Is there any point in ugly women wearing make-up/ dressing up? Is jewellery OK?

[splendide]

I feel as though there's no point in me making any effort beyond being clean because I look awful whatever I do.

I have this horrible suspicion that people are just laughing at me if I make an effort - as if I delude myself into thinking I'm attractive.

I thought maybe some nice jewellery would mean there was something nice to look at.

Right. So already there is one person in the world who thinks you are literally celestially beautiful because you are his mum.
See what he sees, a lovely smile, twinkly eyes, fun and kindness on your face.
The episodes you describe are awful - but you need to keep some perspective. They were made by inconsequential twats.
You don't randomly comment on a stranger's appearance if you have no issues of your own. They deserve your pity and no more.
Would you consider some counselling if it gives you flashbacks?
Having a baby can make your already fragile self esteem plummet too remember.

People who bitch about others are putting them down so they feel better about themselves.

I bet you looked fab and there was a twang of envy.

I promise you aren't ugly. That Rohald Dahl poem is very,very true.

PP are right - what does ugly even mean?!?

I am sorry you have been made to feel ugly. And I use the word feel deliberately because you are describing a feeling not a biological fact - because there is no such thing as physically ugly because who decides on the standard and criteria?

Everyone can radiate attractiveness and warmth - whatever they look like. It actually doesn't matter that your hair in mousey - there are many attractive and warm people who have mousey hair, that is not the thing to be concerned about. So, you have to garner the strength to allow yourself to start looking at the things that make you amazing - your kindness, warmth, humour, efficiency, curiosity, creativity....whatever they may be.

Dye your hair if you want but those feelings of being laughed at if you do won't necessarily disappear until you are able to say...."I love my new hair and it doesn't matter what others say because I know I am a kind, loving and creative person" (or whatever it is you are!)

Remove the word ugly from your vocabularly. It doesn't exist in my world as something based on looks - it is only based on ugly characters and those people who have tried to make to you feel 'less than' may well be the ugly people here.

The 'packaging' makes a huge difference to a person's overall attractiveness. Think Jennifer Aniston. Ok but plainish face but great packaging: slim always tanned; found a hairstyle and dress style that suits her; hair highlighted and always polished and shiny. Everyone looks and feels better when they make an effort.

I can honestly say that I don't think I have ever looked at someone and thought 'wow they're ugly, they shouldn't even try'.
I regularly see people and think that they are a bit unkempt, or unclean, which is off putting, but I cannot imagine someone being clean, with clothes in good condition and has had a hair cut in the last 6 months standing out as 'ugly'.
Little things like a bit of under eye concealer and mascara, a good hair cut, clean and trimmed nails, and well fitting clothes are all that is needed to look good in my opinion.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and I am sure you are not seeing yourself very clearly OP

People can be so very nasty and hurtful and these comments stay with you. I know. But stuff them!! I don't have the time or money to groom myself the way I'd like to but every little helps. Even lip balm with a hint if colour as makes you feel like you've got make up on and made an effort. I'm going to fake confidence this year and start to believe in myself and hope you can too. Good luck.

I guarantee you are NOT ugly, it just sounds as though you lack a bit of confidence to try this stuff - which should be all about fun. Just experiment a bit, e.g. A bit of make up first, small bit of jewellery and keep working on it and build it up as you work out what suits you and develop your style. Have fun!

From someone who was picked to be an actual troll in a school play due to her unique features:

So the bitches in the toilet were jealous of your outfit and just being childish. The man you walked past was a bully who got off on belittling strangers.

I've been trying to imagine what ugly looks like, and it doesn't. Ugly is unkindness, arrogance, bullying etc. I guarantee you are not ugly (and even if you looked like a troll, which you don't, aren't they cute anyway?)

I think you've given headspace to a handful of awful but totally irrelevant people. I read in a book when I was younger that beauty is "cleanliness and a smile", and I believe the smile is a huge part of it. Kindness, compassion and goodness is beautiful.

Why don't you spoil yourself a bit, get some advice on grooming, simple natural makeup, colours, styles that suit you. Find a really good sympathetic hair stylist and work out best styles for you to balance features etc. Love and spoil yourself and hopefully your confidence will improve.

