DD sex with friend

[BelleJinx]

My DD (17) stayed at a friends after a party on Friday. Her best friend and her best friends boyfriend stayed in one room and my DD, another girl and 2 boys stayed in another. There were only 2 beds but because they were all a bit drunk, they had one girl and one boy in each bed.
My DD stayed in the bed of a boy she has liked for over a year and they regularly have kissed at parties but never dated or done anything past kissing. She admitted to me that one thing led to another and they had sex.
I was shocked at this because although DD has had sex with boyfriends in the past, she never had casual sex with someone she is not dating (least that im aware of). How would you react if this was your DD?

Math, if the boy was more drunk than the girl, would you be saying that the girl sexually assaulted him? What should the OP do if that's the case?

Dione I think I already suggested upthread that the question of drinking and impaired judgement needs to be addressed. Drinking at unsupervised parties and having sex that you do not anticipate and don't know how to deal with afterwards on an emotional level is not healthy behaviour. There are many obvious pitfalls, for both boys and girls alike. The conversation on drinking and impaired judgement would cover that I should think.

Stillwishihadabs and Saintly I think coaching of teens in saying yes or saying no is very necessary.

Slithy -- your communication with your DH is your own business. But consent remains central to the issue of rape, and there is such a crime as spousal rape. You cannot extrapolate from your own experience of sex with your husband that sex between two drunk teens could not have been rape.

Math, while you have a point about drinking etc. That was not my question. If the boy was more drunk than the girl would you say that she sexually assaulted him?

The OP says her DD described herself as 'a little bit drunk'.

That does not sound as if she was intoxicated to the point of being incapable of giving consent.

OP, if your DD has not suggested that she was assaulted, or said anything to make you suspect it, then I don't think you should pursue that at all.

Instead by thankful she can talk to you, and try to be non-judgmental whilst supporting her through the emotional anxiety she seems to be experiencing. A gentle nag about safe sex may also be in order.

Personally I think she needs to initiate contact to discuss this and if he refuses then that tells her everything she needs to know about him.

I didn't do that math.

And my experience tells you that your assertion If you did not give explicit consent then what you are talking about is rape is incorrect.

Very unkind of you math to turn this thread into something it wasn't, effectively preventing the op from getting the support she came for.

Slithy -- Would you not wish to consider the implications of a DD saying she was a little drunk (whatever that means) and having unprotected sex pretty much as soon as you hit the bed, with someone you had never had sex with before or even had a dating relationship with before? If not why not? Even if you wouldn't, you still don't know if the OP would worry about that possibility.

I can't believe people here would not be concerned about all the possibilities if a daughter of theirs was apparently in a position where beds were allocated and sex was had without protection after a party where unknown amounts were drunk by the partygoers. How is what I posted not supportive? What value judgements are going on here about sex and drinking, and sex and consent?

Dione -- that is a matter for another thread and purely speculative.

Apparently this is not how this incident happened.

However, if she had had sex with him without consent then this would have been a sexual assault.

www.bandbacktogether.com/male-sexual-assault-resources/

It is important to note that women who experience rape feel the same after effects as described on that site for male victims of sexual assault, all except one.

Decreased self-esteem, self-confidence, or development of negative body image
Feelings of shame, anger, guilt, and self-blame
Difficulties trusting others, especially those who share the gender of their abuser
Sexual difficulties
Difficulties with intimacy
Self-destructive impulses
Confusion or questions about sexual identity and masculinity
Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder

A 17 year old girl who ends up in bed perhaps not quite willingly and has sex perhaps not quite willingly even once could end up feeling any or all of those effects. A parent should be alert to the possibility that her daughter may experience those effects so as to be able to lend support.

www.gov.uk/government/statistics/an-overview-of-sexual-offending-in-england-and-wales
'Around 90 per cent of victims of the most serious sexual offences in the previous year knew the perpetrator, compared with less than half for other sexual offences.'

