I'm feeling a bit sorry for Harry

[ssd]

I feel like he needs his mum more than ever. To put an arm round him and say "enough son".

He needs guidance, he's never had maternal guidance. Its well documented that Williams life has been really enhanced by Kates parents. Harry has never had that and i feel sorry for him.

You’re all on a hiding to nothing, asking @MNHQ to be arbiter on what is/isn’t racism. Some years ago and many name changes ago, when the Meghan & Harry threads were at peak-deletion on this board, MNHQ admitted that sorting through this question is more than they’re capable of. Well beyond the capabilities of mods on a parenting chat forum.

I don’t blame them. It’s not a question that has a definitive answer. Billions of people affected by the question, billions of different answers.

And, as a WOC myself, I feel free to say that just because I say it’s so, doesn’t mean it is necessarily so.

The latest exaggeration from their spokesman has led to a lot of comments both here and in the States both from relevant authorities and the media. It was wholly unnecessary. Nobody is condoning the paparazzi and their part but why put out such a statement in the first place.

A couple and the woman’s mother in law left an event when they were followed by paparazzi. They were being followed to find out where they were staying and perhaps to take pictures of their children. In an attempt to lose the paparazzi the couple’s security drive around the city taking one way streets and driving occasionally on the highway. The paparazzi, in an attempt to not lose them, drove through red lights (almost causing accidents), drove on the pavement (high potential of colliding with pedestrians) and overall drove around dangerously in their attempt not to lose a potentially lucrative shot/shots almost crashing into other traffic.

How would you describe the paparazzi’s behaviour and activities that night? Dangerous? Frightening? Near catastrophic?

In an attempt to lose the paparazzi they went to the police - at this point they caught a taxi to try and blend in. Unfortunately they were blocked in by a truck and they were found by the paparazzi who took more pictures - they almost collided with police at this point. They returned to the police station after 10 minutes in the taxi and finally figured out a way to lose the paparazzi.

Pictures of the taxi event appeared in the Mail and Express several hours later. The couple released the statement expressing of course that the behaviour of the paparazzi was terrible and that anybody who published those pictures knowing how they were taken was driving the dangerous behaviour of the paparazzi that night. The pictures were taken down and the Mail was very silent about the event for hours and then an article appeared with this very interesting phrasing....

"In common with other websites, MailOnline published agency pictures of Harry and Meghan for a few hours on Wednesday morning. The agency pictures were captioned as showing Harry and Meghan getting into a taxi after the event and were published on that basis. When it was discovered that the pictures were in fact taken some time later at a different location, they were removed.”

This is why they released their statement.

The mayor, the police, the taxi diver and even the paparazzi agency themselves agree with this sequence of events of the events of the night. I wonder now with the demands for the footage that the couple have effectively rendered it worthless because no news site will now want to publish because of how litigious this particular couple are.

The paparazzi, in an attempt to not lose them, drove through red lights (almost causing accidents), drove on the pavement (high potential of colliding with pedestrians) and overall drove around dangerously in their attempt not to lose a potentially lucrative shot/shots almost crashing into other traffic.

If this is true, why did the NY police just describe the situation as 'challenging'? Why were no arrests made?

On a balance of probabilities, given that far more important and high-profile celebs than Harry and Meghan manage to go about their business in NY every day without any drama, there was something else going on.

This couple's form for both attention-seeking and exaggeration, amplified by the curious timing of the court case regarding their security, are key considerations. here

As a rational person I'm very much on Harry's and Meghans side over the behaviour of the paps. It's just totally unreasonable to behave like that all for a photo which, at the end if the day, is just like every other blinking photo. Just about everyone has criticised their behaviour.
Having said that, Harry's security detail is full of experienced, professional people, from all backgrounds including ex secret service men. Their sole job is to keep everyone safe. Instead they're speeding at 80mph to try to lose the paps. And Harry never told them to slow down because they were exciting the situation? I find that unbelievable really.

Surely they plan for these eventualities? They would have safe places to go to in such a situation, hotels, car parks, etc. They'd even have been better to pull over to the side of the road, ring the police and wait safely for them to arrive, rather than to chase around scared that the Press were going to kill someone. Yes, the press's behaviour was totally unreasonable but these security guys are the professionals with experienced, cool heads. And they just made the situation 10 times worse.
At the start of the chase I'm very much on Harry's side but by the end, I've lost sympathy. If someone had been killed, in my opinion, Harry and his team would have been culpable in that.

