Let's all talk about MUMSNET shall we?

[CliffRichardSucksEggsInHell]

I'm pasting a post that is getting lost in the fighting and bitching going on. I hope it makes a difference. I have to go as I have ill children to tend to, but feel free to post your own thoughts on how we can get Mumsnet back to normality.

Mumsnet has been made to look like it's dominated by swearing, airheaded, middle class mothers in The Independent with nowt better to do than stomp around in their Boden jeans having a tant about a group of anonymous posters on a parenting site.

I'm sure that for the Moldie members it must be lovely to be able to discuss personal things in private and confidence without some name changing troll pissing all over your posts. It must be lovely to disclose your thoughts and problems with like-minded friends without worrying about it being taken the wrong way or having those dreaded Mumsnetters that you don't like, daring to come onto your thread.

As a lot of us who have been on Mumsnet for many years, it does hurt to have people name-changing to make personal and very hurtful attacks on you, which I presume never happens on Moldies.

So may I make a suggestion? Instead of bickering like the loons The Independent clearly think we are, how about we make Mumsnet even better? A site we can be proud of and feel safe posting on?

MNHQ - is there any way that name-changers who do so to personally attack other posters, can have a stiffer punishment? Perhaps banning from the site with no warning? Is there any way we can make Mumsnet a nicer, safer place to post?

Because right now, all we seem to be doing is giving the Moldies justification for the existance of their site.

I'm sure we'd all like to be able to post without fear of being personally attacked or having our real life covers blown. So why don't we work towards that this New Year? Because if I wanted to join Mumsnet right now for some support and advice, I'd be really put off.

And isn't that what Mumsnet is for? For people who are struggling, who need a bit of support and advice? Who can liaise in confidence with other parents and share experiences, problems and achievements? If I wanted a little forum to just talk to friends I can set one up, but I joined Mumsnet to get help and advice and to offer some where I could. I still get a kick out of feeling that my post has really helped, that my contribution has been worth something to someone. And whenever I have an issue, Mumsnet is one of the first places I turn to for advice and support.

Let's keep it that way shall we?

Who's with me on this one?

Sorry. Don't want to make you feel like signing out.

Oh, never mind then. I was being sensible, responding to the OP on the thread - and I thought I'd given some thoughtful replies. If you don't want me to post here, say and I'll bugger off somewhere else. But I have posted on MN for more than four years now, so I do have valid opinions about this.

I probably shouldn't have mentioned the other thing.

And I don't want this to turn into a Moldie thread either - it shouldn't be deleted.

Didn't mean to make you feel like signing out either huinkermunker. Just want to stop thinking sbout the moldie thing.

It's ok thready, this is a free forum bless it! Of course every contribution is viable. As I said, it's my problem and I'll just have to deal with it won't I? I could have said nothing and harboured these feelings, but I like being honest and letting people know where they stand. That way there are no confusions or sarcasms.

do you know what gets me?
a long time ago I started a thread about the possibility of mumsnet changing the site so that I could have the option of hiding the posts of some people who really really irritated me....

it was carnage the usual suspects piled in, called their chums to pile in, got hysterical, got the wrong end of the stick and right royally abused me for hating people and how everyone had the right to post on anyone's thread and all views were equal on Mumsnet and how dare I.

now, ironically, those usual suspects have done exactly as I requested and taken themselves off and I dont have to hear from the few who irritated me...but they are such hypocrites! But I love the outcome! ooooo quandary.....

but surely input from Moldies is pertinent?
I post in both places, here I have my post natal club, my breast reduction rubber neckers and just fun ways to pass the time, the G&T board and much more.
I don't see one over the other, more like a co existence.
Peaceful...
And many Moldies have never undertaken that process of elimination you describe Rhuby. Honest.

I think for long standing mners who are struggling with the changes growth and expansion has brought to the site, the looking back on how intimate, close and safe it used to be, it takes time to change and some don't wish to.

I feel comfy here still and comfy at Moldies. Long may it be so.

Thready

I think delete after 30 days is a really geat idea, tinker. What do you think mnhq?

great, even

I'm not sure that I would change anything regarding MN. I love it for what it is, i know we are going through a wonky phase at the moment but it is just a wonky phase..it will pass.

The main difference in MN is the sheer volume of posters, it is easy fopr a post to be missed or left unresponded...i posted yesterday a post which going back a bit would have attracted more support, only one person felt compelled to respond. People don't 'know' me anymore and for the best part I'm okay with that, but that really is the biggest change because with actually feeling more like a community and 'knowing' eachother comes respect and that is sadly lacking. So really unless the number of members reduces dramatically i can't see how any changes can really be made to bring MN back to what it was. We have to accept the changes that come with a busier site, there is no real alternative.

The archives are part of what makes MN great. Deleting after 30 days (or however long) would ruin that.

Personally I don't think any drastic changes should be made, at least not until the dust settles. I shudder just looking at some of the stuff on the test site for the 'new look', let alone messing with how the whole place runs.

MN is (was?) unique. Making it like all the other parenting boards sort of spoils the appeal.

Thumbwitch, does your suggestion not leave people in a bit of a no-win situation. If members keep quiet and at some later date it comes out, doesn't the whole thing kick off again?

