats, if I am harassing you in any way I will shut up right now. Please let me know either way.

about the perception/categorisation of male sexual orientation - from facial features, it was quite accurate apparently

obvs do not subscribe to that journal myself

I would be interested to read that.

namechange - You tell me, are you harassing me?

Eats, I am referring to Beachcomber's post at 23:36 last night. She feels I am. I do not, but it's important that you don't feel harassed by me, as it's a serious point. Please let me know how you feel. For what it's worth, I was enjoying our discussion.

No I didn't fel harassed. but i asked the question to you in case Beach wasd seeing something I hadn't seen - so that is why I asked the question

Brilliant. Thank you for letting me know.