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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Concerns about racism

1000 replies

PandoraSocks · 05/08/2025 08:33

Hi there Mumsnet HQ

Many of us are concerned about the uptick of hatred, xenophobia and racism on the site over the past couple of weeks. Most of the bigotry is focused on asylum seekers. MNHQ will of course delete racism etc. if reported, but this has gone way beyond a few hateful posts.

Links below to three examples of threads which have descended into real nastiness.

Cheers.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/in_the_news/5385273-civil-unrest-whats-really-going-on?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5385914-do-you-believe-there-will-be-a-civil-war?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/5386073-to-be-so-fed-up-amd-disheartened-with-all-the-xenophobia?utm_campaign=thread&utm_medium=share

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12
ByMerryDeer · 07/08/2025 11:32

Inchworms · 07/08/2025 11:24

Power and wealth are not infinite and in order to grant more to people who have less, someone will have to lose something.

I can stand to lose. I would prefer the truly rich and powerful lose more, but I can’t wait around for them and the question of ‘truly’ is relative anyway. The only question is where to draw the line about what’s an appropriate amount, what that ‘losing’ looks like. I’m very happy to admit my line is pretty extreme, by MN standards, but it’s always under review.

There are of course intersectional questions and questions of specific situations that come into it, but I don’t think this thread is really the place for that, esp on page 37

I mean as a parent it’s really quite worrying to read this but at least you're honest, I wouldn’t want this deleted as I think it’s good for people to understand some of the authentic views behind supporting such large scale immigration.

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 07/08/2025 11:32

FreezeDriedStrawberries · 07/08/2025 11:31

The above is the reply from MNHQ about setting up a new thread. My conclusion is that I don't think there is much point in a thread 2 on Site Stuff, because there is little to achieve from it

Yes, I think another one in site stuff is pointless, maybe one in AIBU? As it's an interesting discussion to have

Edited

No, an AIBU thread will just descend into more chaos and hate. There is no point.

noblegiraffe · 07/08/2025 11:32

I reported my post with the suggestion of removing personal attacks from posts rather than whole posts and got the response

"Challenging robustly does not include personal attacks, as we're sure the posters concerned would be aware. Plenty of posters are able to strongly counter arguments on the boards without breaking our rules.

We will continue to remove personal attacks."

So basically 'we are happy to let racist opinions stand and tell you that it's your job not ours to deal with these, but personal attacks are easy to delete so we'll do that'.

JamesMacGill · 07/08/2025 11:32

pointythings · 07/08/2025 11:29

You can question immigration, but you have to do it honestly. So no referring to.small boat asylum seekers as illegal, because it is not illegal to arrive by small boat. Also no blaming immigrants for all the nation's woes, because they are multifactorial. Lastly, no sweeping generalisations about whole ethnic groups, because that absolutely is racist.

Argue your corner, but be nuanced and accurate about it. Asking for this isn't politically extreme.

https://news.sky.com/story/first-migrants-detained-under-returns-deal-with-france-13408023

Starmer - human rights lawyer and ex DPP - has called them illegal immigrants.

First migrants detained under returns deal with France

It's not clear how many people have been detained, but the government is aiming to send a message that anyone who arrives by small boat risks being deported.

https://news.sky.com/story/first-migrants-detained-under-returns-deal-with-france-13408023

Inchworms · 07/08/2025 11:32

FreezeDriedStrawberries · 07/08/2025 11:31

The above is the reply from MNHQ about setting up a new thread. My conclusion is that I don't think there is much point in a thread 2 on Site Stuff, because there is little to achieve from it

Yes, I think another one in site stuff is pointless, maybe one in AIBU? As it's an interesting discussion to have

Edited

Christ, you’re brave but I’m in if you are. Maybe an ongoing anti racism thread, complete with divergences, is actually what’s needed

FreezeDriedStrawberries · 07/08/2025 11:34

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 07/08/2025 11:32

No, an AIBU thread will just descend into more chaos and hate. There is no point.

True

JamesMacGill · 07/08/2025 11:35

Inchworms · 07/08/2025 11:32

Christ, you’re brave but I’m in if you are. Maybe an ongoing anti racism thread, complete with divergences, is actually what’s needed

If it provides further clarity then I’m more than up for it.

BIossomtoes · 07/08/2025 11:39

Mumofnarnia · 07/08/2025 11:31

However, I have taken this exact quote from Keir Starmer’s own Facebook page. So is the PM now racist too?

“Illegal migration is a business, run by organised criminal gangs leading hundreds of people to their death in the Channel.

My government is putting an end to this vile trade with a groundbreaking returns deal, smashing the business model and securing our borders”

And your point is? What exactly is racist about stating facts? It’s an attack on the money making machinery behind the small boats trade, not on immigrants.

ByMerryDeer · 07/08/2025 11:39

MiloMinderbinder925 · 07/08/2025 11:30

Let's break it down.

  1. The thread is about racism
  2. You are saying that people should engage with racism and inflammatory views and not find strategies to censor them.

I'm very interested in the extreme political agenda you're talking about. Care to expand?

No let’s not break it down. Why don’t you show me where I said racism shouldn't be censored or at least commit to continuing the chat without all the disingenuous straw man nonsense.

JamesMacGill · 07/08/2025 11:39

BIossomtoes · 07/08/2025 11:39

And your point is? What exactly is racist about stating facts? It’s an attack on the money making machinery behind the small boats trade, not on immigrants.

PP said it was racist to refer to them as illegal (or if not racist, then immoral).

