MN needs a closer watch of FWR

[BodegaSushi]

There is a concerning growth of posts with racist undertones cropping up on these boards, all under the guise of being proudly 'anti-woke'.

Apparently diversity is 'woke' and worthy of derision.

This is the thread I'm referring to here.

Disney went woke now they're going broke www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4836570-disney-went-woke-now-theyre-going-broke

Mumsnet needs to looks at why that board draws such types of posts, and why posters feel so comfortable openly airing their racism.

No not really because it's the rise of gender ideology and queer theory which people object to and its impact on homosexuals , women and children.

Have you seen how Lesbians have been treated at Pride or has that passed you by, or maybe you think Lesbians can have dicks?

I agree with this.
The anti pride, body shaming, mean spirited bullies that often post on some of the feminist boards are out of control.
I'm GC but the posts here which are sometimes very very offensive to the trans community will so absolutely nothing to GC cause.

I'm not sure Mumsnet are interested in monitoring FWR that closely. They let an entire thread stand which was promoting and glorifying illegal activity - defacement of property:

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4826828-stickering-in-the-nam

Hard agree. No one sensible uses Twitter anymore.

I have seen how FWR treats lesbians who don't toe the party line.

The Pride events I've been to this month had everyone there, including lesbians. Everyone was getting on fantastically from what I saw.

Exactly

Oh dear, another reading comprehension fail.

I shall copy the pertinent bit of my post which you and @AlisonDonut have failed to grasp:

"I have noticed it's changed from what was a largely intelligent and reasoned discussion board into what frankly now appears to be an anti-LGBT board. The idea that it's to discuss the issues of transgender ideology only no longer seems to apply."

@lifeturnsonadime it also really pisses me off the way some people one here see lesbians as one group who all think the same - and the (false) rhetoric here is than lesbians hate pride which is bullshit.
I went to pride recently and the number of lesbians there was significant but what was also noticeable was the number of proud lesbians showing support for vilified and marginalised trans community.
Again, I am GC but I will also stand up for bullied and oppressed people.

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I agree OP, Mumsnet has become a safehaven for some really unsavoury people. And I agree that using "woke" as a pejorative should be banned. Taking a term created by black people so that they could highlight prejudice and co-opting it for ridicule is deeply offensive and also racist.

I may start reporting every post with woke as a pejorative. If we all did that, those posts can be removed and let's see what word they come up with instead of co-opting a word.

I'm thoughtfully GC - i have two very good trans friends. I think the Feminism board is awful now and I mute it. It's like a concentrated version of the Times and Telegraoh and DM comments boards rolled into one. It's a shame really as there's a place for an more nuanced discussion.

Really? Good grief. Although now you've said that, I suppose it doesn't really surprise me all that much.

I’m in the same boat as a couple of other posters here, and used to frequent the FWR board regularly under a different name.

I have GC leanings, specifically in the areas of how we balance law and policy to make sure the needs of all protected characteristics are met, including those of women.

I still read threads here and there but I’ve noticed an increase in commentary that I find a step too far. There seems to be too great a comfort by some posters in tarnishing all people who identify as transgender as harmful. There has been more rhetoric that has dragged in LGB people negatively and I agree that more racism has appeared.

The balance between the well thought out and moderate posters, who do still exist, and those who are so angry and unaccepting has shifted. It’s a change of feeling.

The space for GC women to talk is clearly invaluable, but at time I now find the space uncomfortable so have stepped back.

If you are going to lump L and G and B in with the T you need to outline your definitions of all of those things.

The FWR board is where women who don't want kids to be sterilised and who don't want rapists in women's prisons hang out.

Many of the 'bad' posts are posted by people who come to the board to make FWR look as if they are 'transphobic' or 'racist' in order to get it shut down. Often partnered with a 'look what a mumsnetter said' post on twitter, when the person that made it has never been heard of before.

It is all a power play to get it shut. Well done for joining in though.

To be honest, I never report this stuff, I would rather it stand so that people can see what's happening there and to see how these prejudices take hold and operate.

But I guess there is a potential flipside as people with prejudices are certainly emboldened at the moment and the creeping homophobia is clear to see. The transphobia has been like a gateway drug for other prejudices to surface.

Me too. I'm as GC as they come (a phrase which can incite scorn and derision from some in those threads) but I was brutally flamed off those boards for once daring to suggest what you've said, made worse for then daring to stand my ground. The vitriol was extraordinary. The gas-lighting was beyond belief and delivered without any sense of irony towards a woman on a feminism board. I dip in to read the topic headlines to see if I've missed any news articles, but I can't stand the nasty bullying some like to dress up as "robust disagreement". What disgusts me the most is the way no one seems to stand up to the obvious bullies when they are being clearly really horrible.

some mumsnet users clearly were either bullied at school, didn’t have a proper relationship with their parents or have no friends so they resort to message boards in search of validation. they’ll be the ones who’ll be left behind while the whole world moves on.

When it comes to co-opting words, redefining woman to include some biological men has got to be pretty much at the top of the list, hasn't it?

Closely followed by redefining homosexual to be same gender attracted rather than same sex? (I mean, the clue is in the actual word).

How would you go about this ? Abolish the word entirely ; or enforce its use as praise I suppose.

Personally I've never used it as it was always a bit vague and is now empty of all meaning , like the unlamented ' politically correct'.

I really wouldn't worry about it. The men who say they are women have it covered for you and will all be back on the reporting schedule in a few days.

What are you on about? What has that got to do with woke being used as a pejorative?

Fwiw I agree with the word woman not being co-opted as well as the word woke; both can be true at the same time. We're not playing top trumps.

But I guess there is a potential flipside as people with prejudices are certainly emboldened at the moment and the creeping homophobia is clear to see. The transphobia has been like a gateway drug for other prejudices to surface

Well as a woman who is not homophobic I would say that trans rights activism is a gateway drug to the real homophobia (removing the very meaning of same sex attraction) and misogyny. But we all have different perspectives I guess.

Believing that men are not women is not homophobic.

Being concerned that children who may be gay are being encouraged to identify as another gender and potentially to end up on harmful pathways is not homophobic either, it's quite the opposite.

My point is (I think somewhat obviously) that when talking about the FWR board, it is hard to feel that any co-opting of the word woke is worse than the constant co-opting of the word woman.

In fact, if the word woman and the definition of homsexuality weren't constantly being attacked, most of FWR activity probably wouldn't need to exist at all, as womens sport, hospital wards, prisons, lesbian groups would all be safe.

Do you think defacing Pride flags could be considered as homophobic by the gay community?