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Les Parisiennes des Mamansnet: Do not ask the kock about les préservatifs in the food.

991 replies

botemp · 16/08/2021 13:29

Lovers of Parisian style and fashion with a conscious mindset and lots of chatter in between.


Favoured Parisian addresses:

Second Hand Shops

Outlets

Favoured London addresses:

Charity Shops, Dress Agencies, and Outlets

Favoured NYC addresses:

Consignment shops, Vintage, and Restaurants


Previous threads:

Un

Deux

Trois

Quatre

Cinq

Six

Sept

Huit

Neuf

Dix

Onze

Douze

Treize

Quatorze

OP posts:
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261
botemp · 16/08/2021 13:33

(I tried with the title but I seem to better at making faux amis than working with them 🤷)

Seeing as we're all gathered here, Xing, I hope all goes well tomorrow Flowers here's to a speedy recovery Wine

(Fairly confident I got the date right this time, unless it changed I failed to notice, I'll shuffle off to the embarrassed corner if that's the case).

OP posts:
quirkychick · 16/08/2021 16:05

The title's good, bo. Grin

Good luck, Xing, I hope it all goes well.

I have only bought a couple of workout things from tkmaxx, so nothing very interesting here.

XingMing · 16/08/2021 16:25

Merci bien, Mariannes... a la prochaine!

banivani · 16/08/2021 18:22

Good luck Xing!!! ❤️ Thank you Bo, and good title!

Floisme · 16/08/2021 20:11

Best of luck Xing and looking forward to hearing the new wardrobe plans x

And thanks for the new thread bo, excellent title!

Redandblue11 · 16/08/2021 20:32

Couldn’t quite find the new thread!

Firstly all the best of luck, goog wishes for tomorrow dear Xing. CakeFlowersWineFlowers

And thank you for the new thread Bo.

CatherineMaitland · 16/08/2021 21:51

Just stopping by to wish you best of luck, Xing.

botemp · 17/08/2021 12:36

I've not bought much either, the Raey silk bias skirt and The Row cashmere jumper that I bought from Vinted were my last purchases a few weeks ago (very pleased with them both, Raey skirt is a bit big but has the world's shortest zip so I'm still contemplating whether it's worth altering as I'd have to put in a longer zip as well to still comfortably get it on when realistically I'll never wear it with the entire waist area on display and it's silk so a bit of errant fabric isn't that weird to see either).

I've been craving a crisp shirt though (look away Flo Wink), not necessarily white, unusual sculptural volume appears to be my hook. I first spotted what I think is a silk shirt in a Dior documentary on Arte that started the longing and now a The Row one has popped up in my inbox with a ridiculous price to match Hmm I have spotted a nice Celine one on Vinted but they want €599 for it just, no. I've been reading a specialised tailoring/sewing book on shirts instead but I've still yet to come across nice shirting fabric, closest I came was in Paris but a lot was heavily starched so no idea what it was actually like.

Les Parisiennes des Mamansnet: Do not ask the kock about les préservatifs in the food.
Les Parisiennes des Mamansnet: Do not ask the kock about les préservatifs in the food.
Les Parisiennes des Mamansnet: Do not ask the kock about les préservatifs in the food.
OP posts:
botemp · 17/08/2021 12:36

Red, was the link at the end of the last thread not working?

OP posts:
MollyVolley · 17/08/2021 18:50

How do you find your The Row purchases @botemp do you think the quality is good? Have been eyeing up them (and Toteme) on Vestiaire would you recommend?

botemp · 17/08/2021 19:32

Ahem, excuse the Ted Talk...

New, I think The Row is hugely overpriced but it's sort of a convergence of things I want all coming together and not finding it elsewhere. The Ginza sandals are holding up really well though and I wear them loads and I often curse them as they make everything look good. If I'm wearing them and trying something on in a shop I lose a bit of a critical edge as they just finish off an outfit and that quality seems to be quite rare in fashion these days. It's all about prepackaged multilayered total looks instead of one game changer so it makes a single heavy investment feel a little bit more sensible (it totally isn't).

The cashmere is gorgeous, have always thought so but also always felt it was overpriced. The quality is comparable to Johnston's of Elgin, Loro Piana, and Céline but it's better designed imo (Elgin is very traditional so not very exciting, LP is similarly traditional but I'd say feels a bit more luxe in that quintessential Italian way, and Céline can be a bit too oversized for me). Prices hold up well secondhand, I got mine for an absolute bargain, especially considering the condition but I don't usually see them under the €350 mark. If you're in Europe I can vouch for the quality of the The Row items (and other brands) carried at Odetta Vintage, they ask the earth for everything but it's all pretty much brand new but prices are comparable to end of sale prices but they're not the items you'd find in the dregs of sales.

