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Fathers 4 Justice and their recent attacks on Mumsnet

999 replies

JustineMumsnet · 17/03/2012 09:28

Some of you may have noticed that a group called Fathers 4 Justice has been saying some pretty unpleasant things about us over the last couple of weeks. In an 'advert' which appeared first on Facebook and then in yesterday's edition of the I, the group claims Mumsnet 'promotes gender hatred', and labels 'men and boys as rapists, paedophiles and wife beaters'. It calls on advertisers to suspend advertising on Mumsnet.

Most people, I'm quite sure, will see the adverts and the 'campaign' behind them for precisely what they are: a naked attempt to court publicity by a group of people who for whatever reason appear to have tired of climbing cranes in superhero outfits. (And, just coincidentally, in the run up to Mothers' Day). In fact it feels a bit like having a particularly irritating toddler repeatedly prodding you with a stick to get some attention.

By and large it seemed most sensible to ignore them, not least because we've had our hands quite full with stuff that actually matters, like Mumsnet's 'We believe you' campaign to dispel rape myths.

But since Fathers 4 Justice appear to have attracted some grown ups' attention, we thought we should tell you a bit about the background to this attack, the truth behind their allegations, and how they are trying to bully us and other organisations. Here are 10 things you should know.

  1. On March 3rd a Mumsnet user started a conversation about a poster campaign being touted on Mumsnet's Facebook wall by Fathers 4 Justice, and the fact that Fathers 4 Justice was bombarding a number of sites with this troubling image.
  1. A conversation then ensued on Mumsnet about Fathers 4 Justice and their tactics which some members of Fathers 4 Justice joined. Some Mumsnetters said some pretty harsh things.
  1. We deleted a number of posts that broke our forum guidelines regarding personal attacks. In total we deleted 70 posts from the thread which went on over the next few days and reached 1000 posts in total. 60 were posts were made by regular Mumsnet members, ten or so by new joiners from Fathers 4 Justice. Our community managers reminded users to follow forum guidelines on nine separate occasions and at least one prolific Mumsnetter left the site in protest at our deletion policy.
  1. On March 7th and March 8th MNHQ received a series of emails from the Campaign Director of Fathers 4 Justice containing threats of legal action and a threat to contact our advertisers. At the same time comments on the Fathers 4 Justice Facebook page describing Mumsnetters as 'barking mad harridans', 'weird sex obsessed paranoid perverts' and 'child abusing contact blockers' were left unmoderated. As were comments that described me variously as a 'dried up old hag', 'an evil woman' and having an 'IQ that would return a negative score'.
  1. On March 11th Fathers 4 Justice posted another attack ad this time accusing M&S of 'sponsoring hateful, bigoted and prejudiced comments about men and boys on Mumsnet' and demanding that M&S withdraw all advertising on Mumsnet or face a boycott. It accused the company of 'serving up gender hatred for Mother's Day'.
  1. Other organisations have experienced similar bullying tactics. In recent weeks Fathers 4 Justice have targeted the lone parents' support charity, Gingerbread, jamming up its telephone helplines. Senior NGO staff have told us they felt too intimidated to speak out against them.
  1. The suggestion that Mumsnet encourages gender hatred would be funny if it were not so offensive - and plain silly. The central aim of Mumsnet is to make parents' (mothers' and fathers') lives easier. There are many and varied opinions on the site and no one Mumsnet party line prevails, save for the view that we respect diverse opinion. We do not pre-moderate or vet comments made to our discussion boards of which there are around 30 000 every day. Men are and always have been extremely welcome on Mumsnet - we have a Dadsnet forum for Dads to talk directly with other men should they wish. We estimate that around 5-10% of our 2 million odd monthly users are men.

Of course you can always find plenty of Mumsnetters whinging about their male partners' shortcomings - more than there are whinging about their female partners' shortcomings - but generalisations are swiftly pounced on and we do not tolerate gender hatred, or any other kind of hatred for that matter (save maybe hatred of Fruitshoots). We encourage people to be civil and supportive and, in the main, most people are.

  1. Fathers 4 Justice campaigns for fathers to have access to their children following separation or divorce. Its founder, Matt O'Connor, says parents have 'fewer rights than a terrorist'. The organisation was temporarily disbanded in 2006 after it emerged that some of its members had plotted to kidnap Tony Blair's son Leo. Fathers 4 Justice boasts that it is 'the most controversial and high profile pressure group of modern times' but it has struggled to win public attention since abandoning its eye-catching tactic of scaling tall structures in superhero costumes. In recent weeks it has targeted Cafcass, the body responsible for protecting the rights of children in court proceedings, Gingerbread, the charity for single parents, (which it claimed supported 'the abuse of children') and Mumsnet. It has also, somewhat mysteriously, branded London 2012 'the fatherless games'.
  1. We believe that the issue of father's access to children is important and needs to be discussed. We understand that many Fathers 4 Justice campaigners are driven by intense personal anger over what they feel is injustice they have suffered in their own cases. But the recent actions the group have taken against Mumsnet and others constitute plain and simple bullying and intimidation and only harm its cause.
  1. Reading this, you may well already be spitting tacks by now. Please do remember that's precisely what Fathers 4 Justice want. If you post on the subject please keep it civil. We won't be bullied, but we don't want to be dragged into the mire either.

