Madeleine documentary

[mentallyfacked]

New documentary due to be released on Netflix on Friday.

I've covered this subject quite extensively while I was studying law. I will be watching with a heavy heart, it is just one of those cases I can't let go of sadly.

Anyone else going to be watching?

And desperate to protect their reputations and avoid any suggestion of neglect

With regard to road blocks being set up immediately. The obvious transport would have been by sea from the marina. If MM was abducted then there is access to the whole of the Mediterranean and North Africa.

And desperate to protect their reputations and avoid any suggestion of neglect

Your contempt for them is palpable.

If she drowned her body would have washed up somewhere.

Not necessarily. That's not how the sea works I'm afraid.

A few months ago I found a 2 year old wandering out in the dark, rainy car park at our local soft play. If someone without a licence or something had run him over and killed him, it would have been a matter of seconds to scoop him into the trunk to hide the evidence.

I simply don't believe well-educated, middle class parents would deny their daughter a decent burial because they were scared of the repercussions of an accident. They'd expect the establishment to be on their side.

@cushioncovers - my understanding is that the dogs will indicate blood and also the scent of a cadaver but that they can't identify whose blood or who the cadaver was .

And just while on the subject I found it interesting that air currents can move the scent so that it collects in one spot .

TaMereAPoilDevantPrisu quite a number of high profile U.K. cases have been opportunistic abductions from outdoors too

If someone without a licence or something had run him over and killed him, it would have been a matter of seconds to scoop him into the trunk to hide the evidence.

I think there is a fair chance that somehim like this happened. I'd agree that you can't assume there is no way a child could open doors, safety gates etc, and if she'd stepped out onto a dark road, she could have been hit by someone who decided to cover it up in the same way the killer of Ben Needham did.

blood was found UNDER the floor tiles in the apartment so, no, I don't think anything was planted by the PJ.

This is the point though, isn’t it? You’re forgetting that Eddie doesn’t detect only Cadaverine. He also responds to other bodily fluids, including blood, as long as it isn’t fresh. If he alerted behind the sofa, a dog who only alerts to blood alerted in the same place and minuscule traces of blood were found underneath the tile, then I think you can logically draw the conclusion that he was most likely alerting to blood. My money is probably on the blood being there when the tiles were laid.

Butterymuffin- pretty sure my kids were climbing over stair gates by age 3/4! And would certainly have thought nothing of ducking under long curtains and sliding open a door.

This was a fascinating series but ruined for us by the incessant music which overlaid the dialogue. It was equally as loud as the voices and we longed for a break from it.

Ok even if it was her blood and she did died in the apartment how was there only miniscule traces of blood found and how would it have got under the tiles?

Did I pick it up right the head of the investigation who was sacked was also sacked from a previous similar investigation?

I have no doubt if it had happened in the UK the parents would have been interviewed very quickly along with the rest of the Tapas 7. UK police would put it as "we need to illimate them from the enquiry" not go down the road of naming them as suspects without a scrap of evidence.

As a parent of children who've had a special teddy if she was going to wander the chances are she'd have taken her cuddle cat with her. Even if our kids come to our bed at night the teddies arrive too.

The wander theory doesn't take into account the unidentified individuals wandering the resort or the intruder in the other ladies house. Or the previous sexual assaults on young girls in their holiday accommodation.

Christ there is so much tinfoil hattery on this thread, it defies belief.

1. People have been convicted of not behaving how people think someone should behave after a murder, and then forensic info has proven them innocent. People who in all seriousness say - I would have done this - are IMO stupid. I realise I have no idea how in reality I would react. Because no one does. I do remember after the murder of a cousin in the funeral car, myself and another relative joking and laughing. We were fucking devastated, but the tension was unbelievable that day, and we both reacted that way to break the tension. Some idiotic person could have taken that as evidence we were involved.

1. The blood - The dogs would have alerted to blood in other apartments too. Minute amounts of blood will be present in most holiday apartments. Accidents, cutting yourself shaving, are all routine. The cleaning that happens will stop it being visible, but that is all. Whenever I have read about forensics in terms of blood being found out at a crime scene, even months later, it has always been blood spatter patterns, or large pools of blood. I think this is a red herring.

1. The conflicting statements - First of all there is a lot on the internet that is not truth. But it is expected that there will be conflicting statements. There is lots of research to show that witnesses are generally unreliable. People misremember things. And everyone had been drinking. That will make the possibility of things being wrongly remembered even more the case.

1. The statement about the GP who went on holiday with them another time. I don't believe this. If this was true a GP would know to report this to SS. The supposed statement says that the GP did nothing. A GP would know that SS must be informed. I think this statement on a blog is false and that is why things like the Netflix documentary do not mention it.

1. The Tapas 7 not talking in public about what happened - If I was them I would not either. In the immediate aftermath, I would have seen any of them talking to press as trying to get media attention. It was not appropriate for them to talk to the press. Why would they? It would have been the equivalent of gossiping to the press and shocking behaviour. They talked to the police, which was the right thing to do. Later on, with the public vitriol against the McCanns, I would not have talked to the press. They all had families, why would you talk to the press and expose yourself to the likelihood that the press and public would talk shit about you and your family? You would talk to the police and not the press to defend your family, and that is what they did.

1. Setting up a company and not a charity a few days after she went missing - you can not set up a charity in a few days. It takes time to get approval to be a charity. And there is a fair amount of paperwork involved. Setting up a company is the easiest and quickest way to get donations. In fact many families who get donations in aftermaths of tragedies just have the money going into their bank account.

