I cant do it anymore. DS14 is destroying me

[Dumbledorker]

I cant even find the words to write how bad it is. Im scared this is relentless and there is no way out of this ongoing hell with him. How do you deal with feeling like you have a sociopathic child who will never change only get worse. Im so scared I will lose him either through him eventually taking his own life because he feels so hated and alone or that in the future I will have to cut ties with him because of how he is. I hate writing this about my own son. He is the sweetest kid at times but when everyone is gone and its just me and him then its different. Its when he cant have his own way he doesnt react like a normal moody teenager its just nasty, physiological abuse.. he will stand for sometimes hours giving me a speech that seems like its out of a play like an actor would talk like... he will sit in my bedroom while I try to sleep until I give in and give him his WiFi privileges or PlayStation. I used to have to just give in so I felt safe but because ive reached out for help in the last few months I've started to regain control and be consistent so things can go on all night and I won't give in to his demands. Tonight its bedtime at 11 as its the weekend. This has led to him refusing and sitting laughing at me in the living room so I gave him a warning and said he has to go to bed or his priviliges (WiFi and ps4) will be taken tomorrow.. he says I have no control and im a shit mum. So I go upstairs and take the console and from there hes tried take it back and then took the hdmi cable out of the back of the TV so I cant watch it when hes in bed. Ive tried to get the cable back and hes dramatically fallen and said ive physically abused him so ive taken the ps4 to the neighbours who is my friend and helps me. I came back and he has locked me out with my little girls still in the house, he picked up a knife gesturing that he's going to kill himself ive rung 999. They have come out and told him he needs to follow my rules under my roof and listen to me. Theyve asked me to keep an eye on him through the night..they referred back to SS again although we are already under the local family hub for support and camhs who have said its behavioural not mental health. He told the officers hes out the knife back and was upset. This is the 3rd time they've come out in 2 weeks. Hes since been downstairs a million times telling me I am no mum to him anymore and he's done with me. He scares his sisters when he's like this i can't have them watching all this anymore. Ive tried so much to help him but im exhausted and broken. I cant possibly write everything that is happening i just need to know if anyone else is like this or if it gets better. Its hell .

Has he always been like this OP? What was he like as a small child? It could be that he has an anti-social personality disorder. If it’s psychopathy then he will have been born like that and there’s very little you can do to change him. If it’s sociopathy, then it could be a response to some kind of early trauma.

Other people have mentioned ODD, ASD, ADHD, and psychosis. But I’d be inclined to explore APD first because the deliberate harming of animals, holding his sisters hostage with a knife and the ‘dirty protests’ with his urine, are all such massive red flags and far beyond what is usual or indicative behaviour for those with autism or similar.

Your priority really needs to be protecting your girls. They are being terrorised in their own home - the place they ought to feel safest. You are being terrorised too. This is an untenable situation and can’t continue. It sounds like he poses a very real risk to you all. I feel that this is way beyond the remedy of Xbox sanctions and stern reprimands.

Mine has been very similar. CAHMS were ok but much more let him game it calms him down than my approach had been.

Mine is probably asd and has always shown signs. We have had the violence, the extended yelling, the fake falls, self harm, threats.

Recently things are much better. I have softened some rules and have accepted that onthe edge of going off on one that he can’t process anything. I never try to engage or react. I often offer a ‘bribe/distraction ’ in a when you finish gaming - midnight at ours and he is first off amount his friends- come and have a snack with me, see what we could do tomorrow... i think the therapeutic recommendations are good. The posters saying into care/ would be sectioned as a adult/ should be have no knowledge of the systems. My younger ones have been scared and hurt but things are much better there too - maturity is part of this. Wish you well.

Op I feel so awful for you, this sounds horrendous. I do think you need to make your daughters and yourself safe, but I also think this young boy is also your child and there must be a reason he's behaving like this. It's so sad. BUT it's deeply worrying as others have said it does sound like he has psychopathic traits. I think this is too much (and too dangerous) for you to deal with by yourself. I would be ringing police, ss whoever I could every time there was an incident. My heart absolutely goes out to you

Hi Op,i haven't read all the thread but I do know how you feel. I'm a single mum of a 19yr old ds and 12yr old with aspergers.
All I can say is when mine yet angry and I feel a bit intimidated ( older son punched his wardrobe door in,younger shouting at me) is to really chose my battles.

Sometimes I've backed right down and gone in with a sympathetic approach and offered a hug. And tell them it will all be ok. Sort of offering an olive branch. It's worked so far.
My 12yr old loves his xbox but with lockdown i'm allowing a lot more time on it. But he has to walk the dog around the block and get out for a bit first. Can you go for a walk together? Maybe chat and he can open up,it's a lot less pressure than talking face to face.
Perhaps ask him what time he thinks he should go to bed and his reason for this ie is he an early waker and doesn't need a lot of sleep? As it's lock down you could say ok,another half an hour just to feel he has a little bit of control?
I don't know really but I know being a single mum of teen boys is really hard. You're doing a good job x

Are mental health services involved? Some of what you said is similar to my 13yo. We have a lot of mental health support from a psychiatrist and therapy team. He's been hospitalized 3 times... But things are steadily getting better.

