If you could start again what would you do differently?

[SnowWhitesSM]

Hi it's me again

Brief overview - I have two teens FT and h has his ds 8. He moved out a month or so ago. When we got married dh came down with a huge case of the nrp dad guilt which infected our marriage and caused lots of problems. I became very resentful of his parenting and his son. Hs parenting is pretty normal apart from he gives the decision making power to his son. I believed for ages that I was a monster and it was my fault but actually his processes are wrong. I desperately wanted us to be a team and for us to be a family but at the time hs guilt and anxiety couldn't allow this. I had never been as miserable as what I was when we were living together and his son was around. I cannot do that to myself again.

So h is desperate that we don't split up. He's starting a CBT group for his anxiety and wants us to go back to counselling. I really want my marriage to work. I want to include his son and I want us both to be a team around all the dc. I want the flipping Waltons ffs.

So we're going to go to marriage counselling and get back to basics. We're going to have a year apart to work on ourselves. He is not to blame for everything that went wrong but he's the root of it. I'm not saying that to shift blame as I am responsible for my own words and actions when feeling hurt/rejected ect but it all stems from his dad guilt and giving decision making power to his son.

What do I need from him to be happy being a step parent? What works for you? How do I explain how to be a team with him?

but think it's important to note one day the fog will lift and you will be even more mad than any of us combined.

This x 100. You will be. And then to be healthy, you will process that away from him. Become a stronger healthier human being. And your life will flourish.

Thank you again everyone I honestly think I'd be back with him already if it wasn't for this thread.

Sassbot - peaceful non toxic homes are the best. I no longer have that feeling of dread when coming home. I now get to come home and just be me without worrying about him. My moods are no longer dictated by whether I've/or my dc put something away in the right cupboard or not. Whether my son is talking to loudly to his friends online or my daughters youtube video on in the kitchen when she's baking something is annoying h. It's lovely! I don't care if my son is too loud. I don't notice it in the living room. If dds youtube in the kitchen annoys me I just ask her to put her headphones in, there's no eggshells or drama. If they fall out, again I deal with it, without his views on the matter and eggshells if I haven't dealt with it how he thinks it should be dealt with. It's really lovely to feel comfortable in my home again. I need to keep reminding myself of that.

Firefly, that video was interesting thanks. I'm sorry you lost equity and your pension. I think I'll be OK as we haven't been married long. I will make a solicitors app ASAP and get it sorted. My uncle also said I need to get myself protected so he doesn't run up debts, even driving fines ect where his things are still addressed to my house.

H is definitely a chameleon. He mirrors me! I say I'm miserable then he's miserable. I say this and then so does he.

Candle, thank you for being so upset on my behalf. There's lots of comments like that throughout our marriage especially about that ex. I don't even know if it really was jealousy or something he just used. He was a boyfriend not a partner, we got on and had a laugh, I used to feel like a teenager when I was with him but I never wanted anything serious and neither did he. We only argued a few times but he did say I was childish in those arguments. I told him about that quite early on as we talked about lessons from past relationships and what others would say about us. Then when we started arguing he straight away used childishness as a form of attack against me. I knew I wasn't being childish and knew he was using that information against me. But I stayed with him. We didn't have a proper argument until we were married. We had disagreement but he never shouted at me and spun me in emotional circles. If he had I would like to think I wouldn't have married him.

I'm not rushing with the rest of his stuff. I'm going to go and visit my mum by the sea for a few days. Nice windy beach walks, nice food and a change of scenery.

Sorry candle I've used he and him to describe two different people! Hope you can make sense of that

Not become involved at all with a man awaiting a decree absolute and with a nutter ex wife

@SnowWhitesSM ditto. Mine have just switched. One is gaming online with his friends in their lounge. One is in the kitchen on YouTube watching a gamer game. (Seriously 🙄). But their videos don’t annoy me nor does how loud they are. Like you I simply say headphones please, or please quieten down slightly and it’s done.

Bickering is handled with and again we move on.

