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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

References to underage sex on Sex board

362 replies

BenCoopersSupportWren · 23/02/2023 23:02

I haven’t been following the Sex topics in Active furore too closely, beyond agreeing on one of the early threads that it would be better for the Board to revert to the way it was - out of Active, with a longer qualifying time to be able to post.

However I’ve just read a thread which, on the face of it, is just reminiscing about posters’ ‘first times’ but which includes numerous disclosures of underage sex, including some that involved grooming, and one or two that are genuinely heartbreaking testimonies of child sexual abuse. They are particularly jarring interspersed as they are between end-of-pier type humour and jokes of others’ experience.

As I just posted there: “there is a reason most ‘mainstream’ dedicated end-user sex sites like Literotica, BDSMLR etc don’t allow stories or posts that are explicit about underage sex even when clearly written by adults, and will remove such posts when brought to the moderators’ attention. I used to work in the CJS and I’m afraid to say that such descriptions - even when expressed in short and simple terms - have currency among paedophiles. Part of my job was keeping the video testimony of CSA victims and any associated transcripts locked away so that they didn’t fall into the wrong hands. Unfortunately it’s not just explicit photos and videos that they get off to.”

For clarity, by “explicit about underage sex” I mean making specific reference to, not that the material has to be particularly sexually explicit. The exact same thread would simply not be allowed to stand on Literotica’s chat forum, for example.

While there have always been examples in other parts of the site of posters making disclosures of having been abused, that is a very different thing to sharing it in a section that only the most naive or wilfully obtuse would deny will be used in part for titillation. My issue isn’t that the thread is particularly sexually explicit - it mostly isn’t, and I’m pretty broad-minded… in context. But no one could argue that “where did you lose your virginity?” is masquerading as a support / how to / informative thread; it’s for entertainment and kicks only, be the latter humour or a sexual thrill. (A few posters on that thread have been supportive to those who disclosed their abuse, but ‘support’ is clearly not the original purpose of the thread.)

IMO it is extremely remiss of MN to disregard the ‘good practice’ rules that other sex sites maintain for handling material relating to references to underage sex/CSA, both because of the type of person attracted to those sites if such rules aren’t in place and from a liability / arse-covering perspective. This, combined with the lack of any age verification or warning for that part of the site, makes it even more obvious that MN don’t understand what is involved in safely and legally hosting a ‘sex chat site’ or part thereof.

OP posts:
MassiveWordSalad · 24/02/2023 21:38

Cheers @beastlyslumber

beastlyslumber · 24/02/2023 21:43

LangClegsInSpace · 24/02/2023 21:37

And speaking of MN staff there will be a lot of lowly mods who are now required to wade through all the grim shit on the sex topic and moderate it in accordance with the new lax standards.

The decision to invite back the hook up thread featured @YetAnotherBeckyMumsnet saying 'Have at it! 🍆'

www.mumsnet.com/talk/sex/4659915-deleted-sexchat-thread?page=2&reply=120928194

I wonder how many of the other mods were similarly enthusiastic.

What the fuck? Jesus. That is not okay.

LangClegsInSpace · 24/02/2023 21:44

LangClegsInSpace · 24/02/2023 21:26

This page reads like a work of fiction now:

www.mumsnet.com/i/about-us

@JustineMumsnet said in the video:

We put purpose before profits genuinely so we only have five things we want to do and only one of them is about revenue, and even then, it's sustainable revenue. So for us, revenue isn't revenue unless it's something that doesn't harm our community, our brand, our staff. So yes, we're focused, basically we want to make a great thing that offers solutions and makes parents' lives easier, and then if we can make a buck out of it we will. It's not the other way round.

Under 'Our Advertising Policy' the page says:

Mumsnet is a business funded mainly by advertising and we try to be a profitable one but our overarching aim is not the pursuit of profits. We are independently owned and we endeavour to conduct business in an ethical manner.

