Les Parisiennes des Mamansnet: "You gotta have style. It helps you get down the stairs." - Diana Vreeland

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Lovers of Parisian style and fashion with a conscious mindset and lots of chatter in between.

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I also had John Rocha more in my memory than Simone. I might watch that link Bo

Started watching the documentary now. OMG how Dublin posh is her accent

I'm feeling very nostalgic now about Designers at Debenhams. Were they the first to do high street - designer collabs? I can't think of any before they came along. Quite sad to look at them now and remember how innovative they were once.

Floisme M&S autograph used to do brilliant ones before Autograph became the new Per Una. They had a collab with Phillip Treacy that was excellent, my mum still has a lovely evening bag that she got.

John Rocha's house is seriously wow, and yes her accent is very D4. I doubt she spent as much time pottering about The Liberties as the video makes out, but both her Dad and her seem like decent people.

Ah did they? I can remember the rumours that they'd hired a designer from Ghost but not any actual collabs.

M&S had collabs for Autograph originally, in about 1995/6/7 (when I wrote their Annual Reports, I met the woman who kicked it off, who now runs Winser London). Designers like Sonja Nuttall and Hussein Chalayan were among the first designers to collaborate and the clothes were fantastic, and wore brilliantly.

Sadly Autograph then had very limited distribution: to see it all, you had to visit the Marble Arch store where everything was trialled.

After the pyjamas from Dublin talk and now mention of this posh D4 accent, I must admit I'm rather intrigued what it's all about, if you're not expected to be decent or spend time in other areas (I assume a bit more run down). I really must visit (and I'm contemplating the pyjamas again as they're on sale 😬, how have yours kept Elle?)

I was more intrigued by her mother's country background, as it was sort of presented as being salt of the earth simple people type thing but when she got all the photo albums out they didn't seem like your average struggling potato farmers either.

I think Pierre Cardin was maybe not the first but probably the first bigggest designer to do collabs (and he recently died a very rich man because of it) but that was more akin to licensing than what we know as collabing now but that's really when it started. There's documentary on it somewhere from the 90s or 80s, more about money and fashion, I'll see if I can find it as I saw it on YouTube, there was a young Suzy Menkes which was rather endearing IIRC. It was quite an interesting perspective as you kind of forgot how hard it was for brands to get brand recognition (especially global) when the internet wasn't a thing.

That'll be why I never saw it - Autograph only made it into the local M&S a few years ago and, if online shopping was a thing in the 90s, I wasn't into it.

I still maintain M&S should have snapped up Phoebe Philo. Which reminds me, what's she doing these days?

Sos - cross post with bo

Found it, it's a longer one (48 mins)

Phoebe Philo is rumoured to be starting her own brand but this gets rumoured every couple of months with zero evidence. I'm still convinced Virginie Viard is just keeping her seat warm at Chanel until she decides to feel like doing that.

Elle I agree they do seem like lovely people! I have family with similar accents so no juxtaposition in my mind between lovely and posh-speaking at all, it just amused me. Their house looked a lot like driving through ... I want to say Rathmines but am shite with geography and place names in all fairness. Anyway, the Margaret Howell shop is not far away from what I'm thinking of. ;)

Farmers in Ireland can be fairly well off Bo, it's sort of a family thing and having land thing. So they can be both salt of the earth and Established iyswim.

In my perfect world, M&S would hire Phoebe Philo. One can dream!

Yes, Bani, I assumed that could be the case, but SR herself made it seem like both parents came from very simple beginnings. She does come across rather uncomfortable with the privilege she's grown up with and rather focuses on the more 'authentic' stories of her parents than herself but it may just be being protective of her private life/self which is very understandable.

This came up my suggested feed, which is where I remember the all female studio narrative from, and it briefly features her mother. You can all tell me what her accent reveals, to my uneducated ears it's more landed gentry than tenant farmer. (It's very short)

Please, no, poor Phoebe shouldn't be boarding a sinking ship that's only kept afloat by an ever shrinking group of nostalgic consumers who for the most part probably wouldn't even appreciate her offerings. I think where luxury meets craftsmanship has always been her wheelhouse, I don't think what she does works at a lower price point in the same way as the essence of it would be economised out.

