University expenses dilemma

[Iwonder08]

Dear All,

I would appreciate your opinion on the dilemma.

My husband of 3 years has 2 sons, 16 and 19, we have a newborn together.
19yo DSS will start uni in September.
Strangely enough neither my DH nor DSS ever tried to actually calculate the student dept DSS will have after graduating considering both uni fees and a maintenance loan. Both DSS and DH thought it is unlikely he will go to uni due to having bad grades, but 1 uni accepted him with all Cs.
Now DH is debating whether he should pay for DSS's accommodation (£6k/year) in order to reduce his student debt.
Child maintenance he pays now is quite high, it will be reduced a bit when SDD starts uni. The reduction is significantly less than £6k/year he is considering for the student accommodation.
£6k/year is technically possible, but will leave no disposable income for DH which means all the unplanned/emergency expenses, holidays, realistically more than 50% of the childcare costs when I go back to work in several months will have to be covered by me. We didn't go through the details yet, it all came very sudden yesterday.
I have never been in the situation before, my parents haven't supported me through uni, I had jobs. I honestly don't know if it is reasonable approach and should be expected or is my DH is reacting this way due to this unexpected place at uni when he didn't have high expectations before..

Very different ideas of parental role here. I don’t think it suddenly drops off a cliff at 18. After all, many school students are close to 19 when they sit A levels. I continue to house and feed a uni student in the holidays without expecting rent. The only real cost is food and a bit of extra electricity and water. The big costs are when they are away - housing, food, books, clothes. My parents never asked me for rent. It let me save enough to permanently
leave home a year after graduating. I would only start asking for rent when my “child” had graduated and worked for a year. Maybe it depends on how much disposable income you have or your own priorities.

I guess I am following what my parents did with me ... I am still paying off my student loan. My parents didn't give me a penny and all birthday and Christmas presents stopped at 18. I would consider my parents as high earners too. I thought it was the norm?

Because if you can afford it, it's a nice thing for parents to do to help their kids start off life with as little debt as possible*
It might be nice but it is not forcibly giving the right message to your kids. I've seen a number of kids who get money from their parents who have no qualms spending hundreds on partying over weekends because... Well they can sfoord it with their parents money.

I've also seen a few who finish school, struggle to get job, end up with an entry job paying low and still expect their parents to subsidise their lifestyle.

I think that instauring a sense of financial responsibility in kids going to Uni is actually doing them a favour. It makes them consider the ratio work:money to spend. This is why DD is choosing to work long hours during the holidays. She wants to enjoy herself but is getting the concept that you have to work hard to be able to afford to do so.

I'm still helping her but she is only so much reliant on me and don't consider it her due to have her parents supporting her financially.

It's not a 'nice thing to do'. Parental contribution is expected and required.

Expecting parents to fund lifestyle or parents daft enough to actually fund lifestyle? Who exactly is in the wrong?

I have yet to come across a funded student who is ungrateful and out partying. The majority are just trying to build a future. They all know it’s a competitive world they live in and work experience - any work experience - is better than none at all. Young people are able to develop a work ethic and understand work:money to spend ratio even if their parents give them financial support on top.

sotired you are right if course. But on mumsnet if you give your 19 year old 50 quid to buy a coat, you are basically saying they never have to work and that you will give them every penny you earn so they can buy beer and sit on the PS4 for the rest of their lives.

No birthday or Christmas presents after 18? That can’t be the norm. They are presents. Don’t you give and receive with your nearest and dearest?

My parents didn't give me a penny and all birthday and Christmas presents stopped at 18. I would consider my parents as high earners too. I thought it was the norm?

I'll throw my MN hand grenade in here which will enrage everyone. We have 4 young adults living in our house at the moment, aged 20-24 (one of them isn't ours). They all have jobs, but not very well paid ones. And... we don't charge them a penny rent, I regularly fill the fridge for them and they still get presents.

Whatever will become of them 🤷‍♀️.

Parental contribution is most definitely required. The most DS2 can borrow is £4750, his rent in a shared uni flat, uncatered, non ensuite or basin is £4500. Leaving £250 to fund food, travel, books, clothing, entertainment etc. From 2nd year onwards or from next summer onwards, I expect him to get a few hours work to supplement what we are giving him, but we will do as much as we can while we can for both at uni. They both have savings too as they've pretty much banked their pocket money for a long time.

We've also made sure that they have been kitted out with a decent wardrobe, boots, technology etc. Both have new glasses and sunglasses, rain coat etc. They both drive and have access to a car, DS2 will just be in the holidays. They shouldn't need anything major to buy for the next year or so.

But, if I couldn't afford to do it then I wouldn't be able to. Our income is significantly less than £60k.

SD is getting a minimum loan. We will help her out but she is expected to have a part time job and has been working through holidays and saving.

