Child maintenance payments going up

[C96x]

Hi everyone,

I’m abit stumped here- my other half’s CSA payments have gone up since his daughter no longer wants to come to stay with us(age 9) we respect her wishes even though it’s not nice to not be able to see her due to location.
His CSA payments have gone up which quite right but they have gone up so much that we now are making ends meet- I get that she is now full time with her mum but I really do not agree with the amounts CSA agree too especially when we have mortgage to pay for. This will also impact if she ever does want to come over as we won’t have the money like we used to, to go places/ days out etc…

Mum has other children who she gets CSA payments for as well as child benefit, they also receive free school meals too (she’s an open person). as well as living with parents.

there’s probably nothing we can do here but do CSA take in to count mortgage payments when it comes to earnings? my partner has had access/ overnight stays since she was 1 so all of sudden to have this extra increase each month outgoing now it’s a shock to the system. any advice would be appreciated!

Just to add Dad will pay what he is expected too always has and always will

So a 9 year old can make all decisions wether it's good or bad for her hmmmm. Sorry but the parents should be making the decisions for a 9 year old not the 9 dictating. But something is off tbh as to why she doesn't want to stay and if that was me that would have been dealt with a long time ago!

Unsurprisingly some step-parents are treated like shit on here, when they are actively trying to reduce child maintenance from the level
Of state enforced bare minimum.

How does paying CMS cripple someone?

Sorry the drama on here is ridiculous. In my mind I divide everything in 2 that is bought for my DCS solely- clothes, rugby, swimming lessons, shoes, child care holiday clubs etc - it is amazing how fast it disappears.
Exaample : 7 weeks of holiday clubs at £150 -£200 per week per child x2

• £2100 - £2800 total,

• packed lunches - £60 per week

so Per parent: £1150 - 1400 childcare £30 each food per parent. Total : £1180 - 1430

CMS from the other parent is £500 pcm for 2

Anyone seeing the problem here ;
£1000 for 2 months of CMS
his share for the basic child care costs for 2 DCS already puts me the RP, contributing more from between £180-240.

I have not even clothed, fed watered or done anything with them. DF does not take them on holiday.

The RP invariably ends up covering the costs that CMS does not cover and they are not insignificant

I think this is a great idea. If her mum is happy for her Dad to come into the family home he could start really small, just go and do a small short activity with her she loves, start rebuilding the relationship one small step at a time.

She may have been going alternate weekends. We lived 2 hours away from SC when younger and I would collect from school on Fridays and DH would take them back Sunday evenings. It is wrong to assume that he didn't see her much.

It is wrong to assume that he didn't see her much.

But two nights a fortnight isn't much.

2/14 = 14.3% I wouldn’t classify that as substantial contact.

It also involves no weekday parenting, with none of the heavy lifting of school runs, doctors appointments, and is less likely to involve balancing work and child care.

@uneffingbelievable

As I said it doesn't work for both RP and NRP

Here's my DH example. He was 2 less night a fortnight. Does school runs. Pays lunches. Pays clubs. They pay holiday clubs on own days. She works evenings. She is Mtg free due to OH (before I get blasted my view (it it even matters) is that this is a good thing for DC) but I raise it as he has had to start again. Late thirties, new Mtg for 25 years etc etc.

He pays her £750 pcm based on a salary that is commissioned/bonus related. Based on last years figure. This year company have stopped bonus and reduced commission. So he will not earn anywhere near the amount. Plus it's paid once annually, not monthly so £750 pcm is a huge chunk of his monthly income. Based on his basic salary it would only be around £300 pcm. Child maintenance don't care they base it on last years p60.
He takes children away far more than Mum. Buys all their uniform and shoes. Goes half of school branded. Has full wardrobe at his house. Does all their medical running around.

But because she has a two night majority he has to pay that amount.

That is both unfair and crippling.

Not to mention ... she will choose for Nan or friends or whatever boyfriend over him having children as she is afraid that she won't be entitled to that £750 pcm. That is, across the month £187.50 per extra night she has the children. School age. Does that seem right to you?

Yes there is a huge issue with lots of parents not getting support but the current system does not work. It's abused by both RP and NRP.

Absolutely.

There are so many resident parents who make sure they "get" the DC more in order that maintenance doesn't drop.

Yes, court orders can change that, but then the RP will work on turning the DC against the NRP, so they start behaving so badly with the NRP/NRP's new partner, that the NRP spends all their time trying to repair what the RP is relentlessly doing and ends up thinking what's the point, and reduces contact. Exactly what the RP wants. Or they can poison the DC so much that they may even refuse to go. Again, exactly what the RP wants.

These are usually the ones who will also claim the feckless NRP wants nothing to do with the DC, whilst they are the hero stepping in, whilst actually they manufactured the whole situation.

So many control access over their DC in order to retain more money. Ignoring what would actually be best for the children. It's a very broken system.

outcome the bitter second family responses.

No system is perfect and no one has the moral high ground on this. The facts show that most RPS so not receive any CMS.
For once i think the Americans have it right.

The facts show that most RPS so not receive any CMS.

Like OP and her DP then.

@uneffingbelievable

"Bitter second families"

The only one who sounds bitter is you.

My response is balanced and acknowledges both sides are failed.

Scorned woman much.

Quite.

