BBC 2 The Disappearance of Margaret Fleming

[informedisgood]

Anyone else watching? Thank goodness her "careres" were finally exposed.

it's not a loch. It's the Firth of Clyde, which is an inlet of the Irish Sea, salt water and tidal.

And it's deep. Just further up the Firth is Faslane, where the UK's nuclear subs are. According to Wikipedia, the deepest coastal waters in the UK. Draw your own conclusions about that.

Agree that the Police dropped the ball on checking the CCTV but it seems clear from the female police witness that their initial impression was that Margaret had never been there anyway.

It's perfectly plausible that Edward Cairney earned a whacking great salary as a diver in the oil boom years of the 70s and 80s. That was the boom era and he would have easily earned enough as a diver to buy a house in Inverkip at that time and pay the mortgage. Also agree that their back story would be interesting - all the stuff about dinner parties and friends and socialising - then 20 years later they're both living in total squalor with the house literally falling down around them. What about their own families - did they have siblings, parents, aunts, cousins?

Of course all of those people might have been called as witnesses and not appeared on TV.

Also, the fact that they were arrested at the station on their way to London with £3000 in cash was very suspicious.

Just googled and it looks as if maybe the house has been sold in 2017.

@Inappropriatefemale they did say that but how would they see her if they were inside? I just thought that bit didn't make much sense to me. If she'd gone missing that day (or on that assumption at that time anyway) I just thought perhaps they would check the other direction as well and maybe a bit earlier in the day

Quote possibly. It's a lovely spot. Demolish, rebuild and you could have a lovely property.

They would have passed her I think they meant, I can’t exactly remember but whatever reason they gave then it was certainly plausible enough.

I imagine the neighbours would be delighted if it’s been sold. I could see Eddie leaving it derelict out of spite. It’s a beautiful location hope someone is enjoying it refurbished.

The reason that they were checking the CCTV was because the initial story was that, when the police arrived, Margaret had just run out the back door because she was scared of anyone in authority. That's also why the policeman was so suspicious of the layer of dust on her duvet: they said she had slept there the night before.

Their story clearly changed a lot over the time before the trial, which must have been another count against them.

Nothing has happened with it yet I don’t think. Sold but still standing as it was. Unless something has happened really recently. There’s plans for 4 houses which look lovely!

Would that pair have got the funds from the sale? I want to know what they did with her money! A forensic accountant could have worked that all of surely.

The money isnt a huge amount over that length of time. They probably just lived off it as they weren't working.

Wonder if Rightmove could tell us what it sold for.

Re the PIP. How was this paid to Margaret? Via the post office or her bank account?

Could they not have looked into who it was going to and how it was spent?

On the PIP form Avril wrote Margaret would be distressed in places with lots of people and now they are saying she got a train alone to London.

Eddie looks frail now but look back to the photos of him. I don't think Margaret or Avril could stand up to him.

I'm thinking maybe Avril doesn't honestly know what happened and maybe she did question Eddie but e looks like he could have brainwashed her.

I found the house (plot - it looks like it has been demolished???) how sad that the police tape has just been left there.

On a side note how amazing would it be to live in that house and they just let it go to waste. If they could afford to look after it or it was too much due their physical / mental they could have sold it.

I wonder what Margaret Dad would be thinking now. I can't believe no checks were done via Social Services or whoever the equivalent.

I know someone whose level of learning difficulties is similar to Margaret's, certainly in terms of literacy and numeracy. Her benefits are paid into a parent's bank account as she doesn't have the capacity to manage her own account. Quite possibly that is what happened here. Or if she did have her own account, the "carers" had the card.

The water beside where they lived was beautiful but a bit eerie now.

Does anyone think they ‘sold’ Margaret in London and this is why they had £3k on them in London? Sounds like it could be hence his ‘gang master’ story, he probably sold her to one rather than she being one, obviously she isn’t one.

I thought they had the £3000 on them when police arrested them at central station on their way to London.

No it was coming back from London was it not?

The PIP application is what triggered looking for her I think? With DLA (and PIP) it is yours to spend how you wish and that is how it should be.

People talking about yearly f2f - this is what disabled people want to get away from (rightly) as these f2f interviews are distressing and if your condition will never change they are pointless.

I'd be interested in what they said about consultants etc. A big part of all the applications is what doctors you have seen etc. Didnthey lie and say she was seeing specialists?

I remember at the time the police denied that they had them under surveillance, yet they managed to turn up at central and arrest them.
You might be right, I would need to watch it again.

No they had 3k on them going to london, not coming back.

I think it's surprising how when on the one hand getting benefits when ill is very difficult, that once someone is put in the unfit for work indefinitely category they potentially don't need to be seen or checked on ever again.

This can't be the first time something like this has happened, which is terrible, but there could be other vulnerable people out there who are alive but someone else is taking their benefit money and barely looking after them/mistreating them.

When someone is put in the not fit for work permanently category you'd think there would at least be a requirement for a certificate from a doctor every year or every couple of years to say they've been seen, so they're still alive and the same health problems still apply (as opposed to having to be re-assessed)

Things have changed drastically in the last few years though.

If they had decided £180,000 was enough and not reapplied for the renewed benefits in Margaret’s name in 2016 after the benefits shake-up, they may have got away with it forever.

It's heartbreaking to think of FredaFrogspawn - if it wasn't for their greed, they'd still be out there and that poor girl wouldn't even have been "missing". The likelihood is that no-one would even have queried her disappearance until after the two of them had died - and maybe not even then.

In fact if they'd moved house and "taken her with them" she would never have been missed, because in their new home there would have just been the two of them.

I can't help but wonder how many other vulnerable adults have met a similar fate at the hands of other evil people.

Watched it yesterday. I wondered why her dads fiancé didn't do anything as she seemed quite fond of her. Surely she'd have kept in touch a bit.

I totally got the impression her dads partner was as rough as fuck (as we say here in Scotland) and totally playing up her and Margaret’s relationship to get in on the action with the programme