There is no dysfunction. Or drama. Or needing to put my children on a pedestal because mummy and daddy are divorced. Earlier I warned of a bathroom / bedroom inspection and off they scurried to clean toilets and straighten rooms. It’s honestly just easy and lovely.

Don’t underestimate how lovely that is to not only your well-being, but your children. They too will see the change. My kids (a while after we broke up) said to me (completely out the blue), that when it was just me and them - the house was calm. When my exp arrived, suddenly there would be more arguments, I would be more stressed and tense and equally I would snap at them more. The difference in me with him not being around was so noticeable by my children. I’d ask your kids what they think.

I also think these years are precious. Mine are teen and before I know it they’ll be gone. I don’t want these years to flash by because I am consumed with a narcissists games and control. Vs just being in a good place and being present with them.

These are the things I put front and Center. That give me the resolve to stay away, regardless of how many times he comes back and says he loves me. My children can see his behaviours and if I stay? They will lose some respect for me. And on what grounds will I ever be able to tell them to walk away from a toxic relationship in the future if I myself haven’t shown them it can be done?

My kids keep me strong on this. I have to do better and show them better.

So I've blocked him and blocked him from this morning. I'm at my dms. I've had a lovely blustery walk with the waves crashing in, we're watching funny films, I've had a few drinks, I've eaten nice food.

I've listened to him babbling this morning that I didnt support him in his business (I work ft in a demanding job) and that I'm resentful of his son and thats what made him so upset and miserable.. oo fuck off. That's total gaslighting. He made me resentment and miserable and all of those other things. He put me in a competition with his son. I should never have had to fight for my place.

Anyway, I've blocked him, I've come to my dms and cried, I've felt guilty, I've felt that I've exaggerated what he's done and been too sensitive. I've felt like all I've wanted to do is ring him and tell him I'm sorry for blocking him and I miss him and love him. But I haven't and I won't. If he was a half decent man then he would have listened to me when I first started telling him how upset I was a year or so ago. He wouldn't have used his son against me in arguments, he still uses his son to score points, he saw and heard how upset I've been for so long, any decent person would have seen that there was a problem to solve instead of putting it back on the other person.

Sassbot you're right. I really do need to be present with my dc at this age rather then stressing about his toxic ass!

@SnowWhitesSM you can see it all. Logically you can.

Yes you are absolutely correct that it should not take it getting to this level for any person to say ‘ok’. Most healthy people by now would have worked through their ‘this doesnt work’ and either found a solution. Or said. Sorry, it doesn’t work for me.

Snow. The path ahead of you is not easy. He is in your heart, he is in your mind. He knows you and sadly, that means he knows how to exploit you. I have just started to read confessions of a sociopath. (I am not by any means suggesting your DH is one).

I read it regarding my situation. Let me say this much. It makes so much sense.

And honestly. The account of how she assesses people so she can take what she wants from them? Chilling. My exp to a tee.

Thank you @sassbott hope you're having a lovely time away?

I have been looking at non violent communication and can see where I've gone wrong a bit. But that still does not excuse how he's treated me and what he's said and done to me. I didn't deserve to be treated the way I've been treated

@SnowWhitesSM I’m having a great time! Thank you.

It’s not you. If you were these personalities, you wouldn’t even have the ability to reflect on yourself. Trust me.

Please read the book. It is very insightful.

I will do thanks sassbot!

Ohhh @sassbott glad your enjoying it ! I should have probably said some type of warning as it can be a little ahem well you know.

@SnowWhitesSM I want you to do one thing for me, instead of looking at how you could have communicated better in a non violent way, I want you to think of you were talking to essentially a wall. Try thinking about where the pattern of thought comes from that are somehow always accountable. It would have started young way young before your ex. Your brain will try to skip over it, keep just losely exploring when you have felt like this before.

If someone will be violent or speak violently there is diddy you can do about it. That's a active choice they give themselves permission to do. Nothing to do with you !

@candlelightsatdawn honestly? Chilling.

But it makes so much sense.

