Should you know where your 11 year old is at all times? £2 charity donation for every answer

[AnnMumsnet]

We've been working with the charity Railway Children with the help of Aviva and they would like to know how you tackle the difficult balance of keeping your children safe and giving them enough freedom.

In particular they'd like to know:

Our ability to keep in touch with where our children are and what they are doing is greater than ever because of mobiles, but as we relax our hold on them and allow them to have greater independence how can we ensure that they stay safe and make the right decisions?

At what age do you allow your children more freedom and independence and what parameters do you set them?

What discussions do you have with your children about safe behaviour, safe people and safe places to encourage them to keep safe when they are away from the home?

Aviva have kindly agreed that they will donate £2 to Railway Children for every valid comment posted on this thread (up to a maximum of 3 times per user). Railway Children work with UK children who have run away from home and end up living on the streets. Part of their work focuses on preventative education, encouraging children to think and talk about safe people and safe places to help them to make the correct decisions when they are away from the home. You can find out more about the charity and more ways to get involved here

thanks MNHQ

PS please note your comments may be used on the Railway Children pages on MN as well as elsewhere.

Our bid for the start of dd's independence was when she was about 8. We let her walk partway to school alone (it was 5 minutes away with a road to cross, so we'd get her across and then follow her at a distance).

We live in a small town, and dd had always come shopping with us, so most of the shopkeeper knew her. There's also a market pnce a week, and the stall holders all knew her too, so once she was walking to school happily we would let her go round the town on her own on Saturday mornings.

She sang in church, and got involved with coffee morning down there. Often people would be walking past our house on their way home so they would walk dd back while they were at it.

By the time she was 11 we were happy to know where she was going, but didn't need to know where exactly she was on the way there or back. So, if she was off to a coffee morning at the church, we knew she'd be yhere for a couple of hours, but she might then take another hour getting home as she wandered into shops and chatted to the shopkeepers - if they weren't busy. There've been a couple of times where we've got a bit worried because she's been very late. I walked down to church one night when they'd been singing at a private ceremony because it was supposed have finished at 9 and she still wasn't back at 10pm, but in fact it was running very late, so I hung about outside in the rain for an hour until it was over!

On the whole, dd is very responsible and sensible. If there's a delay, or something comes up - eg, bumping into a friend and going to a cafe - then she'll call us. She's 14 now.

Second post:

At the same time as weaning ourselves off 'constant vigilance' with dd, we have talked to her about stranger danger, who to go to if she is scared or worried, where to go. She was very confident about talking to people or asking for help. She has only been worried twice, once by an eccentric woman (well kown in the town, harmless but a little scary) and once by a very elderly gent who became a bit obsessed with dd as Alzheimer's took hold. I had a chat with our Community policeman and the two 'designated safe people' (designated by the police) who were already keeping an eye on the gent anyway. We also talked to dd about him quite a lot.

We had talked to her about going anywhere with strangers, about not going into people's houses unless she checked with us first (there are adults from the church who are not particularly friends of ours, but whom we know are fine, for instance; they are highly unlikely to take dd home with them without calling us and telling us why, mind you).

More recently, we have talked about the effects of gossip on innocent people, so that she is aware that there are wider issues than simply her own safety.

Third post:

I don't think I should know exactly where my dd is all the time certainly not now that she's 14. I wanted to know exactly where she was all the time, when she was 11, but given what she was like, it wasn't going to be particularly productive in the long term if I hovered over her and let her know how anxious I was! She needed to know that we trusted her to be sensible and responsible, and she responded well. I am pretty sure that - her being her - it would have pushed her in the wrong direction if we had followed her around, questioned her if she was 5 minutes late, and so on.

We have been very lucky in that primary school was so close, the main shops are so close, the church is close. We are also exceedingly lucky that dd is a sensible child with her head screwed on.

However, everything could change in the future. She could be a total, out of control nightmare in 6 months' time. Who knows.

My Nephew - nearly 11 year old boy - disapeared often and caused all sorts of grief! Mobile made no difference as he just switched it off! Needless to say his parents know exactly where he is right now - grounded and in his room or doing chores until he knows better!

Yes. At least an overview of where they should be anyway with an agreed means of contact and a 'due home' time.

Yes I do and he goes somewhere else with friends he must and always tells me

At 11 they need a bit of independence but they are all different, when they start to ask to do things risk assess it and then compromise. You cannot know where they are all the time, I used the summer holidays before they went to senior school to let them try doing things alone. Then when they get to senior school they soon learn that if they don't stick to the guidelines of time, phoning home etc they got grounded and they don't like that!

Absolutely yes. It wouldn't matter where we were, when dd was 11 she needed to check with me before leaving the house, be contactable by phone and return at the time agreed. She behaved completely within these bounds at the time, understanding the need for adults to have knowledge of her whereabouts.

She was aware of personal safety risks and she always had a contingency plan, be it emergency money, back up route or ability to use a payphone to make a reverse charge call.