I think the older The Row items weren't as high quality, there was a switch up at some point so if buying secondhand you have to know your labels (I avoid anything with a chain with the label for one, that's from the very early days, after that there's a font difference which is harder to discern, also where things are made), the older stuff tends to go a lot cheaper. The silks are also beautiful but delicate, not sure how confident I'd be buying that secondhand.

Not everything works for me, their 'perfect' white t shirt looks shit, some of the trouser fabrics I'm not keen on and I do think it helps if you're somewhat of an Olsen twin in shape (either petite or very slim or both).

In comparison, Toteme feels a bit like the thing you settle for when you can't afford the Row, if you buy like for like. The jumpers just aren't that instantly satisfying, the trousers are a bit of an odd fit (definitely geared towards tall and straight Scandinavians). The tailoring just isn't that spectacular, a lot of the fabrics are just a touch too thin and show everything, etc. In a sense it's much like The Row that it's hugely overpriced for what it is, but there are some great pieces with originality in between. If I had the Scandinavian tall straight up and down figure I'd be all over their jeans, they have some great jackets. I adore my silk trousers but I'm rarely tempted into anything else by them. Not something I'd be buying blind but that's probably down to not being their default body shape so it's much more high risk. I think Joseph and Raey are the better settle for less than The Row brands and Toteme you need to buy for the more out there styles that really suit you as opposed to their basics which feel just a touch to basic in comparison. St. Agni also has some nice alternatives but as they're Australian you don't see much of their stuff out here. Kujten is a Paris based direct to consumer cashmere brand, I don't own anything but by feel, the more premium priced items feel like they're batting in the same league as the big guns but at their secondhand prices.

OP posts:
MollyVolley · 17/08/2021 19:56

Thanks so much for my v. own Ted Talk Grin it's fabulous! definitely going to look at the other recommendations - you know so much Flowers

banivani · 17/08/2021 19:57

That was an excellent Ted talk!

Redandblue11 · 17/08/2021 20:07

Bo it was working but it was me with tech problems, not having the device I normally log into … not having my password… and I wanted to check in and send good wishes to Xing.
So just briefly panicking.
Here now Smile

Floisme · 18/08/2021 08:43

That's interesting about quality at The Row improving bo - there can't be many brands that can make that claim.

On the subject of shirts, I tried a half decent French Connection one on in TK Maxx: nicely oversized - the cotton was too flimsy to merit 'crisp' or 'sculptural' but it had side panels and stuff so was definitely voluminous as opposed to just boxy and too big. I'd have been tempted to buy (£20) but I'd tried it on with these ultra wide Ralph Lauren trousers and there was just too much width going on and I couldn't be bothered going to find any that were more suitable as I was feeling mildly depressed. I'd like to be able tell you this was down to the senseless consumerism of TK Maxx, or even the state of the world, but I think I'd just drunk too much coffee. At any rate I was recovered enough to check their website the following day but of course it wasn't there, and it wasn't my local branch so I can't go back,

botemp · 18/08/2021 09:06

Molly, I forgot to mention LouLou studios as an alternative brand. It's kind of what I wanted Toteme to be, and priced slightly more competitively. The only annoying thing is their photography style that makes it pretty difficult to assess the actual clothing.

Flo, your too much coffee makes depressed theory would explain a lot of Scandinavia...

I don't think it's that unusual for a brand to improve in quality, especially the celebrity brands that last beyond expectation. I'm not as knowledgeable about Victoria Beckham's line but the diffusion line has gone on to improve a lot over the years. Potentially the main line has done an opposite direction though, I'm not sure on that, I've heard mixed things. Alexa Chung's debut collection was rather poor quality, the fact that the brand still exist must mean it has improved (I haven't seen any in stores though but I sincerely doubt it could continue to exist on her waning celebrity).

At The Row at some point they just switched it up, it's when the tailoring became more important and the prices went a bit WTF? It was a deliberate strategy that paid off in the long term. They also got rid of their diffusion brand Elizabeth and James in the process which really was shit quality for a lot of money but it was relatively popular, with a very different style bit boho/vintage denim California cool kid alternative, there were perfumes that were extremely popular among a certain set, I assume those still exist.

Céline also had a switch up of quality, under Micheal Kors it was a quality brand but not a high quality brand the way it was under Phoebe Philo, Heidi Slimane seems to have let standards slip in places (noticeably in leather goods) but kept them in others so it's much more of a mixed bag now. I assume there are some industry studies that use Phoebe Philo's changes as a template to move brands into contemporary luxury which was a category that didn't really exist previously.

That was probably another Ted talk, oops...

OP posts:
MollyVolley · 18/08/2021 11:04

Botemp you are fab!