It's extraordinarily hard. So I get it.

I'd invest in a code lock for your house. My son can't (and hasn't tried... But still) lock me out. I just type a code in and the lock opens. I can't actually lock and unlock from my phone if need be.

Thankyou so so much for all your replies i haven't read through yet but I will reply properly soon when I get 10 mins for a coffee and a cig to read through and respond. I dont even smoke anymore but bought as pack much needed. I am safe though. Just so you aren't all worried. He has gone out with a friend im just having to run a thousand errands today but just needed to hop on and let you know im not ignoring

@Dumbledorker

Thankyou so so much for all your replies i haven't read through yet but I will reply properly soon when I get 10 mins for a coffee and a cig to read through and respond. I dont even smoke anymore but bought as pack much needed. I am safe though. Just so you aren't all worried. He has gone out with a friend im just having to run a thousand errands today but just needed to hop on and let you know im not ignoring

I’d put him in the car drive to his dads tell him to get out and drive off.

His dad can stay in a hotel with him if he needs too.

It’s all well and good people being a ‘rock’ over the phone but his dad needs to step in and give you some respite.

I have three kids. If the older one was locking me out and wandering around the house with a knife and my other younger kids were trapped outside - they would have to leave the house.

Take a bone off a dog and by Jesus you will get their attention.

The PS4 is so important to him because his friends are there. They are his tribe, his connection, what's important to him in his life. That cannot be dismissed or rubbished by others as just 'gaming'.
In some ways they are his 'family' and community, and in some ways they can help 'hold' him while he is in this tricky phase of teenage hood. He has a side of this story as well but he has no where to go.

When he is angry, and acts out, you desert him. He is 'left'. Just like his birth dad and his step dad. He is abandoned in those moments.
Likewise when he is angry with you, you experience this as rejection by a loved one. You feel abandoned in those moments.

I fear you are projecting onto him feelings you have had about other men in your life.
Have you had counselling yourself?

This stomping around in the middle of the night ripping out cables has to stop. There has to be compromise with him. Things seem to escalate very quickly and your own behaviour is a factor in that.
You are a mature woman, he is a 14yr old boy, but both of you act like younger kids in these rows.

Your son is never going to be the male support in your life that you never really got.

Hiding stuff in your room actually brings him 'closer' to you and the lonely part of you wants his attention. Fighting is a great way to get attention.

As the other poster said, sometimes you have to Stop. Pause. and just turn to him and offer him love and understanding.
Do the opposite of what your anger is telling you to do. You may need counselling yourself to stop reacting so dramatically to him.

This is a pivotal time in his life, it's a make or break for him. Get a Family Therapist and both of you go and see that person. Do this so both of you can have a valued life with fewer arguments and less visits by the police.

So fucking patronising and sanctimonious Seaweed42

I think you need to put him in care to protect your daughters.

I think seaweed has a point. I have a son with ASD and normal rules dont always apply. I can not punish by removing his computer as that is his world, his safety, his means of communication. He is aggressive (with knives) when he is anxious and scared. Fight or flight. It's not easy but you need professional guidance and diagnosis so you know what you are dealing with. Xx

@ Seaweed42 i have no idea what you read to come up with that!

@Seaweed42 I think it’s a little more complex than his mum taking away his game console. Did you read that he has purposely hurt a pet at his father’s house?

@Seaweed42

** Think of what toy/item/device/trip/phone DS would absolutely love. Then say you will swap the dummy for that. Tough shit if its expensive, its your own faults for leaving it so long.
It'll literally only take a couple of nights of whinging and whining from him. Keep reassuring him it'll be absolutely by the end of the week.**

I’m struggling to reconcile your upthread advise to the OP with advise you gave re an 8 year old giving up the dummy.

For substantially younger child, you are suggesting much stricter tactics than that which you are saying is unacceptable in this scenario.

