🐌 Fantastic Skincare: We're So Drunk We're Seeing Elephants 🐘

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For those who are taking a peek and wondering what this all about, we mostly discuss a bit of advanced skincare here with a perspective of seeking out the right ingredients (rather than the latest new shiny product and all its empty promises) for our particular skin needs. Distinguishing the acid toners from the actives whilst avoiding the truly unimpressive and harmful ingredients with a hope to achieve a bit of anti-ageing, alleviate irritation and sensitivities with some idle chat in between. Newcomers are always welcome but please note the following:

Questions and asking for help on this thread is encouraged, however, we can’t give you a specific routine to follow and hope it works out for the best. There are no overnight miracles in skincare whether it be in the form of products or techniques. It’s about perseverance, understanding your skin, assessing its needs and responding to that in a diligent manner.

These threads were created to help those who want to learn for themselves. We’re a group of interested and invested skincare nuts happy to offer tea and sympathy and dole out advice. Everyone’s journey with skincare is different, what is universal and binds us is that through actually learning about the different active ingredients it helps us get to know our skin and help us adapt as it will change many times throughout our lives - with seasons, hormonal changes, ageing, genetics etc. It's in everyone's best interests to get to know their skin and to keep reviewing those changes with the confidence that comes from the gathered knowledge here. We really encourage you to spend the time reading through previous threads and linked info sheets that the many contributors have taken the trouble to share.

By no means are we experts, we're only a bunch of amateurs that can only respond by suggesting what we would do in your place, for any severe conditions please seek out professional help.

Ahem, and finally a little note on spending. I'm well aware these threads cause many to reach for their wallets and spend with wild abandon. There can sometimes be a bit of a frenzy surrounding the excitement around a newly discovered product or on the back of great improvements when someone reports back. This is all great, it doesn't however, mean everything that's a sudden miracle for one will be it for you. Usually, it's a light bulb moment for connecting the right skincare ingredient with an individual experiencing a specific problem. Take your time to mull over decisions and question whether it's right for you too. Skincare is highly individual, it's a slow game that should cost mostly in patience, input, education, and perseverance. Please don't make it cost you financially needlessly.

I am very slowly working on consolidating the gathered information from previous threads into easier to read formats but it’s slow going. I would suggest reading thread 1 and at the very least the following info sheets (provided they apply to you):

Where to Start

Basics of an Actives Routine

Skin Types vs. Skin Conditions Info Sheet

Anti-Ageing Info sheet

Adult Acne Info Sheet

Understanding Which Sunscreen(s) to Buy

Do I Really Need to Wear Sunscreen Every Single Day of the Year?

A Damaged Skin Barrier - Now What?

NEW SERIES:

So You Want To Buy A Retinoid - A Guide

WRT to The Ordinary/Deciem:

Most of us had long since stopped using it, partially due to the inconsistency of formulations and the worrying behaviour of the CEO on Social Media.

For more info on the latter, overview here

A good overview of alternatives is here

Since that compilation, other brands like the Inkey, Revolution Skincare, QRXLabs, and Alex Steinherr x Primark have launched with similar products/concepts.

From the limited experience on here, the Vitamin C 23% and Azelaic Acid from Garden of Wisdom (at Victoria’s Health) is well liked and much preferred over TO versions.

OCTOBER 2018: In other news, we’re two years old this month! We’re so old- Drunk Elephant is finally available in the UK, but all this celebration is probably overshadowed by the fear that our beloved LRP Toleriane Fluide may have been discontinued

Hairdresser has ballsed up my fringe again. Badly this time because there's extra full length hair that's been cut into it and it's too wide. It's definitely not my description. I took 8 pictures in with different angles of the same fringe ffs. Not going there ever again, they didn't listen.

Just getting that off my chest.

Hello all, thanks for the new thread Bo :)

Pupsie Interesting about the weight loss when you stopped your Metcon workouts - reduced water weight from lower inflammation when you finished perhaps? It sounds like it was pretty "stressful", so maybe you were producing more cortisol and when you stopped your body was able to shift some weight? Just thinking aloud there!

I decided in August not to compete in the bodybuilding comp so my training has reduced considerably. I was quite unhappy with how I looked and felt and didn't want to put myself through a full "prep". It's also incredibly expensive and felt quite selfish to spend many hundreds of ££ on a hobby so I put a stop to it. I'm now floundering a bit with my training without a specific goal ( gym 2 x week, Pilates x 1 and jogging with the dog x 2) but I'm happier with how I look (down 5lbs from my heaviest, and not so bulky). No doubt retaining some extra muscle is beneficial as I hurtle towards menopause :)

I doubt think I could do IF/16:8 as I've always been ravenous in the morning and seem to have stomach issues if I don't eat regularly but I know it works brilliantly for many people. I'm just tracking my kcal and slowly cutting, which does get tedious at times as I seem to have stayed at the same weight for the past 6 weeks.

