Killing Eve S4 - Discussion thread (with spoilers)

[NurseButtercup]

The first episode will air on 28th February. I think this is the last season. I'm going to state up front this thread will contain spoilers.

My plan is to watch the last episode of season 3 to refresh my memory.

Please join in....

@JanisMoplin I think Konstantin's note said Villianelle killed Kenny so Carolyn had her killed. As for the rest I couldn't tell you what was going on.

Why did Carolyn kill Villanelle? To get back in with mi6 allegedly
How did V manage to kill the whole Twelve? with kitchen implements at her disposal cos she is as hard and adept as The Bride in Kill Bill
Did they not have security? fewer people involved the better
Same with Helene. If she was so important couldn't she have forked out for a body guard? security can sell you out/stab you in the back
Why did V go to Gunn's Island? Konstantin told her Gunn would help her locate Helene who had ordered the arrow/Gunn sparked her curiosity
Why did Helene order Konstantin to be killed? Test for Pam
Why did Eve kill Lars? Avenging Bill, Nico, Kenny, V herself as she thought he was the Big Bad nor did she trust Carolyn
What did Konstantin write in the letter? He had in fact killed Kenny
Who killed Kenny ? Didn't he fall off the building by accident? Konstantin. He made up the falling backwards to stop Carolyn from shooting him
What happened to Nico and Carolyn's daughter? Nico survived the pitchforking but wanted nothing more to do with Eve. Carolyn's daughter remained low contact
Why did Helene order the kill on the Latina burger seller? Forgotten her name. She was Lars's ex wife and was surplus to requirements
And lastly, why does everyone who meets V become obsessed with her? Because she is beautiful, vulnerable underneath but also charismatic

As I said, complete and utter bollocks

Villanelle did not kill Kenny as she was still in Spain at the time. It would have made more sense had there been a flashback scene revealing a quick flight in and out of Spain, whereby she was actually on the roof but not the case. Sorry.

I do know one of the proposed endings was Villanelle and Eve jumping off a cliff, Thelma and Louise style but production could not afford location - Villanelle would have killed them all off in the cliffside hotel then when her and Eve were being shot at, they both jumped.
It still would have left multiple questions as above. It still might have been the case that Eve survived a plummet into the ocean. If they had left it as both in the air in freefall, viewers might have complained they both died, it was unclear or that they had ripped off Callie Khouri (who wrote T+L).

I could barely remember what happened in previous series so the chances of me following this one were slim especially with the huge plot holes.

Trust me Jane the only reason I can tell you any of the above - and I still disagree with/am disappointed by pretty much all of those answers I have given btw - is because I have read so many interviews with the showrunner, exec producer and actors and reddit discussions (I am procrastinating).
I was hoping for so much more. The fact is, that they prioritised characters over plot but then sold out those characters, whose motivations were all over the place.

Thank you @ISeeALittleSiIhouettoOfAMan. Slightly clearer though I am still not convinced! Carolyn had some good lines in this series but overall: what a mess!

You are welcome. I am not convinced either. By any of it. Jessica Lancaster sums up why here.
thathashtagshow.com/2022/04/17/where-the-final-season-of-killing-eve-went-wrong-not-just-the-ending/

@ISeeALittleSiIhouettoOfAMan thank you for the roundup. I did think Nico died though. I must have missed something there.

We just watched the final episode, and whilst not as awful as I had seen some articles saying it was, it was pretty week.
I did like V& Es last few days of happiness in their stolen campervan. Eves celebrant speech to the couple but to V was sweet too. I actually thought the organisers asked if one of them was the ice sculpturer and thought ahh perfect! A weapon to attack the twelve.

This final episode had a lot to live up to and never would have made everyone happy, but I think they really could have done better. A series that started with such a bang ended with a bit of a damp squib.

I'm on ep 3 but hopped on here to see what MNers thought of the end

Tbh I am only still watching because I love Villanelle and Eve so much. I didn't like series three but some scenes were amazing, mostly thinking of the ballroom and the final one at the bridge.

I've now seen what I think is the last four minutes on YouTube. It might be edited, but watching Eve dance - and what a brilliant choice of song - while Villanelle kills people, is just wonderful.

The end was too heartbreaking for me to look again. So I am confused where the bullets were coming from - the boat? Trajectory seems too high for that?

