We took our eye off the ball and now DS is...

[DustinTheTurkey]

I don't even know what he is. Or who. He's not even a teenager yet and I probably shouldn't have posted on this board, but he's just a few months off 13 so hopefully someone here will have some advice.

He's smart, popular and has always been just fine, no real problems at all. He started secondary school in September and it seems to have just spiralled from there. I hate the phrase "he's fallen in with a bad crowd" but that's exactly what's happened and we had no idea. He had a small group of friends all through primary school. We knew them and their parents and all was good. He got a phone for his 12th birthday and we have family sharing on it, only age-appropriate apps, regular checks by us etc. In the last few months we've noticed he's so moody, doesn't want to spend any time with us, often cheeky mumbling under his breath that sort of thing. Ususal hormone stuff we thought. He's not allowed out mid week, but on weekends we'd allowed him to go to the local skatepark and out and about on his bike with his pals. A few months ago I allowed him to have an Instagram account and I follow it. Pics and videos of him doing wheelies and jumps on the bike, that sort of thing. But he'd created a new instagram account so I was stupidly following the sanitised one.

Turns out he's now part of what seems like (or they act like) a gang. We don't know any of these boys, but we've been given a heads-up on a few of them and they're trouble. And now he is too. He's been vaping, hanging around an underpass with fires lighting, setting fire to deodorant cans (that he has stolen from DH bathroom!) We've seen videos of them doing this, heard repulsive language and seen photos of them with their stupid 'gang' hand gestures. He had told us he was out with his 'old' friends but he wasn't, he's basically ditched them for this new lot and seems to be totally infatuated with them.

We don't know what to do to get him back on track. We've removed his phone and made him delete his social media accounts. He's grounded for the next few weeks. But we've no idea how to handle this going forward. We don't want to keep him under house arrest but we know we can't trust him. He doesn't seem to be able to tell one word of truth! And we know that the draw back to these boys is so strong that if we give him any chance to meet them he will.

Has anyone else managed to get their boy back on the right path? Any suggestions or words of wisdom? We are beside ourselves with worry and so full of shame and guilt that we let this happen

I don't have direct experience in this area, but two friends have told me of their own near brush with a different future after falling into the wrong crowd.

One is in the armed forces these days. He was 'saved' (his words) by his godfather giving him a metaphorical kick up the backside and asking him what sort of future he wanted. He became the first member of his family to go to university and has had a very successful career.

The other is a teacher in an area with lots of ethnic minority kids and, when he first started teaching (1990s) there were not so many ethnic minority or male teachers around, so he became and important role model for local boys. When he was a teenager he was getting sucked into some pretty unpleasant gang culture. Again, a conversation (this time someone at his church) caused him to think again. He realised he could sneak off early and no one noticed he had gone before the trouble started. By the time he was a qualified teacher the rest of that crowd were in jail or had been in jail. None had a qualification to their name. What both these men had in common was that it wasn't Mum or Dad who opened their eyes. It was a conversation with a man from outside the immediate family who was a bit younger than their parents.

I have no idea what I would do in your shoes. Run? Move to the Isle of Skye, buy him a bike and hope he turns into Danny MacAskill? I know it isn't that simple, but I understand your emotional turmoil.

This is not normal teen behaviour. He isn’t even a teen.

I’ve had 4 teens. None of them even went anywhere much at 12.

I’ve been a secondary school teacher for 25 years. What you are talking about is unusual. He is in Year 7 or 8 ?The majority 95% are still babies. I cannot stress this enough. Still into Minecraft or other childish stuff. 5% or more look 2% like this in my school.

I would have him assessed for ADHD.

Again I'd like to thank each of you for taking the time to reply, it is so helpful to hear other people's opinions especially those who have had similar experiences.

One mistake you are making is using terminology such as, he is easily led, impressed by their antics etc. Sorry talk like that is bollocks. He’s not ‘in with a bad crowd’, he IS the bad crowd...and by choice. It’s not an issue of him being influenced against his will, it’s a case of him wanting to be there.
I agree with this, which is why DH and I are so shaken by it all. So please don't think we are minimising or excusing him. However, I know now that some of the boys have been in a lot of trouble before, been suspended etc. whereas DS honestly has never been. So while they are absolutely on the same path right now, it's fair to say the others are further along it and we hope that means we've caught this on time and can steer DS away.

@CorianderQueen your post has really struck a chord and DH and I know we need to get more tech savvy than what we are. The laughable thing is that both of us have a strong tech background and DH works in an IT environment, but the day to day stuff that teens do on their phones is definitely something we need to up our game with and before we even consider giving him back his phone or access to anything that's something we'll have to box off.

