Les Parisiennes des Mamansnet: Always Have a Ball Gown at the Ready in Celebration of Your Enemy's Demise

[botemp]

Lovers of Parisian style and fashion with a conscious mindset and lots of chatter in between.

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Favoured Parisian addresses:

Second Hand Shops

Outlets

Favoured London addresses:

Charity Shops, Dress Agencies, and Outlets

Favoured NYC addresses:

Consignment shops, Vintage, and Restaurants

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Previous threads:

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Huit

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It was kind of Mary Poppins but yeah maybe with a Zorro twist. The jacket had a large peplum like an upturned saucer that reminded me of a hat Ingrid Bergman wears in Casablanca. Totally impractical under a coat but, if you could afford it, you'd probably travel by chauffeur anyway. I'll try and find a pic.

following on from red, fitted jacket will also work well with this new lust of mine. Flared sailor trousers from MH www.margarethowell.co.uk/womens/shop/trousers/sailor-trouser-flannel-black

re: technical innovation. It must have been so amazing when jersey and zips were invented. I am most in awe of the recent tech innovation in waterproof, windproof and very warm fabrics that are also lightweight. They are mostly used in sports gear though. Not that it stopped them becoming standard wear with the Silicon Valley boom... So, where next?

How are those sailor trousers needs much more buttons (the naffer the better) and an unflattering lower tummy to be classified as sailor trousers in my book.

Speaking of the Dior bar jacket, I've always appreciated the silhouette of it but never really took to it as a piece on its own. But Junya Watanabe made an inspired version in her latest collection and I'm kind of digging it. I now also know the source of the punk aesthetic, I'll just dilute it down to random ribbony bits on clothing. Don't know why I want to swan around looking like I have tentacles but I just do.

Red, yes it's very tucked away, you kind of just have to find it by accident. I'll dig out my Printemps pics later, I tried stuff on there as well, I think, might have taken pics of that too.

tentacles over crinolines! yes!! [over to studying the history of the bar jacket]

Uniqlo U preview is up here and it includes a tentacle hobo/bucket bag that looks interesting. And once again there's the culottes/gaucho confusion on the UK/US sites respectively and I'm fairly sure they're neither...

Pics from the Printemps secondhand floor, this only part of it there were large separate spaces to the left and right of it as well. I think the installation was something recycled as well. I need to blur out my fave on the try on pics so I'll add those later. I didn't take many pictures of the view, it was a rainy grey day.

Thanks for the Uniqlo U heads up bo, I'd been thinking only the other day that there should be one due. I like quite a lot of things but with most of them, I think I've already got a similar and probably better version. I might send for the jeans though - they look a similar shape to some I bought a couple of years ago that I still really like, and a second pair would be useful.
I'll also be tempted by one of the mannish cardigans if they turn out to be 100% wool, but I think that, if I did get another, I'd look for an un-mannish colour, like rose pink or emerald green. The culottes/gauchos seem to be in a jersey fabric so that's a no from me. That drawstring bag could I suppose be a gateway into my smaller-bag life, but I think I'll bide my time on that.

Just to pick up again on the idea of recycling fashion so that we enter a period of no fashion, but styling only. I also noticed today the news that Selfridges aims to have 50% of its activities (by 2030) in the areas of re-use, re-cycle, re-fill and rent. And eBay now has celebrity ambassadors. And celebrities starting shop on depop/etc as signalling eco-recycling and boosting their relationships with fans.

So what does it all mean? Also taking into account bo's linked article from business vogue about the volume of buying not diminishing when people shift to second hand, because they still crave novelty

Despite the idea that it will be "classics" that are constantly re-sold, wouldn't it rather be that basics and structural classics will be bought new(ish) and kept until they fall apart, and what will be in circulation need to be more spectacular stuff, that one can only wear a few times as it is too memorable/impactful? No need to rebuy white shirts and black trousers, or the workhorse blazer. But things that look good on social media, colourful, big, theatrical etc, from different periods (for styling). We could end up with two completely separate systems [fantasies, fantasies]

I think this is the whole silo thing, on here it's mostly the ones that'll buy into the classics, buy better buy once, etc. mentality of the Guardian style section but this is a depressing read (should be paywall free unless you've already maxed out your free articles with NYT).

Priorities are different for different people and the number of people who are in the linked piece's position are the majority, and yes, social media is a major accelerating factor. There's a lot of mental gymnastics, at both ends, I'd stress. I'm far from virtuous, I'm quick to think, at least I'm not shopping at Shein. Which really isn't the achievement I make it out to be in my head, I'm just as bad just in other ways.

There's been a lot of chatter about circular economies, but I've been hearing the same chatter since I was a student and not much has been made of it. I'm not expecting any major changes anytime soon and the 'I deserve nice things too' neo liberal compromise feels very much a genie out of the bottle that isn't likely to go back in.