NYC must be full of CCTV, the Sussexs must have had camera phones.

Where is the video footage?

If people were going through red lights and driving irraticly on pavements, they should be done for dangerous driving.
Have the police convicted anyone?

The paparazzi, in an attempt to not lose them, drove through red lights (almost causing accidents), drove on the pavement (high potential of colliding with pedestrians) and overall drove around dangerously in their attempt not to lose a potentially lucrative shot/shots almost crashing into other traffic

and yet the NYPD confirmed there were no collisions, injuries or arrests. Multiple traffic violations and not a single arrest

i know who I believe

the event was so triggering - yet none of the three of them thought to put on a seatbelt? Really? Everyone knows Diana died because she wasn’t wearing a seatbelt.

front page news

It's possible that the police found it difficult to identify the paps and give them citations. It doesn't mean they don't deserve them. Its also possible that they thought the bad behaviour was equally distributed between both sides so decided to call it quits. It was a pretty fast moving situation, at night when they're busy, in all that traffic when it's difficult to get around, certainly with far more pressing matters to deal with than keeping secret where a couple of celebs are staying. I'm sure they just got them where they were going and wanted to draw a line under it. It doesn't mean that no one did anything wrong.

I guess they'll have to spend precious time now looking at their cctv which is the last thing they want to do. And they don't want to set precedents for other celebrities either.

You will have to ask the NYPD why they didn’t make any arrests.

Listen to the taxi driver - he states that there were more paparazzi than normal and they both looked nervous. (Sorry for linking to Piers - the interview is pretty straight forward and then of course it veers into bashing)

They could be nervous because the taxi driver had not been security vetted or trained for these situations. It was an incredibly stupid move by the security team and placed them at huge risk.

funny how they weren’t scared enough to put a seat belt on.

Did you read what I wrote? At no point did I say that any collision or any injury occurred. Neither did they. As I said everyone is saying the same thing - you just don’t want to believe it.

Yes - they should have been wearing seatbelts. They also shouldn’t have been followed by the paparazzi.

Listen to the taxi driver - he states that there were more paparazzi than normal

He said in another interview there were 6 paparazzi. I don't know what normal is, though. He,said they were followed by two cars but they weren't scary and didnt act dangerously. He did say that Harry and Meghan were quiet and seemed nervous. Of course, they might very well have been scared.
I think it shows that each person's perception of a situation is not necessarily the truth, it really is just a personal perception of the truth.

Agreed - I hope they don’t trawl through CCTV for this because you’re right it does set a precedent for all and I really think that the police have more important things to do.

I said this on another thread. I still think the same & additionally I think they were let down by their security team:-

Do I think they were harassed by paparazzi?- yes.
Do I think it was near catastrophic? - No
Do I think it was a 2 hour car chase in NY of all places? - no not with that traffic.
Do I think it was triggering for Harry? - most likely.

How much traffic do you think there is in NY at night?

They were in his taxi for 10 - 15 minutes after they had been in their own vehicle for some time. He was clear to clarify that he could only comment on the time he was with them.

Having been to NY several times I can tell you sometimes it’s quicker to walk - even at night.

I haven’t said they weren’t harassed but I don’t believe it was near catastrophic. Lots of people have near misses. They are not near catastrophes. Accidents yes. Catastrophes no.

When I saw those headlines I was shocked, I imagined a Diana type chase all over again, in spite of things getting better over the years. However it played out, there was obviously some endangerment. Will there be prosecutions by the NYPD?

Probably not - they would have to go through CCTV to find the events, then put in hours to identify the individuals and then charge and arrest them. Unfortunately things like this literally have to happen right under the nose of police for people to be charged - especially if there were no injuries or property damage.

There must have been loads of cameras, right? People around taking pictures of the event? I would think there's evidence.

Of course but again not a high priority for the NYPD and certainly would come under much criticism from New Yorkers if they spent too much time on this when there are more pressing issues.

Surely they'd feel more nervous in a taxi with untinted windows and low to the ground. They're much more exposed in that than in the large, sturdy suvs, with blacked out windows. I can see they'd feel tense after what they'd been through but I really don't see how they'd feel scared going slowly through NYC traffic in a blacked out suv with armed guards.

@skullbabe They had a police escort - if chasing cars were driving as recklessly as you suggest the police would have stopped them & given them tickets. They didn't.