To @PrincessBuggerPants @Frenchdressing @ScottishLassie91 and @Spiderbaby8 (and any others I've missed) thank you for the perspective. We realise we are out of touch with what counts as normal teen behaviour nowadays and this gives some hope that maybe it's not as bad as we'd feared, though in our minds it's definitely something that needs to be nipped in the bud.

This past few evenings DS has spent time with us just watching tv and generally hanging out. He's been drawing which he's really good at but hasn't done for a while, so that was good to see.

I know all this sports stuff is hampered by Covid but just putting it out there as another idea. Absolutely, it's a great idea and we are fully behind that. We've been chatting to him about what other activities he could do, given that so many things are on hold here at the moment (Ireland has had one of the strictest lockdowns in Europe) He says he'd love to do boxing, I'm in two minds about this but maybe it would be good for him? I suggested some one to one sessions with a trainer and he was open to that so maybe that's the route to go for now. We've also suggested swimming (he had been doing lane training up until March) and while not hugely keen on it I think he'd go if we just told him it's happening. Cadets etc. sound fantastic but unfortunately aren't an option where we are.

He knows that it will be a long time before he gets his phone back or access to social media and that he has to earn back our trust. But he also knows (as we tell him) that he's much loved and we think the world of him and want what's best for him.

Apologies again for a very long post but you've all been so kind to take the time to reply I wanted to make sure you could see that we're taking all advice on board. Hopefully I will come back some time with a positive update!

Good luck!

@TheEmojiFormerlyKnownAsPrince that sounds amazing at your school

Our local kids often start doing weed and spice and problems by age 13

Most parents are oblivious, totally not aware. But I walk my dog in a field where loads of the kids hang out at summer, and it was not very “naice” at all to see what year 8 and 9s get up to!

Some are maybe still into Minecraft though, undoubtedly

One of DS old friends from cricket was a dealer by age 14

Don’t see that round there at all. It’s a nice area though. That’s so sad😕

I don’t think being in a nice area makes any difference? Often these teenagers have more money and more opportunities to get into trouble?

We are also in a very nice area

One of the nicest leafy comps here

Nice, as in “naice” as in Middle class, means kids have money for drugs

I was shocked when I saw it with my own eyes

I had been oblivious until then! My teen DC said parents don’t know anything as we’re out of touch , ...worrying about our kids grades and violin lessons

It was a rude awakening

MN could have probably told me already...

County lines target all the nice areas too

My dd attends my school. Her and her friends don’t really go out. She’s 14. I see a few hanging round in the nearby park, but not many.

We’re in Tier 3 though

Spice at 13. Crikey....

My work colleagues daughter got mixed up with county lines.. she was in year 8 and groomed by a year 11 who was heavily involved in it. She was besotted with him and ended up running away with him age 13! A few days later she came home and was luckily found by police. Lovely family, who were utterly helpless.. don’t be naive to think it doesn’t happen even in leafy suberbs, it does. Her family went through hell..

Could you look at The Order of Malta cadets? Theyre not running at the moment but it's a very low cost way of getting them into something that is teaching them a skill, giving them a purpose and making them a part of a community.

@Esspee

Any chance you could change schools? We sent ours privately to avoid this problem. Worked beautifully.

And when teens are not at their private schools what are they doing with their free time (even though they have less of it)?

Where there are teens there are challenges and boundary pushing, you can’t pay your way out of problems. Sure there may be the resources to contain some behaviours but I’ve not seen evidence that problem for problem private schools deal with things better, in fact, I would say they have a number of financial motivations to overlook certain poor behaviour and are not held to account in quite the same way. Drugs are a problem at many private schools. Could it be that your children would have swerved trouble wherever they’d gone to school @Esspee ?

We found out this evening that two of the other boys are pupils at a private (with huge fees) school in another town so I don't think being in a naice private school really makes much difference unfortunately.

@Pogmaasal thank you we will look into that 👍🏻

YouokHun Perhaps we are fortunate that an interest in golf developed at the same time so their spare time was spent at the golf club where the Juniors were kept in check by the Senior members. As to private schools being more lenient, that certainly was not our experience. A friend of their's was caught smoking (tobacco), parents were called in and I can assure you he never attempted a fag behind the sport's pavilion again. Another bunked off one afternoon to meet up with a girlfriend. He was almost expelled despite the father being a major financial contributor to the school. He was demoted from head boy.
The main advantage was expectations. Every child was expected to go to Uni. There were no disruptive kids. One warning to parents and they were out. They used their energy on sports. They had ex addicts come and talk to them about drugs. Successful business people gave talks on careers and told them that any type of criminal record could have serious consequences.