SaintGeorge - no, I don't think so, because the only way it will come out is if they mention it themselves or someone else "outs" them - it is time it was completely laid to rest and just let us all get on with being MNetters.

If threads were deleted after 30 days, then I wouldn't have anything to remind me of the funny / challenging things my dds did when they were little.

And the other side of that is that my dds wouldn't be able to look up what I was saying about them when they were little...

I can't decide which is the best option.

Again, MN will never agree to deleting threads after 30 days.

If you don't want what you're saying to live forever, post in Chat.

yes, that is true, but when I started posting, there was no such thing as Chat (and it was all fields around here etc, etc, etc)

talking of archives though, is it my imagination or have some gone missing? I was looking for one about 2004-ish and couldn't find it! I have found it before, a few months ago, but it was a complete no-go a couple of nights ago.

Exactly, there was no Chat in t'early days. Also, it was so much smaller and people posted stuff they would probably think twice about doing now.

Flame! Aaaaaw.... you're such a lesbian lovely

Hug very much appreciated.

I am about to go to bed .Have MN for nigh on 3 years and guess no one really takes much note of my ramblings but have tried to reply honestly on the threads I have thought I could help on,have laughed on the humourous threads and cried about some of the sad ones.Today have had a bit of a crappy day in RL and have posted about it and what touches me is that several random strangers have seen fit to reply to my rants/pleas about my current situation .That is a lovely gesture and hopefully "In the spirit of MN".The recent shenanigans sadden me,I wish all Mumsnetters,new,in between,old and mouldy all the best and a peaceful 2009.

Cheers,Wrinkly xx

Brilliant OP, rhubarb.

Maybe I'm just a pessimist, but I think it's inevitable that as the site gets bigger, it'll get nastier.

The more people feel they're anonymous, the fewer inhibitions they have on what they post. That can be a good thing, allowing people to discuss issues they couldn't discuss IRL and get help.

But it also means that people feel less accountable for what they post, so they're likely to be less tactful and less truthful. And when they get angry they'll be more likely to hurl abuse, knowing there'll be no comeback.

I don't know what the solution is and I suspect there's no real solution because the problem is deeply rooted in human nature.

It would be nice to see a voluntary MN code of no personal attacks, ie you can disagree with someone all you like, but you must limit yourself to explaining why you disagree. No name-calling, no telling people to fuck off, no passive-aggressive threads-about-threads.

That wouldn't bring about world peace but if it got into the culture of MN so that enough posters were abiding by the code, there'd be less chance of a disagreement exploding into a war, and, importantly, the trolls wouldn't get fed.

At the moment MN is an "eat as much as you like" deal for trolls all day every day with no bill to pay and they know it.

An newbie so what do I know but...

On DH forum [cycling - about as bitchy as a load of men stood about in lycra can get, and they are BAAAAD believe me] one strike and your out. No swearing, no attacks, no threads about threads, no flames, explain yourself if you want to debate - the whole atmosphere is that if you misbehave you will be treated like children. They have one area for ranting and raving - and if you go in it's at your own peril and under your own steam. A sort of 'see you outside'

It keeps it tidy - but I'd like to think that as we discuss life and love and death, births and marriages - surely we can self regulate?

Do agree that being able to view threads without registering is a bit too open house.

Alot of the measures talked about aren't really going to stop the lonog-term trollers or pople being just generally mean. I do think MNHQ maybe need to be abit firmer with people being nasty, sometimes if it's a long term poster everyone turns a blind eye but it still m akes for a not as nice place to be. Paying for registration, blocking name changing, no archives all makes mumsnet a different place that is just not 'mumsnet'. I think this place 'works', it just needs to ride through this rough patch. Posters need to be troll aware but yet not suspect everyone of being a troll. At the end of the day , we'd all rather a few trolls but hundreds of genuine new posters. Post trolls are harmless though, just silly posts that dissapear fast enough. I have forgotten how I registered, but maybe a few more detailed Qs may help? But then I am guessing alot of the problem posts are namechangers, not new trolls. I am sure MNHQ already delete registrations etc though with trollers? I really am not sure what can be done to make this a 'fresher' forum .

I like it the way it is. The light moderation which makes it different (and better, I think) from other sites also makes it a bit more rough and tumble and perhaps a trial by fire for new posters who post on sensitive subjects. I love how it's gotten so big (I've been here nearly 9 years) and there's an answer for almost everything somewhere.

It always has been the sum of everyone posting - no poster or group of posters has ever been or will ever be indispensable to the site. I write that thinking of Croppy and later tigger and bells who left when the site was tiny and I missed a lot although maybe they are still posting and I just don't know [dim]. Nothing against them at all, it's just that I realised others took their place and the site didn't implode. It's fun to read new people and realise I have stuff in common with them - it's like a party where someone you liked to talk to wanders off but someone new steps in. Ok, that's a bad analogy.

Re trolls, I think people do ok. But then, I think it's fair to cry "troll" even if it's not true. I highly doubt JudgeFlounce is not posting here (Occam's razor - it's the simplest conclusion) fwiw.

This reminds me of SueW's lifecycle of a discussion board which she posted yonks ago! Think it's on the old discus board though (before our lovely Tech hand built this whole board it was powered using DiscusWare). Would be fun to have those archives...