For other Japanese SPF wearers, I've been trialling this one for the last 2 weeks - very nice, much more moisturising than Biore watery essence and would suit others with dry skin. Great under makeup and no white cast but the bottle is TINY!! Will RP but will get 2 next time

Also thinking aloud, Pupsie, it may also be down to getting quality sleep in since you were up and early, out of the door first thing all the time. Even if I do the same amount of hours when I know that's the kind of energy needed first thing in the morning the quality of sleep is significantly less and poor sleep quality is very counter when doing so much exercise consistently.

I'm kind of surprised by the 16/8 IF craze too, Tsm, I think most already eat that way or used to eat that way albeit more likely 14:10 or 15:9 (but from what I gather it's not an exact science). The only thing I've ever noticed if eating late is that I'm hungrier quicker in the morning but I've always put that down to the amount of time between eating and going to sleep, I think I'd have the same issue if I did 16:8 from 13-21 for example.

Enid, is it time for me to open up the art gallery again? I was planning on visiting the hairdresser this week, I'm very much reconsidering now

Koko, can totally understand the hesitation to be branded the Dr. Google hypochondriac patient at your GP's but I do think it's worth pursuing as everyone that's on it appears to be lyrical about it. Over the counter skincare can only prevent and manage but it won't cure anything or set you up on a track of minimal maintenance (read less worry and preoccupation with it) the way prescription skincare does, so I'd consider researching it as part of your next step. Also meant to say earlier, you mentioned not always wearing makeup, WRT your routine, on those days it really isn't necessary to double cleanse. You also mentioned using a hot cloth cleanser, generally for rosacea hot water really isn't good for it, also the friction of a flannel to remove product with doesn't help the condition. So either rinse off with tepid water or switch to something like a bamboo flannel. Pupsie, can you link the ones you have again?

WRT facial exercises/massage/yoga, I wouldn't waste my time. Especially in someone in rosacea, as you need to leave it alone as much as possible and you're at higher risk for broken capillaries.

I've looked at that SPF before Tsm, is that the very waterproof one? Is it difficult to get off? I can't remember what my personal objections were to not buy it.

Bo It's water resistant (apparently) but definitely doesn't feel sticky or heavy like the LRP SPFs... I've been doing my regular cleansing and no blocked pores/whiteheads have appeared. No complaints from me, bar the size!

It's a bit Claudia Winkleman bo so we could add a bar with a disco ball to the art gallery and I'll hang around in there. 😏

I got a free lipstick with a feel unique order today and I like the colour! This never happens. It's a bright berry rather than the browny peachy ones I seem to get whoever there's a freebie. Trèstique matte lip crayon in Belize Bordeaux. Quite nice.

Tsm, I looked up again, it is designed for outdoor sport and significantly more water resistant than most. I'd assumed it therefore wouldn't be as nice to wear on the daily. I'll contemplate it as I do like that it has no alcohol and is a physical/chemical mix.

Enid, does this mean we have an actual use for the hairy balls?

TS I think it was largely due to fluid as you say. It was also in the middle of the super hot weather which didn't help. Well done on making what must have been a hard decision re competing. I gather from people who compete that it's hard to do it more than once as you know just how tough that cut is. And also, it's hard not to lose control completely afterwards. I thought about competing last year (as a newbie) but it would absolutely feed my recovering perfectionism. I hope you settled into a training routine that you can enjoy and feel you benefit from; current routine sounds good. I'm on a loop of 3 x heavy weights sessions, 1 5k run, 2 HIIT sessions. Yep, keep as much of that muscle as you can!

Re 16:8 I rarely feel hungry until late morning, unless I have had a larger/later meal the night before, as happened last night as I was in London overnight. Woke up at 6am starving!

Good point re sleep Bo. But I was probably getting more sleep as I was going to bed earlier, and I was shattered so slept well. But I was exhausted.

I think you're right Bo. Thing is for me I get lulled into this sort of weight-trainers' eat 6 times a day mentality and can convince myself it keeps my blood sugar levels stable blah blah when actually it turns into an all day snackfest if I'm not careful. And whilst that may suit some, it doesn't suit me. And I don't need it. My DH who is a proper bodybuilder has been going through a bulking stage since we got our garage gym and he's actually trying the 16:8 for a month. Just to see. It's good to mix things up I think. Not for the sake of it, but just if you want to explore what may suit YOU best.

Koko I can't seem to find where I bought my flannels from, even through searching my posts. But tbh I hardly use them these days. I just use my fingertips. I'll only use flannels if I've worn heavy make up, which is pretty much never.