Floisme · 19/08/2021 08:44

Yes, excellent talk, thanks! I'm still figuring out how you manage a switch up in quality. When you switch down I assume you quietly cut corners on production but keep your prices (or maybe lower them but only slightly) and it could be a couple of years before your customers notice what's going on. But if you switch up, you're presumably paying out more for production straight away, so you either have to take a hit to your profits or pass the cost on to your customers and hope they'll either stick with you or that you'll find new ones quickly?

Maybe it's less of a big deal in designer labels but I'm trying to think of a high street retailer that's done that and lived to tell the tale?

botemp · 19/08/2021 09:10

No expert on the business side of it but I assume they simply switch suppliers and go to manufacturers who specialise in a higher end finish. Some manufacturers offer a range of finishes but at some point you go to those who exclusively do one thing well. That's why I check where things are made, for example designer cashmere is roughly split into three, Johnston's of Elgin do a lot, as do Loro Piana (so UK and Italy labels give an indication to those manufacturers) and then a great bulk is made in China. The stuff from China isn't anything to look down at necessarily but fair to say it'll have cost a lot less solely on the basis of labour and cost of environmental impact that European companies just can't compete with.

I think at the other end of the spectrum it has always been about squeezing contracts to their absolute limit and that was the morally reprehensible aspect of it, and forced the manufacturers to mistreat staff in return, disregard safety, employ child labour, sometimes directly sometimes through sub contractors. It was mostly based on the model of selling with loss leaders to achieve the highest volume of sales, a true race to the bottom. I don't think that's gone entirely now, unfortunately, but it's somewhat on the outs. H&M and to an extent Zara have abandoned it and they set the tone. Both have introduced higher quality/sustainable lines but tbh there's not really that huge of a leap of quality. And Primark continues to flourish so it's not all rosy.

What I'd like to know is what profit margins are like, at £40 for a cashmere it'll obviously be lower but you profit through volume, at £400 you'll lose out on a bit of volume but I assume the margins are higher but at £2000, how does the margin work there. The Row is stupidly expensive but gets marked down to 70%, sometimes with additional 10-15% off, the margins much be huge and perhaps the £400 jumper is financially the least interesting if the margin is moderate and the audience is small.

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AuldAlliance · 19/08/2021 09:23

That's really interesting, bo. Thanks for sharing your wisdom.

Hope everything went OK, Xing.

I have managed to arrange a week's trip to Scotland to see my parents for the first time in over 2 years and am inordinately relieved. Smile

Leaving tomorrow. Have done all the endless paperwork, got a negative Covid test, booked my Day 2 test, and am now trying to remember how to dress for temps forecast to be between 11° and 19°, after 2 months of baking heat here. Looking forward to comparing notes on current trends in Provence and Scotland, and to popping in to a few charity shops in the leafier areas of town Smile.

botemp · 19/08/2021 09:30

I'm so pleased for you Auld, that's a really long time not to see your family. Will you have to quarantine? I must admit I'm a bit Shock whenever I see people on here mention all the extra costs to travel, the government pays for it all here (until October anyhow) but even the commercial packages aren't anywhere near the prices they are in the UK.

It's a little warmer here at 19-21 but cloudy. It's not as cold as you think as it doesn't cool down at night much but a light coat is definitely a must to have on hand and light knitwear is good too.

OP posts:
botemp · 19/08/2021 09:32

*16-21° not 19-21

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Floisme · 19/08/2021 09:32

Yeah that's a point about places like H&M running higher end lines - even if the quality's not that much better it's a way of sussing out if there's a market for it. I think I need coffee (but not too much this time) before I can compute those profit margins Grin

Floisme · 19/08/2021 09:38

Sorry Auld I missed your post - all the best for your trip and enjoy the time with your parents.
I don't know about Scotland but daytime temperatures in northerly UK are similar to bo's report. The evenings however are getting chilly - I dug out a cashmere jumper last night!

AuldAlliance · 19/08/2021 09:41

Thanks, bo. It is a long time, and their health has gone badly downhill since I was last there.

I don't need to quarantine (couldn't have gone if I did), as I'm vaccinated. Unless the Day 2 test is positive, but I can't think about that. TBH, I'm a bit shocked that the Day 2 test is a DIY one, as the temptation to cheat seems obvious.
It was all free at the French end, but the Day 2 test in Scotland cost £68. It originally said £170, but the price changed a few days ago for some reason. The gov.uk website for the Passenger Locator Form is complete and utter pants, though, and some of it is hard to decode even when you have English as your first language...

I'm aiming for layers, and there are a couple of thin jumpers/cardigans in the little pile to be packed. I still have some clothes at my parents' from about 20 years ago - there may be a pair of wide leg jeans there that would fit in well with current silhouettes. (Not that I ever wore skinnies, my legs are too thin and my hips a bit too jug-handle-like for that.) I am 2DC and 2kg heavier than 20 years ago, though...Hmm

Sorry for derailing the thread from erudite style issues.