My children are younger, but thinking back to my own childhood, the nagging in my teens quizzing me about where I was going backfired, as it led to my answering 'London' and legging it to the station and buying a Travelcard. Mostly ended up mooching around Camden Market.

What would have been more useful would have been teaching me what to do in various situations, from a younger age, eg what to do when a pervy bloke on the train rubs his leg up and down yours and then whispers "I'll enjoy seeing you later" when you get off the train. Or what to do if you get your ticket and money stolen (and phone, nowadays). Or if there's a disaster and no transport back to your town. I figured all these out on my own, not necessarily the best way.

My 12yo is allowed round the village without telling me exactly where he is, he can only be at the park or a friend's house. He would always tell me first if he's going fishing. This has been the same for about a year now. He also walks nearly 2 miles to school and has done for the last year.
He has a mobile and I expect him to keep in contact if he wants to be later than previously arranged.
He has been allowed to meet friends in the park or callfor them since about 9.

My 9.5yo DS2 has only just started to get a tiny bit of freedom. His friends don't live as close as DS1s did so he doesn't knock for them. He has been allowed to meet friends in the park a couple of times but a friend of mine has always been there and texted me when he arrived. He doesn't have a phone yet as our rule is you have to be ten for a phone.

I leave the 9.5yo home alone for a maximum of ten mins if I need to pop to village shop or similar. I leave the 12yo alone for up to 2/3 hrs but would normally be in contact during that time. I'd leave the two together for 10/15 mins only.

It's such a difficult balance, we're all treading carefully and a lot depends on the friends of your dc. DS1s friends always had a lot of independence so DS1 also got more freedom. DS2s friends in contrast are a lot 'younger' and as parents we have been talking about gradually having to introduce more freedom and independence to prepare them for secondary in 2 yrs time.

DD1 is 8 (nearly 9) and currently doesn't go far/do much without an adult knowing where she is. Recently we've started letting her stay at home for approx. 30 mins whilst DD2 is collected from elsewhere - she knows not to answer the door (or even to look out of the window) if the doorbell goes, can operate the phone to dial 999 in an emergency and knows that if the house burns down she should leave the house, close the door behind her and go to one of the neighbours for help.

We live in SE London and she doesn't yet go out alone although she will pop along the road to a different shop if I'm in a cafe. She has more freedom in the holidays e.g. at the beach, whilst at festivals with us etc. but that's because she's good on landmarks, is capable of making good choices when it comes to identifying a suitable adult if she needed help, will follow instructions re: boundaries/time limits and is a real stickler for rules and takes very seriously the responsibility that comes with the extra freedom she's allowed!

By the time she's in Y6 she will be using the bus independently to travel around SE London. If relevant, I imagine we'll let her use the tube independently too as she's already good at navigating her way around the underground. When she goes to secondary school she is likely to have to catch a train/tube/bus so it makes sense for her to feel confident about doing so before Y7.

She knows about keeping valuables like iPods, mobiles etc. out of sight, about not using gadgets when distracted/coming out of stations/walking along and also understands that when she eventually gets a mobile it will be serviceable but not too cool...she has accepted that at the moment but I imagine she'll feel differently once she's in Y7!

S, by the time I have an 11-year-old, I don't expect to know exactly where she is. I will expect her to stick to agreed plans when she goes out alone and to contact me if those change for whatever reason...pretty much as I did with my parents 25 years ago. No mobile required for the amount of contact I think that will amount to!

He pops up the shop for me, walks the dog for me, sadly he doesn't have any friends local enough for him to just go and visit. Most of his mates live a car journey away. DD was out and about far more than he is at the same age.

I like to know where I can find my DDs if I need them, but knowing who they are with is far more important to me than knowing exactly where they are. They are 10 and 12.

We are lucky living in a small village, there are only so many places they can be.

When we go to town I let them go off with friends but have regular meet-ups (eg- see you outside New Look in 1/2 an hour) then split up again.

I'm trying to increase their confidence and independence so that when they do catch the train to town without me, they know their way around and how to get home safely.

My youngest has just turned 12. She travels to & from school independently unless it's before 7 or after 5.30 in the winter (sports/drama). She doesn't text me when she arrives at school.

In the holidays she usually talks to me about her plans - she wanted to make a pavlova & needed white wine vinegar so went to the shops to get some. It took longer than I'd expected as she had to go to loads of shops & ended up in a proper supermarket. I asked her why it took so long when she got home & she explained. Sometimes she catches trains & buses to visit friends, we talk about the route before she goes if she hasn't been there before.

I always know where my teenage son is as he likes staying at home. I have to force him out of the house in the holidays & if I didn't go with him he'd sneak home. He travels to & from school independently but won't have a phone.

I've told them all that if someone makes them feel uncomfortable on the tube to change carriage at the next station (drunks, leery men) & that they should always use zebra crossings etc. I think they are more at risk of a road traffic accident than strangers.