With this in mind, we won’t accept advertising from companies, for products or in formats that we believe are contrary to our mission – which is to make parents’ lives easier. Examples of the types of advertisers we turn away include payday loan companies, cryptocurrencies, pornographic content, and multi-level marketing schemes. The types of product advertising that we turn down are gambling, follow-on formula milk (designed to avoid the ban on formula milk advertising), and products that we think make women or children feel bad about their bodies or that play on boring gender stereotypes. (my bolds)

I should also have bolded 'multi-level marketing schemes'

Ann Summers is an MLM.

MassiveWordSalad · 24/02/2023 21:45

LangClegsInSpace · 24/02/2023 21:37

And speaking of MN staff there will be a lot of lowly mods who are now required to wade through all the grim shit on the sex topic and moderate it in accordance with the new lax standards.

The decision to invite back the hook up thread featured @YetAnotherBeckyMumsnet saying 'Have at it! 🍆'

www.mumsnet.com/talk/sex/4659915-deleted-sexchat-thread?page=2&reply=120928194

I wonder how many of the other mods were similarly enthusiastic.

Mumsnetters are being used as de facto moderators as the people behind the scenes are seemingly happy to leave anything standing unless it's reported. If all the 'pearl-clutchers' up and leave, what kind of content will be left?

TangledWebOfDeception · 24/02/2023 21:47

God @LangClegsInSpace that's rather grim isn’t it.

Ah well. TBH if I decide to leave for good I’ll do so quite happily without a backward glance. I’m sure that ultimately MNHQ won’t give one (nasty, sleazy) fuck that I’m gone either!

monomatapea · 24/02/2023 21:47

LangClegsInSpace · 24/02/2023 21:44

I should also have bolded 'multi-level marketing schemes'

Ann Summers is an MLM.

Is it? Didn't know that

TangledWebOfDeception · 24/02/2023 21:49

beastlyslumber · 24/02/2023 21:43

What the fuck? Jesus. That is not okay.

Just for clarity, my comment above relates to this.

parlourb · 24/02/2023 21:52

WombsofWimbledon · 24/02/2023 06:33

Ergh. The men on there stick out like a… oh never mind. I wonder what the point is at this stage. Money talks, obviously. Yuck.

Yea , this . Classy mumsnet , real classy.

MassiveWordSalad · 24/02/2023 21:57

Yes, Ann Summers is indeed an MLM company.
Now branded as a 'sisterhood' HA! 🤢

References to underage sex on Sex board
justasking111 · 24/02/2023 21:59

Has Ann summers bought Mumsnet then?

kath7510 · 24/02/2023 21:59

MLM and sex toys hey. Not really in the spirit is it?

I and others are out. PM me if you want to come with.

MassiveWordSalad · 24/02/2023 22:09

Could you answer this one then, @JustineMumsnet Has Mumsnet's mission officially altered? Will you be changing the website to reflect the changes as highlighted by @LangClegsInSpace for the sake of honesty and clarity?

LangClegsInSpace · 24/02/2023 22:12

monomatapea · 24/02/2023 21:47

Is it? Didn't know that

It certainly used to be and it's how they built their brand.

Someone would get paid to host an Ann Summers party in their home and invite their friends. A rep would turn up with the wares and it was all supposed to be a huge giggle because it was women only, doing something a bit naughty. There was no obligation to buy but everyone would be made aware that their host (i.e. their friend) would earn commission on anything bought. The catalogue had a huge section on how to become a rep and earn £££. It was like a tupperware party but all vibrators and nasty scratchy nylon knickers.

I was invited to several parties back in the mid 90's when I had my kids. Even back then they seemed to aggressively market to women who had recently given birth. Then they opened a few shops and now I think most of their business is direct mail order. I don't know if they still use the MLM party model but that's what they grew from.

And they still peddle shite.

LangClegsInSpace · 24/02/2023 22:16

MassiveWordSalad · 24/02/2023 21:57

Yes, Ann Summers is indeed an MLM company.
Now branded as a 'sisterhood' HA! 🤢

Urgh they're still doing it then.

Mumsnet has partnered with a MLM that sells products that make women feel bad about their bodies and that play on boring gender stereotypes.

