Why did the England players put medals on and then take them off?

[Opalfeet]

I'm intrigued 🤔

People are slagging them off on YouTube now aswell.

They don't deserve that.

Didn't need to @IcedPurple, got my own European Championship medal. But have also not won enough times. The world still turns.

The team has been brilliant, would be nice if the 'fans' could conduct themselves in a way that brought pride to the country too eh?

@MeandT

Didn't need to *@IcedPurple*, got my own European Championship medal. But have also not won enough times. The world still turns.

The team has been brilliant, would be nice if the 'fans' could conduct themselves in a way that brought pride to the country too eh?

So now you've moved to slagging off the fans?

Looking back at how these young men have conducted themselves on and off the pitch throughout the tournament, some of them still very young, with all the expectations piled on them, after they shook the winners hands I'm not going to judge them negatively for removing their medals.

Absolutely.

Breaking into Wembley, booing other anthems, spitting at children, damaging property, fights, sexual assaults, domestic violence...yes @IcedPurple, it is always the football 'fans' I've had the problem with.

My point about the opportunity to keep a finalist's medal on, was that it is a great opportunity to show 'fans' that losing one match is not the same as failure, and can still be (disappointedly) celebrated. Even when you are a super competitive player at the top of your sport. Something I think both Henderson and Southgate did admirably last night.

Especially when it's the final and you've finished ahead of 22 other teams!

If you think keeping a runners up medal is going to influence fan behaviour, you're in cloud cuckoo land.

If you think that somehow, it's affecting the nation's psychological approach to losing, and that might be contributing to fan behaviour, you're in cloud cuckoo land.

It’s quite usual in football to take off the medal when you’re on the losing team; rugby too. I’m not sure why such a big deal is being made of it on this particular occasion.

We've kind of covered this. The fact that 'almost all players' do the same is very much part of the issue.
Your issue
Mine? Can you explain how? There's quite a bit of discussion on here about it.

Slightly different point, but I think the penalty decider is practically cruel. Before they introduced it, when a team were even, they tossed a coin to decide who was the winner.

It really only signified the penalty kicks. Not the match itself. The young guys were brought on only a little bit before the kicks. They weren't in the same place psychologically as if they had been playing for longer.

On a different point again, Andre Agassi said he knew which way Boris Becker was going to serve by the way he stuck out his tongue. He didn't want Becker to know that he had twigged this, so let it go sometimes and responded correctly only when it really mattered.

Mine? Can you explain how? There's quite a bit of discussion on here about it.

Yes, because you're the one stating it is very much part of 'the issue'.
What issue, other than the once you've opted to try and make it into?

You're 100% right @VerticalHorizon, I am in cloud cuckoo land!

But it's nice to dream of a country where every person (who was vaguely interested in football) could watch how to work hard and improve their skills; how to form a team that works for the improvement of all - ahead of individual achievement; that gets help with managing anger, disappointment and anxiety so they can deal with it and improve their outcome, not lash out at the nearest person; to accept defeats graciously; to acknowledge competitors respectfully; to celebrate successes with dignity; how to work with diversity successfully.

I support the England football team, there is so much we can all learn from them, I can still live in hope that the fanbase might, can't I?

Respect for one's opponents and for the game itself (where winning and losing are after all both fundamental); is a broad issue and absolutely takes in good conduct in all areas of the game. Not booing the other side's national anthem, not calling non-white players racist names and not trolling players on social media are all related.

MeandT, I'm with you. How depressing that wanting these values and actions is seen as being in 'cloud cuckoo land'.

@IntermittentParps

MeandT, I'm with you. How depressing that wanting these values and actions is seen as being in 'cloud cuckoo land'.

Because you're not the ones experiencing a massive defeat. As has been said, it's not even just the loss itself but the aftermath and disappointment followed, the backlash.

