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The royal family

Prince Andrew Thread 2

999 replies

Roussette · 03/01/2022 11:34

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4442126-Prince-Andrew

Here is previous thread.

I've started a new thread because today and tomorrow is crucial as far as the pending civil case.

And I also had a few comments I wanted to say to posters at the end of the last thread, but it ran out.

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Roussette · 03/01/2022 12:11

I thought it was later today that would be revealed?

And I thought he wasn't specifically named in it, but in general terms the wording could mean he could be included.

Might have all that wrong!

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MrsColon · 03/01/2022 12:11

The Queen just continues to defend Andrew.

Well of course she does, he's her son, not just an employee! It really complicates things given that it's such a very family-based business. I really feel for her, it must be awful having your beloved son do something so terrible Sad

It was very brave of her to basically sack him from the business, but now she's supporting him privately as his mother.

Roussette · 03/01/2022 12:14

She is not just supporting him privately though, is she?

That's what sticks in my throat. If that's all it was, I would be more accepting.

But bestowing one of the highest honours of service (Royal Garter or something) on him AFTER Epstein and VG came to light is taking the bloody piss. She didn't have to do that. And she didn't have to take him to church days after the interview.

She could have supported him privately and quietly. But no.

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Roussette · 03/01/2022 12:17

Thank you Storm, those two articles are really worth reading.

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Courcheval · 03/01/2022 12:18

Thanks Rousette for the second thread.

Interesting to see what the unsealed documents show today. Apparently PA has asked for all the evidence in the case to be kept private. That, to me, is not the actions of an innocent man.

DuncinToffee · 03/01/2022 12:18

The confidential settlement is released today

Tomorrow, a New York judge is due to hear arguments on whether to dismiss her civil lawsuit

news.sky.com/story/prince-andrew-accuser-virginia-giuffres-secret-settlement-with-jeffrey-epstein-to-be-made-public-today-12507864

bubblesbubbles11 · 03/01/2022 12:19

I am glad there is a second thread, I know very little about the RF and have learnt a lot - thank you.

My thoughts are that if the Queen does not in some way sanction PA (I would say irrespective of the court case with effect from tomorrow but if she waits for the outcome of that I guess that is understandable) she sets a very dangerous precedent for the RF and it sends all the wrong messages to others about how they can behave and what they can get away with. Maybe she is still working on the "never apologise never explain" principle but whatever people said about "nothing has changed in society" on the other thread - perhaps the public will not buy that any more?

For example - however unlikely (or not? what do I know) if Prince William was caught using young prostitutes in the future, the Queen's silence now will just exacerbate the damage to the RF at that future juncture.

I think the Queen's final actions will actually be remembered and quoted down the years and that is what will really stick, for better or (more likely) for worse.

On a totally separate level, there will be millions of men out there throughout the classes who will look at Prince Andrew and the way he has "got away" with it and will use that as a role model for their own duplicitious and immoral behaviour.

And not just at the Boris Johnson level - all the way throughout the social classes. It is just another "pat on the back" for immorality, cheating and abusing other people throughout society. As sanctioned by the Crown (however much they might want people to continue with the "do-as-i-say-not-as-i-do" mentality)

x2boys · 03/01/2022 12:19

@Thoosa

The Queen just continues to defend Andrew.

Surely her advisers have made her aware of the seriousness now? Even if she somehow shut her eyes and ears herself, it must have been impressed on her.

If he is found liable, they will have to jettison, severely sideline him, demote him and/or exile him somehow. They must have plans ready. Otherwise the monarchy is at risk, which presumably the monarchy doesn’t want.

I thought they had pretty much "retired him" from public life ,the only time he has spoken out in recent months was regarding prince Philip,s death who when all said and done was his Father I don't think he will be wheeled out in public ceremonies ,or if he is he will be very much in the back ground .
DuncinToffee · 03/01/2022 12:20

And thanks for continuing the discussiin Roussette

CaveMum · 03/01/2022 12:22

Marking my spot.

Roussette · 03/01/2022 12:22

And can we clear this up once and for all.... so many times on the previous thread I was told by posters I was wrong. @Luredbyapomegranate, here you go! You're the recent one I wanted to reply to but the thread ran out before I could.

