Opinions may Vary . A genuine question about why Meghan and Harry seem to attract such differing views.

[BasiliskStare]

I post this more in hope than experience but I would be really interested in a proper discussion about those who are fans or supporters of them , those who aren't and indeed ( of which there are many ) , those who are indifferent.

So - I'll start. There was an interesting post on another thread which said M&H come over as David and Goliath , standing up against "the Institution" - my paraphrase.

No spitting , no fighting , mind the furniture 😂

Nobody likes a hypocrite and that's what they are.

But don’t you think that people are capable of reflecting on their lives, seeing that they have been harmed and take steps to deal
with it? Why are you condemning everyone to be permanently affected by their past? People can and do move on. Is there a reason you cannot accept at face value that William has managed to move on? Why do you think he isn’t capable of that? He has been open about needing and undergoing therapy, particularly after his time as an air ambulance pilot. Do you think he is lying?

Yet Harry loves the press, gives interviews and information to various tabloids and magazines, and does all he can to stay in the headlines.

The best thing that happened to William was meeting Catherine and being taken under the Middleton wing . They are a close family and I think this gave William stability .
The Wales family live in a relatively small house by Royal standards with no live in staff and certainly seem to be doing a good job of bringing up three delightful children .

Harry the one whom has let the family down. He was the one who was nasty about his sister in law and didn't see his granny and grandad before they died.

Thicko posh ginger royal whiner who dated a string of dimbo blonde Sloane rangers gets told to grow up by irritated serious older brother.

Sulks off to some charity gig where he is set up with a narcissist goldigger who, siren-like, cleverly apes his dead mother’s batting her eyes while looking upwards adoringly. He falls for it. Hard.

Narcissist goldigger plans to reform the fuddy duddy ol’ monarchy and starts sizing up the curtains. Shocked how shabby Frogmore is, and how chippy the servants are. Bullies a few to give them message that she’s top dog now. Snooty prospective sister in law insists she curtsy and grimaces at hugs and sharing lip gloss.

Narc Goldy strings ginger along enough for big celeb filled bash “wedding” funded by British taxpayers. Suckers. ‘…But they got to see me in the carriage, those muggles should think themselves lucky!’

Pretends to be unhappy. Sad face. Who cares about abused African children? Thanks Tom Bradby. You’re right - what about ME??? I’m the one having to be trawled around this shit hole when I don’t want to be. I nearly cried. (Although acting skills weren’t quite up to it).

Ginger sees dying Granny to get some more taxpayer cash to run off to Hollywood but no ball. What about Canada then?

Narc Goldy decides to get knocked up to seal the deal.

Runs off to Canada. Yes we can still be royal here. See? No. We don’t see because no press on an isolated billionaire island.

Fuck it. Let’s just go to Hollywood anyway.

Granny dies.

Ginger and Narc are so upset that they tell everyone, including Oprah, about how victimised and ill treated they are. They say the RF are racist and evil. RF say nothing.

Narc Goldy has another ginger baby.

RF says nothing.

Narc Goldy sells jam.

RF says nothing.

Ginger threatens more ‘revelations’. He always has the army veterans on his side.

Army veterans are treated to Narc Goldy hosting and making speeches about herself.

Narc Goldy gets Netflix to film her putting flowers on biscuits then gets pissy when a celebrity calls her by the wrong name even though she also uses the wrong name.

Celebs stop returning calls.

RF says nothing.

@Hotflushesandchilblains People in the UK love to look down on America and Americans.

That may be your experience - not mine.

Ok, you do you then. I lived between the two places for most of my life. Have heard an astonishing amount of casual stereotyping and superiority. I stand by what I said.

It doesn't make sense does it.

I find Harry entitled and whiny and all round unpleasant, now his pr is no longer controlled by experts. I think he genuinely believes he can say whatever he likes to the press and received no comebacks or negative stories. He thinks they should just print his truth without comment. But that isn't how it works, to paraphrase, he has supped with the devil with a really short spoon and it makes him miserable and paranoia. .

Ah - if you see my post above in that I am a bit of a woolly constitutional monarchist - I like your post without wishing it to see the thing go to the conclusion. Middle ground me - rather see H&M called out for hypocrisy - but other opinions are available. 😎

It goes both ways. If nothing else Harry and Meghan's story and the commentary around it internationally shows the truth of the description of the UK and the US as two countries divided by a common language.