The penalty takers feel they've let everyone down. If they don't want to wear the medal immediately after, so what? Literally who cares, they're allowed to be upset

Slightly different point, but I think the penalty decider is practically cruel. Before they introduced it, when a team were even, they tossed a coin to decide who was the winner

Did they?
If so, this was very rare. They drew lots, briefly, and even used corner kicks as a differentiator, but I think the general consensus was that it's better to decide the outcome at least of some measure of skill rather than a totally random coin toss, or drawing of lots.

How depressing that wanting these values and actions is seen as being in 'cloud cuckoo land'.

That was not what was said. Which now reveals to me your true intent - provocation.

What was said was 'you're in cloud cuckoo land if you think the removal of medals in influencing fan behaviour'.

Wanting sensible fan behaviour is something we all want, so please, don't try to twist what was said, it's more unbecoming than the removal of a medal to which you so strongly object.

@VerticalHorizon

Slightly different point, but I think the penalty decider is practically cruel. Before they introduced it, when a team were even, they tossed a coin to decide who was the winner

Did they?
If so, this was very rare. They drew lots, briefly, and even used corner kicks as a differentiator, but I think the general consensus was that it's better to decide the outcome at least of some measure of skill rather than a totally random coin toss, or drawing of lots.

Many sports end in penalty shoot outs as a decider. Ice Hockey is one. It's just the rules of the game. Can't be drawing straws to get a winner otherwise what would be the point of playing for 90mins

Indeed. It's not ideal, but it's a reasonably practical solution after other avenues have been exhausted (Extra Time).

It feels cruel, but it's still a measure of skill and nerve. It's dramatic too, which adds some excitement.

@VerticalHorizon

Slightly different point, but I think the penalty decider is practically cruel. Before they introduced it, when a team were even, they tossed a coin to decide who was the winner

Did they?
If so, this was very rare. They drew lots, briefly, and even used corner kicks as a differentiator, but I think the general consensus was that it's better to decide the outcome at least of some measure of skill rather than a totally random coin toss, or drawing of lots.

It never happened in a football final because there was never a need, so penalty shoot-outs were introduced in the 1970s.

I do agree that while they're excrutiating, they're the least bad solution. Replays aren't practical. The Golden Goal experiment sounded good in theory, but not in practice. Having zero time to respond to a goal is just not the way football works. So penalties it is.

It happens in all tournaments around the world, not just England. It's a "sorry you weren't good enough" medal, why would they want to wear that? I bloody wouldn't.

VerticalHorizon, you're right, I misconstrued that post.
But now I've understood it properly, I will say that I do think keeping a runners up medal is going to influence fan behaviour; and I do think it affects the nation's psychological approach to losing and might be contributing to fan behaviour. For the same reasons as Southgate's approach to confronting racism and advocating diversity is influencing and affecting behaviour around football.

And I'm not here to 'provoke'; what a strange assertion.

I will say that I do think keeping a runners up medal is going to influence fan behaviour; and I do think it affects the nation's psychological approach to losing and might be contributing to fan behaviour.

I completely agree.
I had a couple of black friends who went to watch the match in person and were assaulted because England lost (and 3 N words lost the game for us as is going around on SM).

When England lost I was gutted but I wasn’t angry as they’d come a very close second to a very good team.
As a PP said racists will find a way to be racist regardless but this idea that they have failed because they came second should be something that is challenged worldwide.
I know you’ll get the posters saying but that isn’t part of the game, you don’t make elite athletes like that etc etc but there were disgusting scenes last night and today and this is something we see all the time so obviously something needs to change and simply being proud that our country came second will do a lot of good.

(Fans) Breaking into Wembley, booing other anthems, spitting at children, damaging property, fights, sexual assaults, domestic violence ...

I was familiar with the rest, but what's with the "breaking into Wembley"?

Given the number of staff around I wouldn't have thought they could - unless you mean those trying to shove and push their way in without a ticket?

About 100 'fans' without tickets stormed the disabled entrance.

Thank you, IntermittentParps, I wasn't aware of that

Probably I ought to be surprised, and I only wish it was so ...