There was a point in our relationship. Very early on. I have a nice home. Most people will come in and be quite chatty and say in passing ‘nice house’. Basic social niceties right? That’s what we all do.

I walked in with him. I walked ahead into the kitchen. And there was silence. I walked back into the hallway and just stopped. And there was a look on his face that even then I thought ‘my god, you’re assessing my house.’

I didn’t say a word. He proceeded to walk through the downstairs. I stayed quiet. His commentary when it was done? ‘You don’t know how to do good interior design do you?’.

I remember being so confused by that reaction. Why? At some level he had a point. No, I don’t have an eye for interior design. But my house is still nice. To be blunt, far nicer than his was (and far better decorated), yet I would never have dreamt about saying anything about his home.

Now I can see it. I was being assessed. He could see the ‘value’. He just didn’t want to give me that value. Or that superiority.

He stayed with me for a reason. Good job, financially stable, nice home. Assessing. All the time

At the time I thought I was so wrong thinking that way. Now? Now I know my radar was spot on. People like this do exist. And they have the patience of years to ultimately get what they want.

I’m starting to re listen to my internal radar. And it’s proving invaluable.

I’m not saying he’s a sociopath btw ( or that snows H is) Nor am I labelling him (or anyone)with that label. The reason the book is so critical (and everyone should read it), is because every single one of us need to understand the way certain peoples brains are wired and subsequent character traits. It’s that simple.

I've just ordered that book @sassbott, thanks for the recommendation.

One experience I had while contemplating whether to stay/go. I wrote an article shared on professional social media, which garnered 10k views and 200 likes. Small beer to some, but I was amazed (plus pretty pleased with myself).

Every single family/friend, and even some I had not expected, contacted me with congratulations/you've done well etc etc, EXCEPT MY EXDP, who was my DP at the time. He never said a word.

He was forced to acknowledge it when a close family member of his who lives overseas asked him to pass on a congratulations message as he'd seen it through a friend of a friend. I asked DP what he thought, given he'd not mentioned it, and he claimed he'd said well done, but I KNEW he hadn't.

If it'd been 4 or 5 years ago, I'd have probably agreed with him that I'd got it wrong. However, I'd sent the link to him on WhatsApp and got crickets, so his gaslighting couldn't penetrate this time.

It's those little things that chip away and make you conclude that you can't stay in such a relationship in the long-term. It's not you @SnowWhitesSM, it's him!

@sassbott that's interesting about sizing up your house, you noticing it, and the cognitive dissonance that must have occurred to continue to entertain him in your home and see him again.

If I think hard enough I can see those things but different in h. I don't believe h does that sizing up thing. I believe h is so insecure that he reflects and mirrors others thinking what they want or what they have is what he wants.

H is really good looking, if we were to be crude he's a 9.5/10. He is however, completely insecure about how his hair is, what clothes to wear, what aftershave, if he said the right thing, what he could have said, did he make the right decision. His neurosis is pretty unbelievable. It's all very much based on what other people will think of him.

@Starseeking well done on your article. It sounds like your ex was very jealous on the attention you garnered. Pathetic, he should have been boasting about you to everyone.

@candlelightsatdawn thank you, I'm not sure why I keep holding myself accountable. He's not googling nvc and how he could have done better! He's just feeling sorry for himself and putting it on me.

It's so nice to know he can't contact me. I'm not waiting for a phone call, I'm not on eggshells. It's lovely!

I regard stunning good looks as a bit of a red flag these days. You can be lucky, but they can get handed everything on a plate from early on in life. Often they've not had the opportunities to deal with rejection and failure, and as adults, their partners pay the price.

@SnowWhitesSM checking in. How you doing?

Remember zero judgement here no matter what has happened. Hope you’re ok.

Thank you @sassbott

I've obviously got back with him 🙄 I just missed him so much. I spent NY eve and day with him whilst my dc were with their dad.