@Seaweed42 that is the biggest load of psychobabble bollocks I've ever read in my life

Up thread I mentioned getting help from a Psychiatrist or Pead, because they can medicate. We also see a Psychologist fortnightly, they are good with suggesting strategies and pin pointing some issues. But progress is very slow. Whilst the medication (antidepressants) made a very quick improvement. I think both types of professional intervention are needed and complement one another. Also, consider your own mental health, your GP can support you with that. If your son does have (undiagnosed) Pathological Demand Avoidance, he will require very different parenting to other children. The PDA Society has some very good info and webinars - www.pdasociety.org.uk/resources/resource-category/webinars-and-videos/

The truth is to get the help you need you will have to muster all the energy and fight you have. Your DS will not be detainable under the MH act as he does not have a diagnosis or suspected mental illness.
You could seek support from SS however at this stage they will probably just refer you to family support which although may help you to identify patterns of behaviour and provide some parenting tips your DS sounds as if he needs more support than this.
If you call children services and state to them they you do not want to parent him and request for them to remove him from your care they will not like this. They will come up with a 100 reasons why this is your responsibility as his parent to care for him as you have PR. They may also question your ability to take care of your DDs if you state that you can’t care for your son. However, I would read and learn the criteria of both CAMHS and S17 childrens act and request an assessment. Get the school involved and badger the headteacher about how much support you need. Let the GP know and ask of he can write a letter to social services and CAMHs. Request CAMHs complete a jigsaw assessment. Every time DS is abusive or aggressive call the police. Keep a diary as it is often difficult to recall every incident.

I don’t want to sound negative but services are over stretched and under resources. Those parents who get the support they need are those who know the law, are articulate and able to advocate for their family. Be a nuisance.

Has the OP been back?
Some really good advice

What games does your DS play on the PS4?
What porn does he watch?
Does he smoke pot or do any other drugs?

Agree with Contrary's advice about trying really hard to connect with him. Crocheting sounds brilliant and it's his own idea. There are tutorials online (American crochet is a bit more intuitive to follow imo). Cook together. Eat together. If you have a garden, work there together. Teach him to use the washing machine - a sense of competence is a builder of self esteem.

Boys need physical activity to burn off energy and they need to feel part of a family/tribe/group/team. Find whatever will make the family a unit and emphasise the family/team part of life. Can you take up running - maybe a couch to 5k programme the pair of you could do together? Could his dad join in?

Meanwhile, you need to get his dad to address the issue of peeing all over the toilet. That has to stop. It is a grossly disrespectful gesture.

OP I’m so sorry to hear this, it sounds like a horrible & difficult situation. I don’t think it’s safe to have him in the house & I would recommend taking him to hospital and asking for emergency psychiatric care. The sooner you can get an intervention the better, for his and your family’s safety

Whatever you do, he will argue with you. Lockdown is difficult for teenagers and gaming is a way of communicating with friends. But rather than threatening removing that benefit, how about it being more of a reward? If you do x and x you get your console no problem. I think yo7 need to choose your battles a bit, and grey rock a bit. Make sure he has food to eat, clean clothes etc etc. I'm not sure you can change him tbh and all this is diverting from your daughter/s. You need to look after yourself too.

“I don’t want to sound negative but services are over stretched and under resources. Those parents who get the support they need are those who know the law, are articulate and able to advocate for their family. Be a nuisance.”

^I agree totally with this advice. It’s not fair that people should have to push so hard for what they need, but the reality is often this is the quickest way to get support.

Thankyou for all your help i will start replying now that ive finally managed to sit down. Its been a very very long day but now im wide awake again

Oh bless you, hope you’re ok. Don’t worry about replying, just take on board anything useful and get your butt to bed for a good nights sleep. We’ll all still be here tomorrow!

@MumsGoneToIceland

I believe a previous poster mentioned this but can you ask CAMHS to assess him for PDA and ODD? These are not widely recognised and they may not have considered it. Has he always been difficult to manage? I have long suspected (since 3 or4) that my now 12 year has some degree of PDA. - regular extreme meltdowns (not just normal tantrums), never happy, everything has to be exactly as she needs it to be and when she needs it to be and can’t cope with any deviation from that and because we haven’t given in to that, daily our lives are a nightmare.. She will literally argue black is white or that you never said something that you definitely did and was a direct face to face conversation. She just won’t take no for an answer and will follow us around the house goading us, trying to manipulate and control us until we give in (which like you we don’t but boy do we pay for it). Can’t be flexible on anything etc.

She is not as bad as your son (no knives) but then she’s not 14 yet and I am dreading that However she did verbally threaten to stab herself in the heart with a knife on 3 occasions.. We sat her down and warned her after the 1st occasion, the seriousness of threats like that and if she said it again we’d have to get others involved. On the 3rd occasion, my husband picked her up put her in the car and took her to A and E where she was spoken to by a psychologist. She’s not done that again since. She has been a bit better since lockdown and I think that’s because a lot of our problems are that she can’t cope with the pressure of school So am partly dreading when they go back. She’s just had some youth counselling through the NHS but that wasn’t the right thing as she didn’t engage. We are waiting on a referral now for family counselling.

I would strongly recommend reading up on PDA and ODD and see if any ring true

We have recently found the PDA society website and I am going to sign up on some online courses when I get some breathing space. There is also a PDA Facebook page which I’ve joined, where parents are posting their experiences and giving advice which may help you.

Gosh this does ring true... il check it all out properly thankyou