Today from Sky News...
"Ms Giuffre claims she was trafficked by Epstein to have sex with the Duke of York when she was aged 17, a minor under US law, and was pictured with the royal and Ghislaine Maxwell during the period the alleged intercourse took place."

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llansannan22 · 03/01/2022 12:23

I hope justice happens and he has a day or more in court. Until that happens he will be judged as guilty even if he is not.

Newyearoldyou · 03/01/2022 12:23

Articles over the weekend "Palace staff sleep walked into Andrew crisis"

Not quite true and I feel really sorry for staff having to work around the this man.
Their jobs, reputation and life line are on the line here, people have said he was arrogant, had the full and unequivocal backing of the Queen so they were all "stuck".

I bet heads will roll but not the right ones.

CathyorClaire · 03/01/2022 12:25

@Roussette

I thought it was later today that would be revealed?

And I thought he wasn't specifically named in it, but in general terms the wording could mean he could be included.

Might have all that wrong!

Today then. Even better.

I can't imagine he's specifically named in it or there would be no point in VG having brought this case. The suggestion in the news report was that the general wording may or may not let him off depending on the judge's interpretation.

SpookyScarySkeletons · 03/01/2022 12:25

@Thoosa

The Queen just continues to defend Andrew.

Surely her advisers have made her aware of the seriousness now? Even if she somehow shut her eyes and ears herself, it must have been impressed on her.

If he is found liable, they will have to jettison, severely sideline him, demote him and/or exile him somehow. They must have plans ready. Otherwise the monarchy is at risk, which presumably the monarchy doesn’t want.

Sorry I'm late to the party here and haven't read the full first thread.

How is the Queen defending him? She hasn't spoken out at all about it (which tbh whether she believes him or not I wouldn't expect her to)

It must be an awful situation she is in. Really she shouldn't speak about him until the court knows the truth?

Vapeyvapevape · 03/01/2022 12:25

The Queen is showing, by giving PA an honour , that she really isn’t in tune with her ‘subjects’ , I used to think she was sincere when she spoke about duty to her country etc - not now though.

Roussette · 03/01/2022 12:26

bubbles So agree with your post.

To my mind, the RF should be beyond reproach and set an example. HMQ is Head of the Church, PA still holds all these Heads of military divisions (hopefully, soon to be axed) and each one of them are patrons of charities a lot connected with children.

To turn a blind eye to all of this is incomprehensible to me. And it's why I've gone from quite the royalist decades ago to completely the opposite now.

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Roussette · 03/01/2022 12:28

Spooky she is totally defending him! See my post of 12.14 on here.

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Thoosa · 03/01/2022 12:29

I thought they had pretty much "retired him" from public life ,the only time he has spoken out in recent months was regarding prince Philip,s death who when all said and done was his Father
I don't think he will be wheeled out in public ceremonies ,or if he is he will be very much in the back ground

I hope they will formalise his hermit status or go even further if there is a court judgement or enquiry finding against him. The whole thing needs clarification.

SailingNotSurfing · 03/01/2022 12:31

I'm not sure where I stand on the Queen's approach to her second son's dubious, illegal, atrocious and amoral behaviour. Do we know for sure she is standing by him?

I know that for me, personally, if there was any hint that my son was involved in sexual activities with underage girls, I would find it very hard to offer my support - unless I knew 100% the claims were fraudulent and malicious.

Roussette · 03/01/2022 12:31

Newyearoldyou

Yes to this. I do think the worm has turned. The aides and courtiers were feeling the heat and are now saying they had no choice, he ran roughshod over them and told them the only person he answered to was the Queen.

Then... who knows what he told her, how he spun the whole thing, how he even manipulated her.
As I said on the previous thread, he is the only close member of the RF to always make a show of bowing and kissing her hand every time he entered a room, maybe she loved that. He was always favourite so just gave him free rein.

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DuncinToffee · 03/01/2022 12:32

Didn't the queen and Andrew go horse riding together the day after the tv interview? And he accompanied her to church? All as photo opportunities.

SpindleSpangle · 03/01/2022 12:32

I agree about the Vanity Fair articles - they're excellent. I hadn't realised till I read the one about the acquisition of the photos of the infamous walk in Central Park that British security officers had been inside Epstein's New York mansion/crime scene, seemingly overnight.

Those “security” people are actually senior officers with the Metropolitan police

Yup. And there's me been wondering how Cressida Dick keeps her job.