1. Using donations to pay their mortgage - they were searching for their daughter. They could not work. What are they supposed to do? Let their house be repossessed?

1. Washing cuddle cat - I would wash it 21 days later if it was minging I am sure. You might not, fine. But I think I would.

1. Gerry McCann - I think he comes across as controlling and unlikeable. But that does not mean you are guilty of murder. Just that you come across as controlling and unlikeable.

10. Refusing to do a reconstruction - They may have been worried that the police were already looking to pin this on them. We know that already they were concerned that the police were incompetent. That may have been the wrong decision, does not make them guilty though.

11. Sleeping for an hour, playing golf, returning home - In the aftermath of a tragedy, stupid people do seem to expect those most closely affected to never sleep and never do anything normal. That is not realistic. Of course you need to sleep, of course you need to do normal things to cope. And the documentary makes it clear they returned home because they were worried they were going to be arrested.

12. Checking on them - I think it may be the children were not checked on as frequently as publicly said.

13. McCanns not wanting to say they were partly at fault for leaving the children alone - There child has gone missing, probably dead. The mind tries to protect itself in these situations. And finding ways to say you are totally innocent is one way to do this. I hear people do this all the time with far lesser incidents e.g. when their child is hurt. I think it is very common. I also think the public who want them to admit they were wrong publicly are pretty cruel.

blood was found UNDER the floor tiles in the apartment so, no, I don't think anything was planted by the PJ

Found by whom? If the floor tiles had to be taken up to find any blood traces it would strongly suggest that it must have got there well before 2007 to have been invisible to the naked eye and luminol

My eldest son could get over stair gates at a year old. He climbed them, opened them etc. He would also from a baby wiggle first one shoulder, then the other, out of car seats and stand up. If all else failed he would run at stair gates and batter them down. It was like having a baby Houdini. He could definitely have got out of an apartment where a patio door and the front door had been left open.

clairemcnam great post, I agree with all of it, sadly there are those who think the McCanns are some how involved in Madeleines disappearance no matter how hard they try to hide it with their wide eyed faux concern.

Ed, yes the Head of the investigation was sacked after apparently falling out with the British police, supposedly assisting the Portuguese police, due to their refusal to cooperate with investigating the McCanns, which would be formality normally as they were the last to see her alive, and was transferred. There were also allegations of torture from a mother convicted of the murder of her own daughter. From what I've read these allegations were made 3 years after the alleged torture took place, within weeks of the McCann's being made suspects in their daughters disappearance strangely enough. Mr Amaral was not present at the alleged torture but was convicted of falsifying paperwork to cover it up. The alleged 'torturers' were not convicted.

Go figure.

In terms of what actually happened -

1. I don't believe for a minute that 7 professional adults who are not involved, would cover for friends who killed their child, or even found their child dead and disposed of the body. These are not stupid people, they would know that is the worst thing they could do and could lead to them being suspected of murder and going to prison. Even if they had covered for them initially, which I don't believe they would have, 1 would have admitted it.

1. Wandering off - I have read a number of cases where someone has been found dead in an area already well searched. A small child's body could be easily missed. So perhaps this happened.

1. Abduction - I think this is the most likely explanation. Although rare, children and adults have been abducted from apartments. There have even been cases were small children were abducted from a house when the parents were still in the house. I think it was an adult who had already had contact with her, perhaps through the kids club. That is why she was taken and not one of the twins, she had already been chosen as a target. And if she even vaguely knew the adult, that would have made it easier to take her. Very easy for an adult to say - I am John from the kids club, we are going to x place now, so dont worry.

Forgot to mention, those saying the twins not waking up are signs that they were drugged have never met my cousins. When they were 6 and 7 they were living in another country when a bomb went off right outside where they were sleeping. Their parents rushed in and were shocked to see they were still sleeping and totally unharmed. Some kids really do sleep through anything. Just because your kid wakes up at the drop of a pin, does not mean all kids do.

My child slept through a full scale evacuation fire engines police the entire lot. Did not wake up It was so amazing people took photos and it is still spoke about.

The searches were pretty extensive so it’s hard to believe a body wouldn’t be found in the case of wandering off and being involved in an accident. Though it’s true that it’s not unknown for a body to be found even after an area has been searched. In the case of wandering off I feel it’s more likely someone would panic and dispose of the body in the case of accidental death (as in what’s been concluded re: Ben Needham.) I’ve read there was a lot of building and roadworks in the locality which could be relevant if this were the case. The sea.... bodies aren’t always washed up, it’s dependent on tides and weather and if a body gets swept out to sea it’s not unlikely it won’t ever be recovered.

Kate was convinced that Madeline couldn't open the patio door or open the stair gate and she knew her dds capabilities best. That is one of the reasons she felt safe leaving the patio door unlocked, she considered that the children were safely contained. (Obviously in hindsight they weren't safe). The fact that some children can get through stair gates or open heavy sliding doors is irrelevant really.

On further research, it seems the woman whose torture the police chief was accused of covering up, was convicted of lying about the torture in 2013. It's not clear if his conviction still stands though and he is referred to as 'disgraced cop' in the UK MSM who never reported on it. The allegations were portrayed as if he himself tortured the woman. It's interesting to read up on it and claims that the woman's lawyer was paid by Metodo 3, the company involved in the search for Madeleine.

Tin foil hats indeed.