Nah Phoebe's bored with dressing the well heeled. She wants a new challenge. Trust me on this

Flo = Phoebe ?

Bwa ha ha. Nope - just bored.

That's exactly what Phoebe would say 🧐

Plus the longer she holds out, the more I wonder what's holding her back. I can't believe she hasn't had any decent offers. She's done all the luxury stuff, done it all I tell ya. It's time for something new - like becoming a National Treasure.

I dunno, all the luxury houses are losing female designers and replacing them with men now that that's no longer a fashionable cause. I think a big issue has been having to travel back and forth between Paris and London and still have something resembling a family life. I know Claire Wright Keller complained of that too.

She's done it before though, between Chloe and Céline IIRC, she just wanted time out and be a mum and she could afford to, people were waiting with baited breath then too. She does know how to leave on a high note which makes a return easier than if you're not so subtly moved out the way like Natacha Ramsay-Levi of Chloe was.

I don't see her next stop being a judge on the Great British Sewing Bee though, which would be the sure fire way to National Treasure status. That, or become princess Charlotte's personal dresser

I could see her open a small shop though, just with nice random things, but I prefer the Charlotte scenario.

Can’t tell mrs Rocha’s accent from the video (not an expert) I’ll let Elle weigh in, who seems able to separate the D4 from the D2 😉

It’s interesting to read your memories of collaborations, I think the extreme fast fashion thing of constant new collections has killed it somewhat. I wonder if post pandemic we’ll be seeing a new fashion industry, more focussed on comfort and longevity perhaps? Like the historical sewers say, fabric was the biggest cost in the old days, perhaps it will be again in a more sustainable future and we’ll mind our things better. Maybe there is room for designers to collaborate and press for quality.

Yeah, I was thinking about Karl Lagerfeld and the H&M collab which was the first and I remember there was huge surprise that it went up to a size 44, which would be more like a 46 (18/20) now. Iirc that was at H&M's insistence as that was their standard size range at the time, making it one of the few high street shops that catered to these sizes without it being plus sized. Looking where we are now, I'm fully expecting plus size brands to branch into normal sizes now instead of the other way round, loads already start at size 40 or 42.

I don't know how much impact the pandemic will have on purchasing behaviour once it's over. I think the next change will really be down to innovation in technology in fabrication. I did notice you can now buy printed mask patterns on a roll, you just cut them out and match them up (they tended to be the fun photo printed things like chimp mouths), it's really easy and more straight forward than traditional patterns. I can definitely see some DIY garments being sold like that as the general DIY trend is ascending.

In the first wave all the Harry Styles groupies got obsessed over a J.W. Anderson patch cardigan he wore, which looked very homemade and attempted to replicate it with lots of online tutorials. In the end J.W. Anderson released the pattern in pdf and with a YouTube tutorial, I can see a lot more of that happening to build a more intimate relationship between brand and audience that could potentially buy in at the lowest price items (perfumes, cosmetics, and accessories) which accounts for most of their financial existence.

Anyhow, I ended up buying some Thebe Magugu bits in the sale as it was an extra 20% off, the high neck 'pie crust' Victoriana shirt photographed previously and a skirt. From another brand I got a small summer handbag as I find leather overly formal most of the time in warm weather now, I figure I need to make it an inner bag though.

Also bought a load of different scarfs from weekday as I have a weird idea about making a coat from them with lack of suitable practice fabric for making a coat, but it turns out J.W. Anderson beat me to it and already made it but at least I know it can be done and looks as interesting as I thought it would. He made it for the men's collection though so I'm hoping the proportions of the scarf width actually can work for me. Anyhow, I can easily return the scarfs if it doesn't work (I'd just pin them on to get an idea).

I think where fashion goes next will also depend a lot on what happens to workplaces post pandemic. I'm sceptical about the 'death of the office' predictions (invariably by writers in warm, uncrowded houses who are used to solitary working). But it would be equally silly to think things will just go back to how they were before. Fashion will need to read the mood and keep one step ahead. It won't be easy.