We weren't wealthy but the sacrifices were worth it.

Has anything changed at home? Is it possible anything traumatic happened that you don’t know about? (Worse case scenario). Communication and firm sensible boundaries are the key. Phones are a nightmare.

Oh this is my son to a t! He’s almost 14. Has always been challenging. He has never faired well with authority I.e myself, dad, school. It’s almost like he gets a kick out of fighting back. He has always been in trouble at school for general things like lack of motivation and forgetfulness, interrupting that kind of thing. Now before having my son I always blamed parents. I always thought it was down to lack of discipline but my god I’ve been taught this isn’t the case! We tried everything!
Now lately he has been knocking around with some lads at school. The cocky types. It turns out my son has become a bully and has been picking on someone because his friend has been egging him on to do it. I took his phone. The language I read my son using is disgusting. He has been on report the past 4 weeks and has had everything took away from him. He has been told to find a new group of friends. I am going to put him in multiple after school clubs (army cadets etc) to focus his attention. I will never drop the ball again. Boys are bloody difficult! Everyone I know says the same! They will do anything to impress peers they deem’cool’.I guess my rant was just to make u feel like u aren’t alone and to have a bit of a moan myself! Good luck and stay firm!

I was never in the wrong crowd, but I think that was partly because I joined air cadets when I was 13. I was in it for 4 years, and it took over my life. They expected us to do stuff with them at weekends - parades, sports, camps etc and sessions were on twice a week. I didn’t have time for trouble! We got to go flying, shooting, crawling around in the mud and I met so many people. I also learnt a lot of skills like map reading, first aid, did my duke of Edinburgh... Everyone had a sense of pride and discipline, and everyone was very competitive at being the best, and there was a lot of support to join the forces. Obviously it wouldn’t be allowed to be on in a lot of areas right now, but maybe you could see if something similar would be on after lockdown. Or even just something like karate etc.

Yes back on the ball. Get savvy with parental control. You can ban websites, limit time, etc. As others suggested, get him in some organised activity away from these "friends". You will have to invest your time and energy but hopefully will be worth it. Maybe get his dad to spend more time with him. I have a 13 years who is very challenging in a different way. I keep a keen and constant eye on his online activity. Annoying but there isn't other way.

*Eyes back on the ball

Hi I’m 19 and I will say unfortunately preteens and kids are growing up very early these days.

Why don’t you invite one of these boys over at a time for dinner and get to know them- obviously don’t be horrid to them! take an interest in their life, ask what primary school they went to, where they live, what there parents do. Just be lovely and welcoming- they could be just like your son and putting on this front to be popular.

If your son isn’t allowed to do x y z then why not make your house the place to be- weekly console night (video games) with pizza/ favourite food etc. These boys hanging out at your house will hopefully ingrain a bit of respect into their behaviour. I doubt they’re going to be vaping with an adult around or swearing either and you always have leaverage; if you use language like that in my house...etc then they won’t be coming around this week etc.

I would suggest clubs and opportunities away from this group of boys. It maybe dorky and he might hate it but volunteering is always a great thing to do to humble anyone.

I volunteered in children’s clubs and a special needs school at that age and the humbling experience definitely made me more mature. Any other volunteers they meet through this is likely to be other good kids that are lovely and will be good influences.

Get him into a sport that will consume him! With aspiring players that have a laugh outside of playing, get private lessons in whatever and meeting cool people (maybe a girl could help!) He won’t want to associate with the others. Sailing, horse riding (polo is awesome but hellish expensive), swimming, martial arts, racing or anything ‘cool’. And change schools worst case. That would be my choice. He’ll soon see you have to earn to play and the best play hardest.

My son was a total nightmare from aged 13 onwards; drink; drugs; bad crowd; disappearances; police; lies; house trashing ...I could go on!!

As parents we floundered, tried our best. struggled through, made mistakes, tried to communicate, got right, got it wrong, cried a lot! We didn't focus on school work, exams and all that. \We focused on kindness, honesty, integrity...sometimes we saw glimmers of the son we knew before the teenage stuff started! It gave us hope.

He is now 40 years old, married, two children, good job and happy! I still wonder how the hell we got through it and how he got to where he is now. Where there is life there is hope!