Royal style: fewer new frocks, more old rocks

[QueenOfTheAndals]

Previous thread

Also wanted to add; Archie will technically be a prince when Charles becomes king.
I wonder what will Happen to the Duke of Sussex title when Harry pops off.

I was wondering about the Sussex title as well Curly

How many royal titles are left? The York title will merge with the crown at some point. Kent & Gloucester titles are now gone. Think Clarence is still a possibility.

I wonder what will happen to the Duke of Sussex title when Harry pops off.

Archie will inherit it, just like any other Dukedom, unless he decides to go all Tony Benn.

Think this is the end of Dukedom of York just like the Dukedom of Windsor. Nobody would want to be associated with a disgraced title.
Maybe the Sussex title will also become redundant not because of disgrace but due to Harry not wanting to carry it further.

Maybe. Or Archie will just become another non-HRH duke, like the current heirs to Kent and Gloucester.

The Dukedom of York is a really old title.
If there is still a monarchy once George is king, it might be reinstated for a second son of his.
I guess they'll find another Dukedom for Louis.

Archie would be close to 60 / 70. I'd be amazed if he wanted a Dukedom if he'd spent his whole life without one. I mean we were all expecting him to become Earl Dumbarton.

Richard the Third was the Duke of York, and the title survived him (probably) bumping his nephews off. The title will go on I’m sure.

No, he was Gloucester but that's survived too. But I'm sure there have been other scandalous DoYs - the title has survived for centuries and I'm sure it'll outlast Andrew.

@SenecaFalls I was under the impression that the DoE counts as same "level" as the queen so is the one person people (including blood princesses etc) would all curtsey too if he was at an event alone without her? Did I misunderstand that?

Surely Archie doesn't automatically become a prince. It's optional. Like the queen's other grandchildren, who are not considered princes or princesses, including Edward (ie even if blood princesses can't pass the prince/princess title, the blood princes can and Louisa and James ARE in fact grandchildren of a sitting monarch). But Edward (and I thought, Anne) chose not to. And Harry and Meghan chose the same. So that won't change when Charles becomes king.

Also, when they changed the rules of progenitor, was that just for the monarchy? So, if for example, Charlotte gets her own title at some point - eg Duchess of whatever, can she pass that to her children? Ditto, if Louis has a girl first, can he pass whatever dukedom/earldom he gets to the girl? Or is it only the line of succession that has changed?

I didn't think they changed those rules @Bling, girls still can't inherit titles.

You’re right, apologies. Richard of York was his father - who ended up with his head on a spike for treason, so also not exactly covering the title in glory!

Oh my god, just looking up current line of succession and discovered Duke of Gloucester is actually a prince. Of course he is, he is the grandson of a king. But I always just see him referenced as the Duke of Gloucester and totally MISSED that!

“ Think this is the end of Dukedom of York just like the Dukedom of Windsor. Nobody would want to be associated with a disgraced title.”

Bit harsh to put them on the same level of disgraced-ness......

Archie will automatically become a prince unless the currently operating Letters Patent are changed. James Severn and Lady Louise are technically prince and princess, but they don't use the titles. I predict that Charles will change the LPs when he becomes king. I think the reason it hasn't been done yet is that it would strip the York princesses of their titles, which would seem a bit unfair when they have had them from birth.

I don't think that any of the other HRHs are expected to bow or curtsy to the DofE. The only HRH I have ever noticed doing that is Kate, and she did it when the Queen was present.

The Duke of Kent is also a prince, HRH Prince Edward Duke of Kent.

It's more likely that the Duke of Buckingham or Margaret Beaufort murdered the York princes, rather than Richard.

I think the Dukedom of York will definitely continue. William will likely be king when Andrew dies so he may give the title to Louis or he could just hold on to it and let George bestow to a younger son (or daughter if times have advanced sufficiently by then.)

Which prompts a thought. Since Charlotte outranks Louis in the succession, maybe by then William could make Charlotte Duchess of York in her own right. But she would also be in line for the Princess Royal title so who knows.

@ BertrandRussel

"Bit harsh to put them on the same level of disgraced-ness...."

They are not on the same level, but on the spectrum of disgraced-ness DoW is high, DoY is in the middle.

Couldn't Louis become the Duke of Edinburgh when William is king?

Prince Edward is supposed to become Duke of Edinburgh so if that happens, James Severn would eventually inherit that title.

Oh yes, forgot about Prince Edward.

Since Charlotte outranks Louis in the succession, maybe by then William could make Charlotte Duchess of York in her own right.

This is what I was asking earlier? So the change in progenitor or whatever is only for monarchy itself and not for other titles? Misogynist wanker class system!

Prince Edward is supposed to become Duke of Edinburgh so if that happens, James Severn would eventually inherit that title.

Does this mean that the title DoE will 'dilute' then as it gets further from the crown? Would James' heirs also be DoE?

I thought Princess Alice and Princess Mary, Duchess of Harewood were the only ones to be given titles in their own right. Could be very wrong though.

Does this mean that the title DoE will 'dilute' then as it gets further from the crown? Would James' heirs also be DoE?

Seneca will correct me if I'm wrong, but I think it will convert from a "royal dukedom" to a regular one. So instead of being HRH, Prince Edward the Duke of Edinburgh, it will be "James [surname?], Duke of Edinburgh" and so on for his sons (grrrrr) into the future.