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See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Fathers 4 Justice and their recent attacks on Mumsnet

999 replies

JustineMumsnet · 17/03/2012 09:28

Some of you may have noticed that a group called Fathers 4 Justice has been saying some pretty unpleasant things about us over the last couple of weeks. In an 'advert' which appeared first on Facebook and then in yesterday's edition of the I, the group claims Mumsnet 'promotes gender hatred', and labels 'men and boys as rapists, paedophiles and wife beaters'. It calls on advertisers to suspend advertising on Mumsnet.

Most people, I'm quite sure, will see the adverts and the 'campaign' behind them for precisely what they are: a naked attempt to court publicity by a group of people who for whatever reason appear to have tired of climbing cranes in superhero outfits. (And, just coincidentally, in the run up to Mothers' Day). In fact it feels a bit like having a particularly irritating toddler repeatedly prodding you with a stick to get some attention.

By and large it seemed most sensible to ignore them, not least because we've had our hands quite full with stuff that actually matters, like Mumsnet's 'We believe you' campaign to dispel rape myths.

But since Fathers 4 Justice appear to have attracted some grown ups' attention, we thought we should tell you a bit about the background to this attack, the truth behind their allegations, and how they are trying to bully us and other organisations. Here are 10 things you should know.

  1. On March 3rd a Mumsnet user started a conversation about a poster campaign being touted on Mumsnet's Facebook wall by Fathers 4 Justice, and the fact that Fathers 4 Justice was bombarding a number of sites with this troubling image.
  1. A conversation then ensued on Mumsnet about Fathers 4 Justice and their tactics which some members of Fathers 4 Justice joined. Some Mumsnetters said some pretty harsh things.
  1. We deleted a number of posts that broke our forum guidelines regarding personal attacks. In total we deleted 70 posts from the thread which went on over the next few days and reached 1000 posts in total. 60 were posts were made by regular Mumsnet members, ten or so by new joiners from Fathers 4 Justice. Our community managers reminded users to follow forum guidelines on nine separate occasions and at least one prolific Mumsnetter left the site in protest at our deletion policy.
  1. On March 7th and March 8th MNHQ received a series of emails from the Campaign Director of Fathers 4 Justice containing threats of legal action and a threat to contact our advertisers. At the same time comments on the Fathers 4 Justice Facebook page describing Mumsnetters as 'barking mad harridans', 'weird sex obsessed paranoid perverts' and 'child abusing contact blockers' were left unmoderated. As were comments that described me variously as a 'dried up old hag', 'an evil woman' and having an 'IQ that would return a negative score'.
  1. On March 11th Fathers 4 Justice posted another attack ad this time accusing M&S of 'sponsoring hateful, bigoted and prejudiced comments about men and boys on Mumsnet' and demanding that M&S withdraw all advertising on Mumsnet or face a boycott. It accused the company of 'serving up gender hatred for Mother's Day'.
  1. Other organisations have experienced similar bullying tactics. In recent weeks Fathers 4 Justice have targeted the lone parents' support charity, Gingerbread, jamming up its telephone helplines. Senior NGO staff have told us they felt too intimidated to speak out against them.
  1. The suggestion that Mumsnet encourages gender hatred would be funny if it were not so offensive - and plain silly. The central aim of Mumsnet is to make parents' (mothers' and fathers') lives easier. There are many and varied opinions on the site and no one Mumsnet party line prevails, save for the view that we respect diverse opinion. We do not pre-moderate or vet comments made to our discussion boards of which there are around 30 000 every day. Men are and always have been extremely welcome on Mumsnet - we have a Dadsnet forum for Dads to talk directly with other men should they wish. We estimate that around 5-10% of our 2 million odd monthly users are men.

Of course you can always find plenty of Mumsnetters whinging about their male partners' shortcomings - more than there are whinging about their female partners' shortcomings - but generalisations are swiftly pounced on and we do not tolerate gender hatred, or any other kind of hatred for that matter (save maybe hatred of Fruitshoots). We encourage people to be civil and supportive and, in the main, most people are.