Mumofnarnia · 07/08/2025 11:40

BIossomtoes · 07/08/2025 11:39

And your point is? What exactly is racist about stating facts? It’s an attack on the money making machinery behind the small boats trade, not on immigrants.

A poster has just said it’s not illegal to come to the UK by small boat! Keir Starmer, however, is saying it is! So which is it??

BIossomtoes · 07/08/2025 11:41

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 07/08/2025 11:32

No, an AIBU thread will just descend into more chaos and hate. There is no point.

Absolutely.

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 07/08/2025 11:41

noblegiraffe · 07/08/2025 11:32

I reported my post with the suggestion of removing personal attacks from posts rather than whole posts and got the response

"Challenging robustly does not include personal attacks, as we're sure the posters concerned would be aware. Plenty of posters are able to strongly counter arguments on the boards without breaking our rules.

We will continue to remove personal attacks."

So basically 'we are happy to let racist opinions stand and tell you that it's your job not ours to deal with these, but personal attacks are easy to delete so we'll do that'.

That's a shame, it was a good suggestion.

It is inevitable that people will get worn down sometimes, and that their frustration will sometimes come out. I would be fine with MNHQ deleting those posts if they also deleted the racist posts that triggered the frustration, but they so often don't.

I do think people will give up eventually. And MNHQ will be the new Twitter.

JamesMacGill · 07/08/2025 11:41

Mumofnarnia · 07/08/2025 11:40

A poster has just said it’s not illegal to come to the UK by small boat! Keir Starmer, however, is saying it is! So which is it??

I suspect it depends on who is saying it..

Mumofnarnia · 07/08/2025 11:42

JamesMacGill · 07/08/2025 11:41

I suspect it depends on who is saying it..

People who seem to be pushing their own agenda rather than what the law / government determines as illegal

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 07/08/2025 11:43

ByMerryDeer · 07/08/2025 11:39

No let’s not break it down. Why don’t you show me where I said racism shouldn't be censored or at least commit to continuing the chat without all the disingenuous straw man nonsense.

You're arguing about semantics. Instead of that, why don't you share what you actually think MNHQ should do about racist content?

BIossomtoes · 07/08/2025 11:43

Mumofnarnia · 07/08/2025 11:40

A poster has just said it’s not illegal to come to the UK by small boat! Keir Starmer, however, is saying it is! So which is it??

You’re looking at one word. It’s illegal (and immoral) to make money out of immigration. Which what Starmer said.

LeftieRightsHoarder · 07/08/2025 11:44

Glowingup · 05/08/2025 10:31

I also think that having a specific sex and gender sub hasn’t helped really - there’s hundreds of threads about how dangerous and awful and disgusting all trans people are and it’s full of attempts to paint right wing extremists as “talking sense” just because they also happen to hate trans people. If you did the same for immigration, you’d get loads of threads about rapists, grooming gangs, how you’re not allowed to say Christmas anymore and god knows what.

This isn’t true, and you know it. The feminism threads are full of women defending women’s rights. Not hatred of trans people, just refusal to accept men’s wishes overriding women’s rights and child safeguarding.

If you want to see hate, look on any of the many forums in which transgenderists are totally open about wanting to punch, rape and kill feminists.

There is no equivalent aggression from women.

Mumofnarnia · 07/08/2025 11:45

BIossomtoes · 07/08/2025 11:43

You’re looking at one word. It’s illegal (and immoral) to make money out of immigration. Which what Starmer said.

He said the words ILLEGAL MIGRATION. You really are getting yourself wound up about it now aren’t you!

Inchworms · 07/08/2025 11:45

ByMerryDeer · 07/08/2025 11:32

I mean as a parent it’s really quite worrying to read this but at least you're honest, I wouldn’t want this deleted as I think it’s good for people to understand some of the authentic views behind supporting such large scale immigration.

I don’t see what’s worrying about it! Here’s an example. I’m a high earner. I’m happy to pay some more tax if needed so people arriving on small boats are treated kindly, applications for asylum are processed swiftly and fairly, and refugees are then given a good shot at building a life in the UK. If my government takes my money and does a shit job of that, I should vote for a government that I think will do better.

I think the previous government did a shit job, I think the current one is doing a shit job. That doesn’t change what I think would be the correct approach and it doesn’t make me think the people on the boats are the problem.

Efacsen · 07/08/2025 11:45

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 07/08/2025 11:32

No, an AIBU thread will just descend into more chaos and hate. There is no point.

Agree if it's about moderation it needs to be in Site Stuff - tho' the massive de-railment has turned this thread into just another 'immigration debate'

I've noted that MNHQ doesn't want to hear views on how the site is developing into a cesspit of unfettered racism and have no illusions that they will care if I leave

ByMerryDeer · 07/08/2025 11:46

MrsBennetsPoorNerves · 07/08/2025 11:43

You're arguing about semantics. Instead of that, why don't you share what you actually think MNHQ should do about racist content?

No, I’m asking you to prove something you said about my posts that you used to attempt a straw man argument and imply I’m racist.

BIossomtoes · 07/08/2025 11:48

Mumofnarnia · 07/08/2025 11:45

He said the words ILLEGAL MIGRATION. You really are getting yourself wound up about it now aren’t you!

Edited

I’m not in the slightest “wound up”. I am suggesting you consider the entirety of what he said instead of focusing on a single word.

PandoraSocks · 07/08/2025 11:48

I still want to know what the extreme political agenda @ByMerryDeer mentioned is, but I guess it's not going to happen.

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