I could hang then from my ears bo, distract from the fringe.

Is someone asking about flannels? M&S white ones are good. Very thick, wash brilliantly. £5 each.

The 16/8 diet interests me as that's how I used to eat when I was permanently slim pre DC.

Now I'm brainwashed into thinking I should eat breakfast so I'm delighted I can go back to my favoured eat nothing till lunch as it's now a thing

I got into eating little and often as I thought it helped the ME but really I do much better on 2 meals a day and plenty of liquids. The cherry juice has plenty of calories and sugars in it to replace snacks.

My bloated stomach, wind cramps and worrying over daft things have been explained by an unexpected period. Unexpected partly because I didn't get any spots which is usually my first warning sign.

Trying the LRP too sensitive fluide tonight. Hopefully it won't trigger any skin issues. I think I felt a slight tingling when I put it on and it felt more moisturising than the old tol fluid. Skin seems more hydrated to touch. Full day test under make up tomorrow.

Oh and I've downloaded a cycle tracking app called Clue. There's an option to add skin info for each day too so good for anyone who has skin that changes according to where they are period/ovulation wise. Basic descriptions like 'oily' 'dry' etc but enough to keep an eye on it and notice patterns. Got it to track ovulation and moods mainly.

Not 'too sensitive' (although I am atm ) I meant 'tol'

My skin is breaking out a lot at the mo and I'm getting those red spots on my neck. Could be one of two things....hormonal as am just coming off my period or purging as I've increased my medik8 3tr to 3x a week 🤔

Has anyone used this? Asking for a friend. Really.

www.spacenk.com/uk/en_GB/skincare/treatment/serums/powerful-strength-line-reducing-concentrate-UK200021537.html?Quantity=1&uuid=418fa3286d9f4ff01aef842a68

That was my first vitamin C, Pupsie, used it exclusively from my mid-late twenties. I did like it but I didn't have much choice and it was far more expensive then. I moved on as I had more options at that point (was pretty much the only easily available one up to that point) and preferred a non silicone Vit C with a higher percentage. It also went off near the end so never really felt I got my money's worth but I did enjoy it, was my gateway drug into active skincare

WRT 16:8 I do get the sense it works better for men than women. IME a lot of the science into food and exercise (especially the stuff that gets pulled out of context on the internet) mostly has male test subjects. It's a lot more complex/different in women most of the time.

Koko, it's not surprising at all. Rosacea prone skin doesn't like temperature extremes. Have you read up on other triggers too, like spicy foods, red wine, and strenuous exercise?

I do 16:8 but it suits me as I’m not a breakfast eater and rarely feel hungry in the morning. So I kind of do it naturally regardless of whether I’m following an eating plan/trying to lose weight, it’s just my typical eating pattern. It annoys me when diets like weightwatchers ‘push’ breakfast as it just doesn’t work for me, I end up feeling sick and will still get just as hungry during the rest of the day.

Mint I’m glad you like the DHC sorry to hear your skin is playing up, it does sound hormonal though. That app that Enid mentions might be a good idea.

I keep feeling ‘periody’ but no sign of any period, joys of peri menopause.

I’ve ordered another hourglass palette pricey but worth it IMO as I barely use any other makeup now.

Thanks Bo. I'm asking for my lovely colleague whose birthday it was today and we got her a £50 Space NK voucher. She's late 20s and saving for her first property. She'd like to get an active, and probably a vitamin C. But not DE or anything that expensive (I am always very careful about what I say to her). Anything else spring to mind?

Agreed re exercise and male vs female, and it definitely gets harder/more complex around the menopause. My DH won't be able to sustain 16:8 long term. He's struggling to get enough protein in. He found a 50g protein shake in H&B the other day though!

Look your skin sounds like s slightly more extreme version and I find regular spritz of the thermal water really great. I spritz after moisturiser and when ever I remember during the day (4x maybe) I also find an oil good. I was on rosex too, years ago.

Koko not Look!!

50g protein shake if I go by government guidelines I think that's more than my daily rec of protein intake.

It's tough in SpaceNK, as Kiehl's is pretty much considered low budget there. She definitely wants skincare and Vit C? Then the Kiehl's would be the best pick I'd spend it on Chantecaille and Surratt makeup. She could hold out for the inevitable £15 off offer and get DE then, it would be around the same price as the Kiehl's at that point.

In the bodybuilding world common advice is to go for a gram for every pound of lean muscle. Generally most women should be aiming for a minimum of 100g. Somewhere between 100g and 120g is about right. (I don't put much stock in Government advice when it comes to nutrition; they are usually woefully behind the times). It's amazing how odd grams here and there add up. For example, my boys have bagels for lunch each day, and they're 5g a piece.

50g is a lot in one hit, but less than an 8oz steak/some veggies.