My daughter is almost 11 (going into year 6 in Sept) and I'm finding it difficult to find the balance between allowing her to grow into an independent young woman without being an irresponsible parent by giving her too much freedom. She walks to piano lessons (only a 5-10 minute walk and the only road to cross can be crossed outside our house) and I've recently started to let her pop to the local shop by herself. She is also allowed to stay in the house by herself for about 30 minutes.

It's the next stage that I'm struggling with; meeting friends and being together in a group without adult supervision. This is because they can sometimes become a bit silly when they're together and maybe won't concentrate when crossing roads etc.

She really wants to walk to and from school rather than go to breakfast and after school clubs. It's not too far to walk but I'm not particularly keen on the idea of her coming home to an empty house and waiting for me to get back, especially as her younger sister will be at after school club anyway! The law is so vague on this that it really is down to us to decide but we just don't know what would be best.

Argh, it's so difficult!!!

B x

My ds turned 11 in April. Goes to high school in Sept.

He has 3 rules.....

1 His phone MUST be charged if he wants to go out with his mates.

2 he must answer the phone when I call or ring back asap if he misses the call.

3 I can check his phone for inappropriate texts at any time.

So far so good.

Friends all look out for each other here and if he moves from one location to the next he always asks....ie park to town or town to McD's. he knows what we expect and he knows what will happen if he breaks our trust.....he loses Everything!!!

Bumo

At age 11 I used to go on a train (about 45mins journey) then make my way by bus across a city to get to the school (buses took about an hour) then the reverse to go home each evening.

Nobody was looking out for me & whilst I thought I was perfectly capable of doing the journey & being fine, it turned out I had an adult male stalking me regularly - this was reported to my parents by a concerned passenger on the train who travelled my route regularly from the same village.
I didn't find out until years later that was the real reason behind my sudden move to boarding school.
I had wondered why 2 male teachers from the boys school down the road from my school (which was all girls) suddenly started getting on my train.

I now live in a city & I would never let my kids out if I didn't know where they were by themselves, partly because of my own experience & partly because the 11 year olds I see out are pretty badly behaved.

I think you just have to find the right balance, because children do still need protecting at that age.

At the moment I have kids older & younger than 11, but when my youngest gets to that age I'm going to find it hard to let him out without adult supervision.

When my older boy was about 13, he went to play in the park with some friends & ended up in casualty as some boy none of them knew ran up to him & set his hair on fire after spraying lighter fluid at him.

I truly believe it wouldn't have happened if I'd been there & to this day I don't honestly know if the group of boys my son was in did anything to start trouble with the other one.
Obviously they said they did nothing, but I had reports from a friend who drove past my son when he was walking to school one day that he was spitting in the street which he would NEVER do anywhere he thought I could see him.
None of them seem to act as well as we hope they would when we can't see them.
Their friends behave better in front of us than they do when it's kids only too.

I'd rather be a bit overprotective now, they have the rest of their lives to be free.

My daughter is starting Juniors in a couple of weeks and we are aiming for her to be independent enough to walk to school/shops etc on her own when she starts secondary in 4 years' time. I like Creosote's idea of discussing possible scenarios ahead of time.

Phones can be a hazard in themselves judging by the number of teenagers watching their screens rather than the road!

My parents always knew where we were even if we were traipsing around the woods and creeks near where we grew up. We never really got into mischief or danger, but we did feel like we had the freedom to explore. My mom's trick to keeping an eye on us through most of was to make the best snacks and treats so all the kids would want to play at our house.

Apart from when DS goes to school and comes home he has yet to make the great independent leap into the unknown, going out and staying out and about with friends (they do all their socialising on line!), so yes we are in touch with him and do know where he is most of the time....

And he's not one to wander around the streets/shops on his way home from school either......

My 11 year old catches the bus to school and back and occasionally walks to the corner shop (10 mins), but apart from that, she is never out and about without me. So yes I always know where she is. She doesn't have a mobile yet as I don't feel she needs one, given that she is never out alone.

However my 13 year old is allowed out around the village with friends and I only have a rough idea of where he is. This bothers me but he is fiercely rebellious and I don't push him on this one. I know he has taken off on his bike further than I officially allow him and he is grounded for this. He is pretty good about answering his phone and letting me know where he is now, at least, and he's always in by curfew (usually 6pm) as he knows he'll be grounded if late.

Not necessarily knowing in which exact spot they are at any given time, but having a clear sense of their location is important to me.

I would say the same as BarkIsWilling; for example my son is 12 and I think knowing that he is on his way to or from school is enough. I don't try to insist he takes one particular route or that he lets me know in advance if he is going to be calling in at a shop to buy sweets. These things develop with age. When my son was 9 and had first started walking to and from school without an adult I did insist that he should take the most direct route and not any other.

I don't have an 11 year old but think you should hAve a rough idea of where they are