What about the other 38 weeks of the year where there isn’t the expense of holiday clubs. Why have you taken the most expensive weeks of the year and used them to for your sums? It’s not at all representative of the rest of the year and vast majority of the time.

@roseheartfly agreed.

Wonder if it wasn't referred to as the second family. But the new family and them the old family. Or the main family and them the step children/kids with his ex. Our family and exes kids. Absolute double standards... ok to refer to these kids as second family where it suits but such derogatory comments are never allowed for the first kids. Mumsnet get more toxic by the day

As a step mum to one minor step son that hubby pays child maintenance for I feel current child maintenance calculations are wrong , they should be based on real costs , most resident parents go out of pocket and they take the brunt of the cost . The reality is no child is ever going to cost less than £200 for basic costs ( 50% of £400 ) and that’s the bare minimum it should be paid , with every expense 50/50 including clothes and childcare on top .
As someone who deals with this day in and day out professionally too , what annoys me the most is when people go on to have more children while refusing to support correctly the ones they have .
My partner not only recently choose to increase child maintenance due to the cost of living also send his teen son £15 pocket money weekly ( none of it forced in any way , quite the opposite ) . There is no way I would have a child with someone that does the bare minimum for the children he already has .

I can choose any month and show you the outgoings over the year - I am still contributing significantly more.

£6000 per annum for 1 pre teen and one teen does not go far if we are strictly doing 50:50.
Just clothing them -school uniform - 2 different schools so no hand me downs
shoes, trainers and rugby boots
Rugby - Ex insists on for both, swimming lessons - we agree on
Guitar lessons - one loves, the other does tennis

£3000 per annum per child - £0.82 per day / £5.75 per week - ergo £1.64 total /£11.50 per week

If £11.50 per week - clothes, feeds entertains your child, educates them, washed them etc somewhere the short fall gets made up and in my case not by the NRP.

Lets not get started on tech and phones
Laptop and phone bought 100% by me - Dad pays £5pcm for a sim card each - whoopee!
With my electricity smart meter - can tell you they add £1.20 per day onto the electricity bill when they are home. Thnk God for school - it all adds up.

Um? £3000 pa is £8.22 a day isn't it? £57.53 a week, so £115 p/wk for 2 children.

And that's presuming the NRP never has the children at all.

I think I would be letting the court's decision of allowing visitation between father and daughter prevail.
It is very much in the best interests of them both.
How do you know who is gaming and who is texting?
Does he actually hear his daughter say 'no'?
It is very odd that your partner is allowing a nine year old to call the shots.
I would be pushing for visits near her home in a park.
I would need to see the child to be sure of her health.

Once visits are reestablished the payments might change too. Your husband would probably like to personally spend some money on his daughter and enjoy her company.

I wish there was a like button. Your post would have got one.
I also say that as a step mother

Do you "respect the wishes" of your own child when they want chocolate for breakfast or to watch a movie at 10:30pm? Or do you know that as the parent you have to make decisions in their best interests and put down boundaries? There are good reasons why the court doesn't "respect the wishes" of a child before they are 12. You are sending out the message loud and clear that you don't care about her or love her enough to insist on maintaining a good relationship with her.

The maintenance should be the last thing on your partner's mind.

However, you are stating that he is on £40k take home after tax! That's a take home salary of £3,333 and more than most couples have put together. It sounds like (once you've calculated how much it will cost to go to mediation and family court to rebuild your relationship with 9yo) you need to take a long hard look at your finances and work out how to live within your means.

How the heck are you paying £60 per week on packed lunches? What are they eating, lobster tails and filet mignon?

I always find it strange how (some) NRPs / partners of NRP despise paying CMS, especially when they have subsequent children in their new relationship. Raising children is not cheap, which you seem to appreciate in respect to your own child, so I can’t see why you don’t appreciate that your SDs mum will also have a high amount of costs.

I earn a similar amount to your DH (which I appreciate is higher than many). if I just had to pay £400 a month to cover everything that my child needs (school uniform, school trips, swimming lessons, other extra curricular activities, days out, school dinner money, all of their food…ect) I’d be absolutely laughing!

It’s not everything though is it? The NRP has the expense of providing a roof over their heads during their contact time, feed them during their contact time and everything else. So it’s £400 in addition to those costs. It’s a lot of money for one member of the household/family. I can’t allocate £400 pcm to each of my children, then absorb additional costs for the other say, 20% of the time. Obviously if they don’t have contact it’s better value. But the cost of an extra bedroom etc isn’t insignificant.

But in this case the NRP isn’t having to pay for the extra room, as there is no contact. The OP is complaining that the amount that it has gone up to is higher because of this. The OP also confirms that they have a 2 bed house, so they surely didn’t even have an extra bedroom just for her SD when contact was going ahead?

Also, you’re right, most people don’t allocate £400 per month, per child then pay cost for the extra 20% of time, because most people don’t have a £40k salary.

If £400 per month is based on a pre-tax salary of £40k then surely somebody on, for example £26k would be paying a lot less??

Also, it’s not quite accurate to interpret my post as implying that people can afford £400 per child. CMS payments only rise by a couple of percent for the second and third child. Ie a parent on the same salary paying for two children would it pay double the amount of maintenance as the OPs DP is paying , it would be more but only slightly.