<Sprinkles dark clouds around>

I dunno but, speaking strictly for myself, when times are hard my instinct isn't so much to reach for the classics as to dress the hell up as much as circumstances allow. So I'm hoping where it'll all lead is a resurgence in creativity and street style. When I think of the 80s, I remember mass unemployment - at least where I was living - but wild dressing up, especially in the clubs. A lot of it wasn't preserved or even documented but there was some eye popping stuff.

But that was then and, if you'd told us that 40 years on we'd all be talking with a straight face about 'influencers' then you'd have been laughed out of town. So I'm probably being delusional.

I thought I had an account with NYT but they're saying they've never heard of me so I'll have to create another one before I can read that article. I've noticed Shein, Boohoo etc increasingly popping up in the charity shops round here and oh boy, even leaving aside the ethics, they are 100% shiny shite.

I’ve maxed out my Nyt articles, but I’d agree. We’re all performative to a degree.
there have been some major feature pieces here on the % of millennials and gen… y? who would love to be an ‘influencer’. It’s terrible - about 50%! More men than women I think which surprised me as social media on the image side seems quite women focused to me but I guess that’s all I see of it. I don’t even have TikTok.

I've stuck the NYT article in a Google doc for those struggling to access it. You'll have to do without the pictures but you're not missing out on anything:

NYT article (I'll remove it in a couple of days).

I don't know there's always been an appetite for what appears from the outside as easy money. To me being an influencer looks like a lot of hard work where most don't make it and it's neigh on impossible not to become morally bankrupt and all that at the cost of your privacy. And maybe not always your privacy as some seem to be able to operate somewhat covertly but it always involves giving away something intimate of yourself. It all just feels icky to me, although I'm thinking mostly about female influencers. Maybe the men have it better but the whole Andrew Tate thing, where to even begin with that.

Banking crisis has been my only memorable brush with economic downturn (that I remember, anyhow). There was a lot of classic talk then too, good coat, bag and boots. And red lipstick. Don't think that ever manifested either. Trying to remember when Michele's Gucci happened, very much felt like it was in response to that but it may well have been several years after that.

That is a truly depressing read. Spectacular bright fashions, but from Shein, bought in hauls (min 79 items) and then thrown away to make way for new knock-off of nice - read high-investment - brands and looks. On the other end, maxxing out on variability through buying second hand or renting, while maintaining volume of buys overall. ALL options promoted by influencers [off to dwell in apocalyptic thoughts]

It’s just an insane amount of clothes even Ignoring the whole source or cost. Even if they were free it would be So.Much. You’d have to get rid of bags weekly or the huge American house would be full! A couple of years ago I bought 4 dresses from Cos, and I remember that as knowing I shouldn’t and I should put some back but…

speaking of Cos, I don’t know if we get the ranges at the same time, but I flicked through recently and I want these. To wear together. I have no idea if fashion is currently merging the pinks but I would. (There is no way I am wearing a stretch knit dress, I would look 5 months pregnant, so it is not happening. The cardigan maybe though!) there are a few other nice cardigans, one pink burgundy colour block.

It is an insane amount but I do feel that NYT piece was a bit snobby and sought out the excesses. I have a hard time believing the 79 items haul or the just under $3K in six months were buying just for one person. Fairly sure they have men's and children (and some home stuff), if you're hauling for a large family those numbers aren't as insane. Yes, they were there to illustrate a point but they also encouraged the narrative of 'poor people don't know how to budget so it's their fault they're poor'.

Yes, the Cos ranges are the same, I'm always puzzled why Cos brings out new summer stuff at the end of it 🤷 lots of pink there but most shops seem to be going for an orange that borders on red. I do feel Cos is slipping a bit, not so much in quality (I think that's been happening for longer but it's not a massive demise, it's still easily high quality at the price point) but the pattern making is a lot less interesting and focus seems to be shifting to prints. Some interesting details here and there but a lot of the shapes are just so 'blocky' for lack of a better word. The sort of interesting shapes stuff seems to be disappearing.

I read the article. Yes I can see how it is put to highlight a massive issue. And yes, need to be careful not to think I am virtuous because I buy mostly second hand … saw that other article up thread about second hand being like fast fashion and I can definitely see that in platforms that make it look easy and cool to buy and sell. It is very easy to fall in the trap of consuming loads of on trend second hand items or selling stuff you just bought and used once, and feeling better because you sold it.

On a more positive note I really enjoyed that video of the two designers that Bo linked.

yes, Cos hasn’t been the same lately.
The uniqlo collection has a couple of interesting stuff, but I have never managed to find any that fits me/wears well from uniqlo (except some of the underwear). So I will probably not even bother.
I remember you like pink on pink times, and ages ago I got a finery dress in hot pink and if I remember correctly you suggested me to wear it with red. In fact that dress might make a come out tonight after a good 3 years I think.