MassiveWordSalad · 24/02/2023 22:22

I used to work with someone years ago who did Ann Summers as a side hustle. I never went to a party, but I did have a guffaw when Ann Summers HQ contacted her about a batch of sex toys that had to be recalled, and told her she needed to contact all the customers who had bought one so she could arrange to collect them for return. She just quit Grin

Pixiedust1234 · 24/02/2023 22:37

beastlyslumber · 24/02/2023 21:30

I've already had a couple of invites to somewhere. If it seems like a good place, I'll let you know!

Please PM me too. Im more a lurker over there but I think I've posted enough for you to know me

BIWI · 24/02/2023 22:43

In haste as we have people staying with us and I'm hiding from hosting:

Very disappointing response from @JustineMumsnet - patronising and insulting as well as not dealing with the the issues and their nuances that have been raised over the last few days, by many, many of us.

I'm out.

Somanyquestionstoaskaboutthis · 24/02/2023 22:43

Pixiedust1234 · 24/02/2023 22:37

Please PM me too. Im more a lurker over there but I think I've posted enough for you to know me

Me too please. I’m new there but would hate to lose the wealth of knowledge of you all. And the cheese.

BIWI · 24/02/2023 22:44

PS thanks for the PMs. Will reply tomorrow

LangClegsInSpace · 24/02/2023 22:45

@BenCoopersSupportWren it's a shame this thread has been somewhat derailed into yet another discussion about everything that is wrong with the current setup of the sex topic. It was inevitable after @JustineMumsnet chose this particular thread to respond to everyone's concerns altogether but it's notable that she has not answered the specific issues raised in your OP.

These issues are too important to be lost in the general discussion. It wouldn't matter if every MN poster was cool with stories of underage sex / CSA being shared, or if everyone who didn't want to see it just hid the topic, it would still be a massive safeguarding issue.

Safeguarding comes first, every time. It's shameful that the biggest parenting site in the UK has failed to recognise this.

PlusLaMeme · 24/02/2023 22:49

BIWI · 24/02/2023 22:43

In haste as we have people staying with us and I'm hiding from hosting:

Very disappointing response from @JustineMumsnet - patronising and insulting as well as not dealing with the the issues and their nuances that have been raised over the last few days, by many, many of us.

I'm out.

BIWI and OYBadKitten, please could you PM me where you decide to decamp please. I lurk on the weather threads, and the old quirky posters are the only thing keeping me here tbh

TangledWebOfDeception · 24/02/2023 22:54

LangClegsInSpace · 24/02/2023 22:45

@BenCoopersSupportWren it's a shame this thread has been somewhat derailed into yet another discussion about everything that is wrong with the current setup of the sex topic. It was inevitable after @JustineMumsnet chose this particular thread to respond to everyone's concerns altogether but it's notable that she has not answered the specific issues raised in your OP.

These issues are too important to be lost in the general discussion. It wouldn't matter if every MN poster was cool with stories of underage sex / CSA being shared, or if everyone who didn't want to see it just hid the topic, it would still be a massive safeguarding issue.

Safeguarding comes first, every time. It's shameful that the biggest parenting site in the UK has failed to recognise this.

It wouldn't matter if every MN poster was cool with stories of underage sex / CSA being shared, or if everyone who didn't want to see it just hid the topic, it would still be a massive safeguarding issue.

Yes. This.

TangledWebOfDeception · 24/02/2023 22:55

BIWI · 24/02/2023 22:43

In haste as we have people staying with us and I'm hiding from hosting:

Very disappointing response from @JustineMumsnet - patronising and insulting as well as not dealing with the the issues and their nuances that have been raised over the last few days, by many, many of us.

I'm out.

Me too @BIWI. PM me please (no rush of course)! Have already received one.

SlaveToTheVibe · 24/02/2023 22:59

Can you all let me know where you go to please? I’m not staying either. And yes I’m a boot camp storm chaser so really so t want to miss out on BIWI/OYBBK

thanks

WombsofWimbledon · 24/02/2023 23:26

justasking111 · 24/02/2023 21:59

Has Ann summers bought Mumsnet then?

Has MilfsNet had the domain purchased yet?