I don’t think for a minute that Harry didn’t understand his role. I think for years he has been enjoying himself enormously, partying and pissing off to South Africa on little trips etc.
It’s only when he met MM and he obviously told her he was far more influential and important than he was. Giving her the impression he could give her access to wealth and A list glamour she wanted. He had cash, but not all the cash, and the A list stuff was for his brother. So he pushed for change, and got pushed back.
Had a massive tantrum and left. Misinterpreted the good will/interest in his wedding that they were now global A list superstars and could coin it in and become American royalty, wrongly.

I think I see a lot of their supporters as pro-American thinking they are bringing down a foreign institution and ‘doing it better’.

I think there is something in that @MrsLeonFarrell - but in my experience of over 20 years, stereotypes of the English in the US are mostly favourable, with some stupid and annoying exceptions (bad food and bad teeth) whereas the other way around it is mostly unfavourable.

That's interesting, I haven't had the same experience, I would say mistaken assumptions go both ways about evenly. I would guess it would be same between any two countries, it's just that usually we don't understand what the other person is saying!

Fair comment - I can imagine the sort of causal stereotyping you refer to but as one who has close friends, family who have lived in the US and a possible US born SIL ( by which I mean possibly to be Son in Law - not possibly born in the US ) - just my opinion. & It's only one opinion, and there are others. Fair play you stand by your opinion. 💐

Of course they are. But I do think that, while you can move on and process what’s happened to you, it would be very difficult for someone in William’s position to completely put it behind him. His childhood had positively soap opera levels of trauma…..

I'm not sure anyone ever puts trauma behind them. It's how they deal with the trauma; how much they are aware of the damage it has caused and what they do about that damage, that counts. You can transmit trauma or it can end with you.

@Hotflushesandchilblains I think, nearly all of the time, if you pair two countries, if they are close (geographically or historically), the less powerful country dislikes the more powerful country. In this case, the UK is less powerful and thus dislikes America more than America dislikes us. It's more complicated than that, of course, but it is often true. And then, when something happens (like a state visit) the less powerful country prostates before the other - think all the cringy coverage in the UK media, when the president visits, about the state of the special relationship...

It may be a slight tangent but I'm always fascinated by dedicated fans, whoever the object of their devotion is. I always assumed that really fervent fans project some personal need or desire onto a celebrity. I am not sure that in the Sussex case the fandom is really attached to Harry, it seems to centre around Meghan. Maybe she is aspirational in some way?

Its interesting- I sound very English and the few people who pick up the residual twang guess Australian, so people who dont know me would not know the connection, if you know what I mean? I worked for a large company which had sites in the US, but head office was UK, so got to hear a lot of comments there. Also am loosely part of a large group of people who met at uni, who are mostly ok but feel quite free holding forth about the US and Americans, with little actual experience to back them up.

Of course, it is entirely possible that I know a lot of twats,

Part of the original fall out was the accusations of press briefings, I've yet to see any clear indication of these statements. The royal family have no access to their lives now and yet the couple are still continuing to be in the headlines with exclusives which appear a mixture of sources, themselves and the reality that they can't live in a secure vacuum just as the royal family can't. People who they come into contact with will disclose both side of the world. Again the hypocrisy of briefing when they aided Scobie and Bouzy admitted Meghan employed his services even prior to his Netflix appearance and the commonality of these two men, they like to attack Catherine.

I agree. I have had some therapy around childhood trauma and it's taken a while, in a nutshell, what worked for me was really having to think about situations I was in or my reaction to certain things and asking is this me or the trauma talking, until it became an unconscious thing . I will never forget but I feel I have and still am dealing with it so it doesn't adversely affect me.

Agreed. William will obviously never forget what happened to him but he has dealt with how it has affected him and decided to move on. I don’t buy in to fatalistic acceptance that you are forever tainted by your past. There are plenty of examples of this. Not everyone succeeds and some do not even try, but it is not a given that you cannot move on from
past trauma

I support them because it was obvious from the start that a certain high profile journalist and a rubbish tabloid were out to get them. They continue to be out to get them every day, posting pointless made up articles. It’s like an obsession/:..oh wait, no it’s just total click bait.

Looking at the Wales family, I would say William has broken the cycle of generational trauma, aided in no small part by the normalcy and grounding offered by the Mddletons. He's also clearly sought out therapy (which he's talked about) and is able to deal with his mother's death through honouring her memory, not immersing himself in the tragedy to a morbid and disturbing degree, like his brother. His mother parentified him and deliberately kept him away from his father, whereas Harry had the opposite treatment, judging by contemporary accounts. I imagine it has taken a lot for him to build bridges with Charles, but they seem to be rubbing along pretty well since William and Catherine's marriage and the grandchildren coming along.