Almost converse situation as the mother of a son:

Last week ds (18) went to a party with gf and lots of friends. They all had a drink and went back to gf's house. The friends slept on various floors, sofas and spare beds. At gf's invitation DS slept in her room. So, by Math's definition that makes my ds a rapist .

(Math: As a mother of a son old enough to have sex, I have spoken very clearly to him about consent and ds agrees with me strongly. I have also mentioned alcohol and consent and how it might be difficult to be sure someone is making a clear decision even if they appear 'keen'. His response: FFS mum, I'm not a rapist.)

It horrifies me that young men can be villified to the extent that they are called rapists when they have mutually consensual sex with someone they know and like. If I were you OP, I'd be talking to your dd about why she would want to have sex with a boy she's not sure where she stands with and about carrying a condom in her bag.

You sound a lovely mum. She sounds a lovely dd. Hope this all leads to a positive outcome for her (with the boy if that's what she wants).

You needed to say it once math. Not rabbit on and on chasing the op away in the process.

Math my question doesn't need a thread. It only requires one word. Yes or No.

Math, why are you so sure the girl didn't consent and the boy did?

I stand accused of chasing away the OP?

A ridiculous assertion.

I suggested to the OP that it might be a good idea to explore the area of consent.

I asked because it was not clear at all whether consent was expressed, or whether the girl was too drunk to give consent.

The reason to ask is so that the girl does not get caught up in what can be rather soul-destroying behaviour, a perception she could experience both at the time and in hindsight a few years hence.

I am sure no mother would like her daughter to look back regretfully years from now at what she calls 'poor communication', or suffer feelings of guilt or self-loathing or shame, when intervention along the lines of a reminder that no girl has to go along with sleeping arrangements she doesn't want and no girl has to do anything more than she really wants to in terms of sex even if she ends up in bed with someone.

....
Sorry Dione but that's my answer.

Oh shut up. What you are saying isn't 'empowering or informing' as its under entirely the wrong context.

All you're doing is preaching to people who don't need to be preached to.

Yes, we know what rape is thanks. It's not the same as having a one night stand.

I can't believe that you are still banging your drum about this. Start your own bloody thread if you want to discuss the semantics of assault.

Those of us who have daughters -- we have told them all of that, right? They know they can call us any time day or night and get a lift home from a party they are not comfortable in, right? They know they do not have to have sex or go along with sex to avoid hurting feelings or because they feel uncomfortable saying the word No...

I don't think you know what rape is, actually.

And it is not in fact a suggestion in the wrong context.

The only thing that distinguishes rape from sex is consent. It is not clear that a girl who was too drunk to insist on protection was capable of consent.

90% of rapists are known to the victim and many rapes happen at parties in exactly the circumstances described by the OP.

If you are trying to dispute the fact that many teen girls are raped at parties after drinking, then you need to adjust your idea of what constitutes rape.

Not ALL teens. It is still a minority.

Stop scare mongering.

The OP reports that her DD used MAP the next day and appeared to take on board suggestions that the DD should get tested for stds. If this is a regular occurrence, then her DD needs to be sat down and talked to about her sex life, and the importance of protection.

I suspect since the OP did not report that she or DD had already considered the need for std testing that the DD has used protection when she has previously had sex with boyfriends, and that drinking played a part in the lack of protection on this particular night, along with not anticipating having sex and therefore not having a condom in her pocket. If she brought a few condoms to a party and didn't use them then the question 'why not' needs to be asked. If she didn't bring condoms but had sex anyway, then the question 'why' needs to be asked. This is not the first time this girl has had sex; she is not inexperienced and presumably has taken her health seriously in the past.

I do not understand how so many posters on this thread have completely dismissed the role of alcohol in this incident and are seemingly willing to dismiss the fact that alcohol can play a part in impairing judgement when it comes to protection.

How is it scaremongering to suggest that a girl might be raped at a party that is not apparently supervised by responsible adults, where the attendees are drinking, and where sleeping arrangements will include beds shared with the opposite sex?

I am frankly gobsmacked by the irresponsibility shown by people I assume are parents here.