Our household income is over 60k but we have a mortgage and another child to support. She made a decision to go to uni rather than an apprenticeship or straight to work therefore she has to pay for some of it herself. She understands this.
Her mother gives her nothing so all the support is down to us.

We all have mortgages and other children to support. It's really crap not to top up to maximum loan level if you are earning over 60k.

Ligresa if you have spare 5k you can throw at your adult child good for you. You have no idea about other people's outgoings though so you really shouldn't judge.
SD will get as much as we are able to give her.

@Browniebronze there's no need to get uppity with my point. I'm in the camp of providing parental contribution.

I remember Martin Lewis doing a programme about this, about this time last year. He very much assumed that it’s parents’ responsibility to top up those that get the smaller loans of just over 4K to make sure they are equivalent to the highest loan of about 9k. I so remember he had one lad who was on the smallest loan but his parents didn’t top up at all, he couldn’t work out how the poor lad could afford uni and had to tell him to go and have that conversation with his parents. BUT I do find it rubbish that you have to assume parents WILL top up as obviously some won’t. All accommodation we looked at last year in various unis was around 6k. We top up our daughter but she has also worked the entire summer to put some money in her pocket for her return. I think that’s fair.

Only on MN are precious students not expected to work, every student I know - DD included- work all year to supplement their income.
In this case why would maintenance still be paid if he’s no longer living with his mother? Use the maintenance to help support him at uni. Looking at his loan entitlement he’s going to have £70 pw to eat so a job will make him comfortable enough, at 19 he’s more than able to understand budgeting.

Only on MN are precious students not expected to work

🤔

No student I know HAS to work to pay their rent. Most do work in the holidays. Some cannot work due to uni rules or courseload.

Sure, if you are doing photography at an ex poly with 4 hours contact time then a part time job is easy.

@ligresa
Aren’t they the lucky ones. Don’t be so bloody condescending, not everyone has to aim for a corporate career.
You do know there are students out there with no family support at all, no one to top them up?
I left home at 18 and was entirely self sufficient, had worked part time since I was 14 as my mother wouldn’t pay for anything other than feed me, so get your head out your arse.

I think he should pay for something but not 6k a year. He could set up a food card and put £40 a week so he is paying for food and toiletries.

Are you always so rude?

If you were self supporting at 18 you'd be entitled to full maintenance loan of 9k a year btw.

@ligresa
I’m rude? You’re the one looking down your nose at photography degrees!
You have a try living on £9k per year, wasn’t that rate 25yre ago.

This thread shows the reality that DD faced starting Uni and that is the wide divergence in parents attitude to supporting their kids in Uni that has little correlation with parental earning.

There is no right or wrong just different views very much as there are different parenting and disciplining views when kids are younger.

My experience though is that uni kids who work PT on a regular basis are more aware of the cost of things and more likely to start the workforce with a better understanding of budgeting but again, this is not a black or white outcome.

The point is that it’s implied that parents who are “means tested” as being able to afford it can top up. So strangely the ones who struggle are those from wealthier homes whose parents refuse make up the difference between minimum loan and the maximum that is paid to those from low income homes. Of course those on maximum loan are far less likely to get any other help from parents - whether cash towards a car or computer or joining them on the family holiday.

In this case it’s more complicated. The mother doesn’t work and the son would get maximum loan. But if dad can afford to help then is it right to lumber his son with maximum debt? Only he can decide. If he helps now then his son will be marginally better off later. It doesn’t sound like mum will give any extra help.

It is a big commitment but many, many parents help their kids through uni.

Do students not work in the holidays anymore? I never worked term time as was on a very academic course but over the three holidays would work as much as I could (agency work in day and pub work In the evening) which paid off my overdraft and sent me back with a bit of cash. If the loan is paying his fees and accommodation I don't see the big deal. £500 a month on top is excessive. If the loan doesn't cover the accommodation then I have a bit more sympathy as he needs to live but he should be funding his own expenses.

I was fortunate enough to not have to pay uni fees and had friends whose parents refused to pay anything towards their accommodation and didn't qualify for a grant. They had to take full loan and work. I'm not sure what is so very different and at least the threshold for having to repay has gone down.

Your husband can only pay what your family can afford. It's not fair of him to ask you to sub this.

You have a try living on £9k per year I think most students could manage, particularly if they work in the holidays and are lucky enough to be allocated cheaper accommodation. The variation in accommodation prices is really unhelpful Imo. Ds wanted no ensuite, shared bathroom at 4100pa but was allocated partly catered at 7500!

Fwiw, my parents refused to fill in the grant form so i got nothing to live on (back in the 80s). I worked four nights a week just to stay at uni. It was shit, tiring and I wouldn't want any of mine having to do it. Yes, if they want money to party more then work a night or two for the extra, but worrying that you wont be able to pay your rent and will get kicked out is no more 'character building' than if it happened to you or any other adult. Not fun.