So we had lots of great sex, we argued a couple of times and I thought I really wanted to be back with him but actually I don't think I do. I haven't seen him since NY day. I could have seen him yesterday but didn't want too, I could also see him tomorrow but I've booked a local restaurant to take my dc out to instead. He's got his son all weekend and I'm happy I don't have to see either of them.

He's still trying to make me feel bad for packing his sons stuff up - my response is that he shouldn't have been a gaslighting dick and instead of trying to win against me he should have supported me.

In the arguments we've had he's twisted, turned it and made out like I'm being unreasonable when I'm not. I'm journalling it all down, I feel quite removed from it all.

I don't know why I can't keep him blocked though. I don't know why I listen to him and believe him how sorry he is - until I accept his apology and then bam it's all my fault again 🙄 but I'm not living with him, he's not moving back in, I'm cracking on with my own life.

@SnowWhitesSM zero judgement here. Trust me. Thank you for staying on here and talking. I’ve been in your shoes before and I completely understand.

I still think getting him out of your home was a Very difficult step to take but you took it. Be proud of that and focus on that achievement. You have created a safe and lovely home environment for you and your DC.

Focus on keeping that boundary in place. That’s good enough for now. These situations are not easy to get out of. Keep posting x

I’m further along than you. In terms of probably how many times I had tried to leave before finally reaching where I have.

As a result I am now working on understanding trauma bonding and what kept me there. I’ll keep updating my thread with interesting links that are helping me (just posted a really helpful one on trauma bonding). I’m still not in the clear. I miss him (today is a rough day) and that’s ok. I’ll need continued support for a while longer to just stay away and continue no contact. It’s not easy.

It often takes several attempts to leave before you’re finally ready. In my early 20s I was in an awful relationship, which escalated to actual violence. A friend said to me “you’ll leave him when you’re ready. Nothing we can say or do will make you leave if you’re not ready. But one day you’ll just know you can be happy without him.” And I did. Don’t know how she got so wise at 21!

I’ve recently had similar with my DP of 9 years. We’ve split up several times, had blazing rows, I’ve even called the police on him before when he was kicking off and refusing to leave my house. But like an idiot I took him back. This time it feels different.

Like you, I can imagine being lured back for the sex, but the respect is gone. That adoration that I used to have is so tainted by all the nastiness that it would only be a matter of time before it was over again.

Each time you leave him, you get one step closer to freedom. Going back doesn’t undo that. It’s just a way for you to confirm your feelings about this.

And yes, I miss him every day and cry every day. It’s been a month with no word from him, the worst Xmas ever. But I’m sure in my head that it’s over, it’s taking my heart a little while to catch up.

Thank you @sassbott - from interesting attachment training at work - love is attunement for pleasure, a trauma bond is attunement for survival. I will have a look at the links thanks.

Yes, you're right. I got him out. My dc are happy, I'm happy. I'm genuinely happy. I don't miss him, I only miss him when he tells me how sorry he is and how much he loves me. After the initial euphoria and hysterical trauma bonding wears off the reality of day to day I don't want or miss.

I hope you wake up feeling better tomorrow

Thanks @RoyKentsChestHair it sounds like it's really hard for you right now. I know exactly what you mean by the adoration being tainted. It's pretty rubbish! I don't want to sound patronising but I find going for a walk if I feel close to tears, or in tears, helps a lot. It feels like the last thing you want to do but it really does make you feel better.

I don't miss him. I got back with him because I was stupid enough to unblock him and ask him about his cats injections (I've ended up with his cat as he couldn't take the cat) and he cried, apologised, took all the accountability, sent me voice notes saying the same thing then I was quite cold. I was very much like - no we don't work, it doesn't make either of us happy. He got really upset and I ended up driving round to his instead of going out with my cousin. We cuddled for ages, he kept telling me how much he misses me, we kept cuddling and it felt so right. I felt like yes this is it, he's seen where he's gone wrong, he kept saying give me this year to work on myself and sort myself out give me this chance and I warmed up to him. I opened up again to him as I wanted to believe him.

I now just think oh go away and leave me alone!