Own yourself and tell yourself you are fucking fabulous just the way you are. You have no less right to feel beautiful than anyone else. And if you find you have an outfit that looks incredible on you, feel smug about it! Know you look great and own it. Why shouldn't you?

Oh, and there's no such thing as "mousy". It's "muted auburn"

I think there is some great advice on here

Do you work? I'm a SAHM to 3 under 4 but used to have a senior fee-earning role in a professional services firm. We all wore make up and had decent cuts and colours. I find that I feel a lot more together and confident even as a SAHM if I have my hair done and my make up on. It's nothing to do with pleasing other people or attracting men or anything else, it's to do with self-care and demonstrating to myself that I deserve to spend time on me!

Your post reads to me like you don't feel you deserve to spend that time and money on yourself

OP do you think other people are ugly? Have you ever told someone that they are ugly?

I sincerely doubt it so why on earth are you telling yourself that?

Would you look at the six year old you and tell her she is ugly? No of course you wouldn't. Because it wouldn't have been true. And it isn't true now!

You dislike your hair? Ok many of us dislike certain aspects. But for every one thing you dislike,you must also say one thing that you do like. Concentrate on the second list. Write it down. Pin it up in front of your mirror. Say themout loud. If you keep saying them, you will start to believe them again.

The women were jealous, if you were actually ugly they wouldn't have commented on you, the man was just a nasty shit and prob fancied you, I've heard a man do this before to an attractive woman and I've seen women being bitchy about other attractive women, I think you're doing yourself down, those comments are about them, not you.

Why do you believe them? Most women have been bitched about in public loos by other women. Most women have had a bit of abuse hurled at them in the street. You don't need to believe any of it. Why would you?

You have as much right as any other woman to wear or not wear makeup and jewellery if you want it. Do you like make-up and jewellery? Wear them if you want. They're an expression of your personality - make-up can be subtle and natural or theatrical or glamorous. Up to you. Same with jewellery. It's an aspect of self-expression, there to amuse you not to silence the nastiest people you've happened across. Bitchy people find a way to put others down and call them ugly even when their targets are Hollywood actresses famed for their looks. It means nothing if other people say you're ugly. It's so unlikely to be objectively true.

Oh yes, Bluntness is right. Men do this to women they fancy. it's called 'negging' - it's to get your attention and make you want their approval.

But I don't actually agree with Roald Dahl. I know a few physically gorgeous people who are ugly inside. And I know a few beautiful souls who look less than gorgeous, not because they are ugly inside, but because they're unhappy. Unhappiness and stress can make us look plainer than we are. And happiness can make us look more attractive.

My heart goes to you OP, as this is exactly how I felt about myself for many years. It's a horrible set of thoughts to be having about yourself.

I understand now that beauty is not an objective thing, in any way whatsoever. It's an atmosphere that exists around a person, and that, actually, can be artificially created by putting together different elements: elegant posture, a beautiful scent, laughter, different colours, the tone of the voice, different makeup effects, and so on. These are all small things, but the cumulative effect can be, and is, powerful.

I also no longer believe that the only people who should be allowed to spend time/money caring for their physical selves are the 'naturally beautiful'. My body might not conform to the dimensions of a model, but it works very hard for me and is every bit as entitled to be groomed and pampered!

When a few years ago I wanted to see if I could make myself look better, I read the quote that Bluntness used in her post about ugly/lazy, and found it really intriguing. I decided to embark upon an experiment: to what extent could a fundamentally ugly woman improve her appearance? Could beauty be faked? Approaching it this way, as a test of my ingenuity helped me to short-circuit some similar thoughts to the ones that you are having, 'Surely the only thing worse than being ugly is to be ugly AND vain...', 'People will either laugh at me or feel sorry for me if they see I want to look good...' (I also had someone spiteful in my life who had suggested these things to me, but now I see he was afraid and wanted to keep me where I was). Anyway, the upshot of it all is that now, a few years down the line after a bit of weightloss, some new clothes and grooming routines, I feel really rather attractive most of the time.

Sorry for the long post, OP. I really hope that you buy the jewellery, and that you enjoy looking at it on you. There's loads of support to be had here, on the S&B board, 'princessing' threads etc - we're all struggling with the same kind of stuff.