Many thanks.

OP posts:
MmeLindor. · 20/03/2012 16:43

Yes, so he can pass it on to others without fear of being sued.

SoupDragon · 20/03/2012 16:53

I also commented but can't find my way back in now. I just wanted to copy my comment :)

SanctiMoanyArse · 20/03/2012 17:05

No, got blocked myself Soupy

Although at least I copied it. So F4J types reading it on here when they investigate (and the majority are probably decent people in distressing circs who WILL investigate) see what and who is being blocked.

OracleInaCoracle · 20/03/2012 17:09

sancti, I commented too. didnt expect it to be posted though. can you send me a copy though please?

NarkedPuffin · 20/03/2012 17:21

This thread is nearly full. Once it is, can we drop them as a topic?

Their newspaper ad got them feck all attention. Their weekend stunt got them feck all attention.

The media does report on MN stuff. Lets not be the ones that get them attention.

PosiePumblechook · 20/03/2012 17:27

So M&S do some lovely meal deals....mmmm and Cornish cruncher cheese with chilli is too good for crackers!!

PosiePumblechook · 20/03/2012 17:27

And flowers are really great, delivery is spot on and they last.

PosiePumblechook · 20/03/2012 17:28

I love men and boys, in fact I love everyone. Can't stand injustice either.

PosiePumblechook · 20/03/2012 17:28

I like sharing my M&S chocolates with my husband, daughter and sons.

VivaLeBeaver · 20/03/2012 17:28

Agree with Puffin. The only attention they're getting is from us. Admittedly we're mainly laughing at them now as we've realised that there's no point trying to have a reasoned debate with them. So if we leave it and forget about them they'll disappear back into obscurity.

OracleInaCoracle · 20/03/2012 17:34

I bought from m&s today, a fab dinosaur hood dressing gown and t shirt for ds, and a tie for dh. Who has a new job!

PurpleRomanesco · 20/03/2012 17:36

I agree, Let's let this go now safe in the knowledge that once again F4J have achieved nothing for the cause they pretend to fight for. The media, M&S and the family court system couldn't give a flying fig about them and their bullying attention seeking ways.

Let's also remind ourselves that there are other proper organisations out there fighting for the rights of parents and give them out support. The only thing F4J have even successfully achieved has been "the exposure of flaws in security at high-profile British institutions, resulting in security enquiries or reviews at Buckingham Palace and the House of Commons."

Well done Wink

VivaLeBeaver · 20/03/2012 17:37

Dinosaur dressing gown looks lovely - off to look for it online for my nephew.

VivaLeBeaver · 20/03/2012 17:37

sounds lovely even!

GrimmaTheNome · 20/03/2012 17:38

I have to buy all my chicken from M&S, its the only sort DH will eat. (reckons everyone else's must be fed on something he has an aversion to.)

GrimmaTheNome · 20/03/2012 17:40

Let's also remind ourselves that there are other proper organisations out there fighting for the rights of parents and give them out support

Good idea - can someone list any? I think FamiliesNeedFathers was mentioned elsewhere, is that a good one for dads in particular to go for help?

PurpleRomanesco · 20/03/2012 17:44

OnlyDads seem to have their priorities straight

Separated Dads seem informative.

TheSockPuppet · 20/03/2012 17:44

I'm just back home after doing my bit for mumsnet by getting my food shopping from m&s Smile

OptimisticPessimist · 20/03/2012 17:44

The OnlyDads one linked to at one point seems good and balanced. All the other groups I've seen on FB seem vehemently anti-women, and FNF is grossly let down by LdB as patron and some of their literature which blames mothers for the fathers who choose not to be involved Hmm

MmeLindor. · 20/03/2012 17:45

My oven is full of M&S food tonight. The sauce recommended earlier with baked chicken, parmentier potatoes and stuffed mushrooms

Grin
PurpleRomanesco · 20/03/2012 17:45

www.onlydads.org/

ChazsBrilliantAttitude · 20/03/2012 17:46

I like the M&S prawn dumplings, they're one of my Friday night can't be arse to cook treats. (unless you count 1.5min in the microwave as cooking Grin)

PurpleRomanesco · 20/03/2012 17:46

Oooh, Sounds nommy Mme.

OptimisticPessimist · 20/03/2012 17:47

Separated Dads on FB not to be confused with Separated DadsUK. Going to check out the first one now, the second I happened upon yesterday and falls into the aforementioned anti-woman category.

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