  1. Fathers 4 Justice campaigns for fathers to have access to their children following separation or divorce. Its founder, Matt O'Connor, says parents have 'fewer rights than a terrorist'. The organisation was temporarily disbanded in 2006 after it emerged that some of its members had plotted to kidnap Tony Blair's son Leo. Fathers 4 Justice boasts that it is 'the most controversial and high profile pressure group of modern times' but it has struggled to win public attention since abandoning its eye-catching tactic of scaling tall structures in superhero costumes. In recent weeks it has targeted Cafcass, the body responsible for protecting the rights of children in court proceedings, Gingerbread, the charity for single parents, (which it claimed supported 'the abuse of children') and Mumsnet. It has also, somewhat mysteriously, branded London 2012 'the fatherless games'.
  1. We believe that the issue of father's access to children is important and needs to be discussed. We understand that many Fathers 4 Justice campaigners are driven by intense personal anger over what they feel is injustice they have suffered in their own cases. But the recent actions the group have taken against Mumsnet and others constitute plain and simple bullying and intimidation and only harm its cause.
  1. Reading this, you may well already be spitting tacks by now. Please do remember that's precisely what Fathers 4 Justice want. If you post on the subject please keep it civil. We won't be bullied, but we don't want to be dragged into the mire either.

Many thanks.

OP posts:
TheLittlestGoat · 19/03/2012 22:48

He posed like that on his breastmilk icecream blog.

here

AnyFucker · 19/03/2012 22:51

is that really one of those cowboy metal tie things around his neck ?

what are they called ? Confused

PurpleRomanesco · 19/03/2012 22:53

TBH I seriously doubt Matt and Nadines intentions for the cause. They seem to be more interested in making a name for themselves rather than F4J. They are enjoying this and that is wrong considering what the claim to stand for.

Shame on them. Mumsnet have done nothing. They saw an opportunity in us and took it. At least the "We Believe You" campaign is staying true and not actively attacking individuals for publicity and money.

Well done MN.

MuslinSuit · 19/03/2012 22:54

I bought a bronzer brush and a load of posh food from M and S today Smile

Including naice ham.

PurpleRomanesco · 19/03/2012 22:55

I use TBH too much don't I?

I'M BEING HONEST! :o

SmellsLikeTeenStrop · 19/03/2012 22:56

They won't see that. It'll just go in to their little pot of evidence that mumsnet is an absolutely awful place, and they'll use it in their next ad campaign.

jesus christ, I pointed out ages ago that interacting with them on their site would just feed their victim complexes and paranoia, now 'jane' has just given them extra ammunition

I hope to god she isn't a mumsnetter because it was a stupid stupid thing to copy a picture of a child in to your fb page, with that you turned a harmless, slightly amusing troll into something pretty damn horrible.

SophieNeveu · 19/03/2012 22:56

I find that littlegoat link disturbing, "... very, very interested... in evil..." and a posed devil picture Shock

TheLittlestGoat · 19/03/2012 22:59

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SophieNeveu · 19/03/2012 23:00

What is the finger in the ring all about?

MmeLindor. · 19/03/2012 23:02

I agree, Purple. They are asking the woman whose DD's pic was published on Jane's page to email them. Sure that they want to make hay out of that one.

edam · 19/03/2012 23:03

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LineRunner · 19/03/2012 23:04

There is no point suing people who have nothing?

Beachcomber · 19/03/2012 23:05

AnyFucker, when I was a lass we always called it 'wankers jewellery'. That might not be the technical term though.

MmeLindor. · 19/03/2012 23:05

Agree, Smellslike. Taking a pic of a child from a FB page is horrible.

I think that we should all take a step back. Discussing it is fine, but we need to stop interacting with them. Including posting on the MN FB page and debating with their supporters.

PurpleRomanesco · 19/03/2012 23:08

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AnyFucker · 19/03/2012 23:10

I am reminded of David van Day, sometime Pop Star and all-round attention-seeking gobshite

that just popped into my head, as I was watching Louis Spence's Showbizzness show the other day

LineRunner · 19/03/2012 23:11

They have nothing, they are nothing, they are a wisp.

MN will back some brilliant campaigns in the future to support our lovely sons and our wonderful men.

Beachcomber · 19/03/2012 23:16

Gobshite is a great word isn't it?

TheLittlestGoat · 19/03/2012 23:16

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PurpleRomanesco · 19/03/2012 23:19

You should not be on their hate poster LineRunner, It has pissed me off so much that you are. I have been on here for a while and think it was disgusting how peoples posts were taken out of context.

They were trying to imply you thought all men are rapists. What a pathetic effort.

TheLittlestGoat · 19/03/2012 23:21

Intersting that in this article he likens the F4J group to the Suffragettes.

Hmm
PurpleRomanesco · 19/03/2012 23:22

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TheLittlestGoat · 19/03/2012 23:23

According to MattyBaby, this blogger should grow some balls

AnyFucker · 19/03/2012 23:24

separated at birth ?

TheLittlestGoat · 19/03/2012 23:29

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