Op, post a pic if you're up to it, I'm absolutely sure no one will think you're ugly and it may reassure you.

No matter how we look or fell, looking our best lifts our spirits.

Find a style of top or dress that suits you, find colours that look best on you. If you are unsure about make-up, wear some tinted moisturiser, a natural pink lip gloss and mascara, then add to it if you want, as you feel braver.

I am willing to bed my house on the fact that you aren't ugly. You may not be conventionally beautiful. I'm certainly not. Very few of us are. But everyobody you are friends with sees something beautiful in you. Please try not to let nasty people influence you. I know that is probably a pointless thing to say when you are used to it. But insults are used to control people. They aren't the truth.

I don't recall ever seeing anyone who I'd call physically ugly. I've met some ugly personalities alright.

You are most definitely not ugly but you have come across some awful people. Honestly, no one worth bothering about is laughing at you.

If you are lacking in confidence and don't want to draw attention to yourself then I suggest starting small.

Go for a natural look make-up, so even out your skin tone, tame eyebrows, mascara, nude lip gloss, natural looking blusher. "You" but improved.

Go for regular hair cuts if you can afford it.

A smart bag, scarf and adding jewellery can make a whole outfit look better.

And even on my scruffiest days, a beautiful perfume makes me feel great.

You have low self-esteem so don't fall into the trap of thinking you aren't "worth" spending money or effort on.

If bitchy women in a pub were laughing and talking about you, more likely they were jealous of you.
I would guess you looked/look stunning, but you lack self esteem.

OP, re the man in the street who called you ugly : when I was in my 30s I had that kind of comment from strangers more than once . I also was called fat. I was at most half a stone overweight and when I was in my very early 30s I was actually quite skinny. I was not ugly (in fact other people were complimentary but you only remember the bad stuff hey?) but had very little confidence. That is why fuckwits like him target people like you. As I got older I became more confident and it no longer happened.

If people you know are belittling you then ditch them if you can, or see less of them and if necessary, have the confidence to call them out on it.

Meanwhile, there's some great advice given by PP, best of luck.

It's so long since I've heard anyone being called ugly, I just went off and Googled 'ugly woman' to see what came up. There were overweight women, women with bad teeth or bad haircuts or a bit (not much) facial hair - all things that stopped them from looking conventionally glamorous but all things they could do something about if they wanted to. Then there were some women who dared to have grown old. There was one genuinely beautiful woman who happened to have alopecia. And there were also about two who really did have facial deformities - one of whom was quite cute looking, just unusual, and the other needed surgery as the deformity looked really damaging to her ability to eat or talk (massive extra bone growth in upper jaw.)

I'm not sure there's such a thing as ugly, really. If you're healthy, happy, well groomed and dress in clothes you like, the rest of the world can think what it likes, you deserve to feel confident.

OP those people were just horrible people - they weren't making any observation about what you 'really' look like, they were just being bitchy/mean for the sake of it.

Look at twitter - every day people call famous models and actresses 'ugly bitches'... but we all know they are not! It's not true, just people being hurtful to get a laugh from other hurtful people.

Step 1: Go visit a good quality hairdresser for a 'restyle' appointment. tell them you want nicer hair and ask what they recommend - it's their job to do the best they can with your face and hair type and make it flatter you.

And as a PP said; smile :) it makes all the difference.

I'm sorry OP I had to screenshot this to reply because well it upset me a little...

Why the fuck should people not think that you think you look good??? If you think you look good let them fucking know it not think it!

I think this has a lot more to do with how you feel about how you look than how you actually look

splendide you cannot let some nasty women and a arsehole man continue to control how you look.

I have a very stylish, charismatic friend. Now if you stop and really think about she has wonky teeth, a funny nose and fluff instead of hair. But no one does think about it because she is groomed to the nines and has a really warm and dynamic personality.

We all tell a story with how we present ourselves. You are completely in control of which story you tell. Who do you want to be? Decide and dress for that! It will help you be that person.

You don't even need to spend lots of money to make significant changes.

A good hair cut, well styled, well fitting clothes with some nice accessories (bags, belts, scarves jewellery) can make all the difference.

Depending on your budget prioritise your hair - after all you wear it every day.