Request to remove the word 'debate' from ' Feminism: Sex & gender debate'

[Thelnebriati]

Can you please remove the word 'debate'? It doesn't add anything.

Especially if the trans widows threads are to remain on the board.

Am here to say the same. Very poor response.

Debate should not be in the group header. So, currently, we have “chat” which sounds fairly innocuous and then “debate” which can be taken the wrong way. And we know the multitude of threads that end up in one particular section.

It is not a difficult or onerous change to make, just to the one word at the end of a group title.

Agree!

Influx of very unpleasant posters, being able to ignore the guidelines, using cis as an insult amongst other things.

Why are these few, aggressive posters supposedly ok to act with impunity, being deliberately spiteful, whilst much less is deemed strike worthy?
Also when are you:
A) removing debate
Or b) adding a third gender support area for transwidows and those with personal issues
???
@MichaelMumsnet
@EstherMumsnet

Why was my post deleted? @MichaelMumsnet why do you hate us trans widows ?

@MichaelMumsnet you have literally deleted my tweets detailing how the trans widows are now subject to an open bashing from AGPs like my ex. I lived with male abuse for over a year and I’m being silenced on mumsnet of all places.

Tweets? I mean comments obviously

Debate implies civil disagreement. There is a poster right now being sneering, accusatory and generally unpleasant all over the board. Dismissing women's opinions and doing a lot of gaslighting.

Was this what you had in mind for the board?
Is this the safe space to discuss gender issues that you envisioned?
Because it seems to me that the mods are very much weighted in one direction. Especially as the rules are so unclear you are not always clear if you are breaking them.

I've been thinking some more about this.

People don't continuously go onto the Adoption board and spout why adoption is wrong.
People don't continuously go on to Surrogacy and spout why they think surrogacy is wrong.
People don't go onto the pet boards and spout why owning pets is wrong.

MN have put the sex & gender under the feminism topic. Feminism by definition centres women and girls. So why are people being allowed to continuously go there and say the posters are doing feminism wrong by not centring male born people?

I feel if MN what to host 'debate' then it shouldn't be under feminism (and thus threads on this issue from a feminist slant should go back to feminism chat). If they want a special board for feminists to discuss the issue free from harassment then they should remove the word 'debate' and be more firm with posters who consistently come on to random threads derailing them.
It isn't 'no debate' from the feminism side, but rather, when there are so few spaces for feminists to discuss and inform the issues amongst themselves that they/we should be allowed that space here on MN.

It feels as if Mumsnet's aim to make parents lives easier does not apply if we are the "wrong" sort of feminist, or a trans widow, as this decision has made our lives more difficult.

A betrayal of the trans widows @ MNHQ.

I can only agree with posters.

I cannot see why anyone would be so intransigently wedded to using the unnecessary word "debate" on a board name.

It's not exactly in the spirit of Mumsnet's We Believe You campaign, is it?

www.mumsnet.com/campaigns/we-believe-you-mumsnet-rape-awareness-campaign

@TinselAngel

It feels as if Mumsnet's aim to make parents lives easier does not apply if we are the "wrong" sort of feminist, or a trans widow, as this decision has made our lives more difficult.

@MichaelMumsnet is this your intent? If not, why persist in this when all it takes is to move trans widows threads to chat?

What exactly is the motivation to place a particular group of women seeking support in such an exposed position? You are actually inviting the abuse we've seen since this inexplicable decision was made. I've reported a number of abusive posts myself - all since this decision was made.

Who benefits from this? Who suffers? And why are you/MNHQ so intransigent in refusing to reflect & amend what is clearly a huge miscalculation on your part?

Why persist?

I agree with all the concerns raised on this thread. I am also deeply concerned that a posters experiences of abuse were removed as somehow breaching the rules.
I find it absolutely disgusting that a simple request to remove debate from the title is being ignored by Mumsnet and that this change in title has opened the transwidows to abuse .

Posters have just realised that the 'Mumsnet moderation principles for discussions around gender identity and sex' are now titled;

Trans Rights Moderation Policy.
www.mumsnet.com/i/trans-rights-moderation-policy

Just catching up with this. Terrible response from Michael, it's difficult to imagine how someone could miss the point so spectacularly unless it was willful.

What on earth is the issue with simply removing the word 'debate' or changing it to 'discussion'? What actual problem would that cause?

And yes, what's the deal with the new title on the special rules page?

Here's an archived version:

<a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/web/20210615125010/www.mumsnet.com/info/trans-rights-moderation-policy" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">web.archive.org/web/20210615125010/www.mumsnet.com/info/trans-rights-moderation-policy

What about women's rights?

@Ereshkigalangcleg

What about women's rights?

Quite.

It is supposed to be a Feminism board after all.

[quote Thelnebriati]Posters have just realised that the 'Mumsnet moderation principles for discussions around gender identity and sex' are now titled;

Trans Rights Moderation Policy.
www.mumsnet.com/i/trans-rights-moderation-policy[/quote]
Hi @Thelnebriati - thanks so much for alerting us. We're replatforming the site at the moment and this was an error. We've now changed it back to the original title.

@YetAnotherBeckyMumsnet please could you take another look at the main concern of this thread? Namely the use of the word debate instead of discussion to header a section that contains the transwidows thread.
Posters who use that thread for support have been unfairly targeted.
Posters who use that thread have said they feel the feminism section is best for them as being in relationships would encourage those with very little empathy or understanding to chip in and offer advice. They just want a safe space to discuss very sad and emotional parts of their life and the board shift has meant that their space has been exposed to bullies.

As Mumsnet are clearly working on the technicalities of the site now would be a good time to address it, as I am sure you have someone able to remove the word or replace it with discussion.

Many thanks!