Well, Liz Truss didn't live up to her closest female predecessor's fashion style in her purple/violet suit. Mmmmm. Fitted suiting and pencil skirt... I might have to retire that colour from my wardrobe

I've had a look on the Guardian and it looks navy to me, granted small picture on mobile, maybe it's a very deep purple, but not violet it's a bit Merkel in style, maybe?

Anyhow, I'm not all that invested in her wardrobe (especially since finding out she's obsessed with Instagram), I'm a lot more concerned about the inevitable gaffes (and I read she has teenaged daughters, oh boy).

Article of interest, Hadley Freeman on British Vogue/EE. I remember a thread on here in similar vein, (and she also echoes wise things Flo says all the time and my recent comment about how delightfully silly fashion can be, hmm, if she lurks, 👋 unlurk already).

I was going to link that Hadley Freeman article too, I think it's excellent. Lord knows I'd grown tired of all those old Vogue articles where writers interviewed their boarding schools chums, but I also find the solemnity and reverence that follows Enninful everywhere he goes quite . It must be especially galling for Hadley who knows from experience how fashion writers are routinely treated as both airheaded and toxic.

'This is the kind of statement only a man can make.' she says at one point. Yes indeed.

I'm disappointed too that The Guardian presumably weren't interested in publishing this, but no longer surprised.

Guardian published a feature on Enninful a couple of day ago; I quite enjoyed reading it.
www.theguardian.com/fashion/2022/sep/04/vogue-editor-edward-enninful-impostor-syndrome-is-what-drives-me

Identity politics though is politically quite limited. It is high time for more collectivity. How it translates into fashion in a way that is abundant and diverse rather than a norm and a uniform, I don't know. Bo will see some parallels in architecture I am sure

on another note, I am very pleased with the orange/rust/russet being the It colour this season (or at least one of them). I discovered it suits me amazingly

Liz Truss is wearing a navy dress by The Fold. I have it which is why I recognise it . Doesn’t crease . Called the Arlington I think . I like mine and wear it so much .

I thought that dress looked familiar @Gonegrey31 , I saw a very similar /same? In the sample sale I went last year.
But I think the purple/navy is because she might be wearing very similar dresses pictured yesterday when announced/later yesterday/today. The one she wore when she found out looks purple, but the one in the guardian photo is navy (maybe taken at different times). Anyhow, not that important really but shows how easily I am deviating from what I should be actually doing right now.
I have zero hope for what she will do … but that is not a fashion or style chat so I will shut up.

Well that tidbit of info on her dress has raised her in my esteem, if she's wearing a crease proof dress on a long day with lots of travel it at least shows she's capable of pragmatism so there may be hope yet.

No, no, no, to collectivism, my (then) 'Marxist' parents sent me to a collectivist daycare and it was a disaster. All they did was endless meetings and lots of dramaz. Don't even get me started on the safeguarding risks.

And here's another hot take, identity politics get an unnecessarily bad rep. Sure the overflow from the American culture wars are a toxic wasteland that we should extricate/keep out of as much possible but all politics is identity politics and it's neither good nor bad, it just is. Ideological adherants and lack of pragmatic attitudes is what's paralysing everything, just like at my daycare...

WRT fashion and politics, this is just my pet theory but I'm fairly convinced that the American brand of IdPol has actually separated politics from fashion. It even did so quite performatively with Trump's election and the whole kerfuffle of who would dress Melania. The thing is, when it was intertwined with politics it was always sort of humorous and/or creative in a way (Alexander McQueen was a master of it) and we could probably do with some of it again. But I'm not holding my breath, the last batch of shows and only one (Dior) made a small reference to the invasion of Ukraine, it's such a missed opportunity, the absence of it was glaring.

(Architecture and politics, eh, too complex to draw parallels with fashion, I'd need another Ted Talk)

<Goes off to mourn McQueen and grumble discontentedly that they don't make fashion designers like they used to>

Would you mind, bo, explaining in 3 sentences what you found exciting about McQueen's work?

To report [as these are my last days of relative freedom I seem to be determined to waste] I just had a quick look at Maison Margiela SS. Certainly very interesting, deconstructed clothes. I admired it a little bit, without often understanding which bit goes where, and left without buying anything. It is all very £££ and ££££ and I am not enough punk. I was struggling to see how such clothes would fit into my life as it doesn't currently include a gallery opening every Friday.

Talking about McQueen, partially, the clothes looked like what you see on fashion students going to and fro if you hang around Central Saint Martins. [hides behind my ignorance]