I’ve been watching weekly so avoided this thread till nlw

so Carolyn killed V

but why

and assume she asked Pam to do the sees

bit she said no , Carolyn found a sniper very quickly

Pam shouldn’t have been awake to walk away considering she liked k

tho k killed Kenny but didn’t know he was his son

what will happen to eve now

who was no 1 in the 12

I feel it hasn’t ended properly 🥲🥲

~ Bullets came from a sniper on the riverbank
~ Carolyn killed Villanelle as something to bring to mi6, to get back in their good books
~ Pam walks away from the whole killing scene I think - possibly as she realises it is cut-throat, possibly because she is free with Helene having died and possibly because she does regret killing Konstantin
~ It was never established who Kenny's father was
~ Eve will survive allegedly a stronger person
~We were not told who head honcho in the 12 was, or for that matter solid confirmation of many of the others (hydra - kill one, another gets promoted)
~ Founder activist member - Lars (covert member after stayed 'dead'?)
~ Retired? - Karolina (but noone ever leaves...)
~ Paul Bradwell
~ Rustem
~ Others killed by Helene
? Helene ( agent/rank? received texts to meet but in series 2 was a keeper)
? Carolyn (infiltrated them like Konstantin as a spy and came up with name)

Others
~ Frank - mi5 mole for the 12
~ Raymond/Anton/Konstantin - handlers
~ Dasha - trainer
~ Diego/Nadia/Rhian/Gunn/Villanelle - assassins/V was meant to be a keeper at some point
~ Felix/Pam/Irina - trainee assassins
~ Charles - accountant

It has not ended properly as it has not ever been plotted correctly and yet I still find myself trying to solve the unsolvable

Hierarchy
The 12 > Keepers > Handlers > Assassins
But we were never really told how they made it up the ranks. I assume Helene became one of the 12 by replacing Paul as an example. She then started killing colleagues to work out who the head was (even had she found out, was she going to be the head herself then promote others - we are not told)
No idea why Konstantin was only ever a handler (or how he became one, if he had infiltrated the activist group along with Carolyn as a founder member i.e one of the original 12 anarchists. Why was Carolyn not a handler? Or was she? (offered Pam a job)
She was mi6/defected to Russia/double-agent went back to mi6/if member of the 12 would have been effectively investigating herself so makes little sense
Difference between handlers and trainers?
Difference between handlers and keepers?
Whole thing is a wormhole, whereby 4 different showrunners did not really liaise
On the other hand, some took what others said to be ad verbatim/canon e.g. that Carolyn's father was gay and a spy (Fiona Shaw said in her opinion this had been a joke when mentioned early in series, resurrected as canon (fact) in series 4)
I would imagine at some point the writers' room had a six degrees of separation flowchart thang going on...but still could not fix it.
Carolyn was shocked that Kenny thought Konstantin was his father for example. So for that to be a reveal would make no sense.
Villanelle was in Spain when Kenny thrown from roof. So her being his killer would make no sense even if it made sense of Carolyn's decision and had she been responsible, Konstantin would have thrown her under the bus earlier, along with Paul.
Carolyn not being linked to the 12 if Konstantin was, and both were infiltrators/founder members makes no sense if noone ever leaves. Where did that leave Carolina? Or Lars: Why did he not avenge C and K's betrayal

But all the above is okay - here, watch Eve and Villanelle snog instead
(Distract- divert - look over there!)
The plot holes are so vast the whole thing falls apart and not in a Usual Suspect, everything we were told was cobblers, kind of way.

Thanks for explaining

Just a Thank You to @ISeeALittleSiIhouettoOfAMan for the link. Jessica Lancaster has written a really measured breakdown of the final episode - and Season 4. I really enjoyed reading it, probably, in part, because it mirrored by own response😊

It's a little baffling that this is what the series writers came up with. I know the finger is pointing at Laura Neal, but there are a team of writers aren't there? Like many, I'm now rewatching the whole series and can really see the mismatches and poor continuity. The more I watch, the more I see the incongruence of Series 4 (and like many others viewers, start to sketch out how it could have been so different, other plot lines, character challenges etc... 😉)

I just wonder if the writers' team got lost down a Killing Eve rabbit hole, were too close to it all, so lost perspective and forgot about Entertainment value?

I think the writers were on dope. Luke Jennings has expressed his dissatisfaction too. www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2022/apr/22/killing-eve-writer-tv-finale

It was a mess. The characters’ motivations were unclear. So disappointing.

But I liked:

Pam. Great actor. Kind of chilling, but banal. I enjoyed the early mortuary scenes.

Konstantin advising Pam to get out of it, live a normal life. I reckon after leaving Carolyn she returned to Margate and the lovely guy, and got a job at the fair. He didn’t want more young lives ruined. He had softened.

The acting of the leads. Oh, Comer and Shaw are sublime.

Villanelle dispatching the brutal Cuban husbands.

The silly everyday stuff. Ferrero Rocher and farting. Konstantin’s bad ear. Revels. The therapist swigging the wine. Helene mending her daughter’s tiara.

Agree with all the points about loose ends, but ultimately I thought V dying was right, one or both of them had to die - there was no happy ending weaving lentils in Hebden Bridge possible for them.

I was most annoyed that in reality, the bullets which hit V would have gone through Eve as well. That velocity and calibre wouldn’t have stopped in V.