It's not just us who find Aptamil's campaign thoroughly shameful.

[milkymouth]

Have a look at what Baby Milk Action have to say about the Independent newspaper's decision to run their campaign as well .

[edam]

I did read your post MTS but I disagree for the reasons I've stated. People have said 'stop talking about this' but some of us do want to continue the conversation.

[caligula]

I don't care how many clicks Milupa get.

The point is that long-term, I want to see that helpline either forbidden to give advice on breast-feeding, or forced to employ proper breastfeeding counsellors so that they give real advice.

[caligula]

no probs Toothache.

[giraffeski]

Message withdrawn

[SoupDragon]

It's not that they will be so intrigued by Milupa that they buy it. The advert is all about name recognition, nothing more, nothing less.

[EnidfromtheVILLAGE]

WHY ON EARTH would people on a milupa advice line give good advice on breastfeeding?

you'd have to be mad to think that they wouldnt try and persuade you to use formula.

I think it is actually sick that they even HAVE a helpline.

If they are really interested in supporting breastfeeding mothers, why don't they quote the La Leche number on their advertising?

[QueenOfQuotes]

but with online advertising, in particular, an Advertiser will 'gauge' the effectiveness by the number of click thru's they get.

If they get a high number (which they will have done) then they'll loook seriously at extending their advertising campaign to OTHER websites,

If no-one clicks on the links - then they won't use that as an advertising source again!

[EnidfromtheVILLAGE]

oh so what

I dont care if they think they have done fantastically well

I am still going to discuss it until I get bored/have to leave work whichever comes first

[SoupDragon]

Enid, they do actually have links to LLL and NCT on their website. The bf-ing helpline is all about looking like a caring manufacturer.

[WigWamBam]

This isn't actually rehashing anything at all - this is a new link and a new twist, and I'm another one who is interested to see that it's been picked up by other parties. I hadn't seen the link on the other thread, and I for one was interested to see it. Maybe now that the media have picked up on this, something will be done to stop this cynical marketing ploy.

I agree that if you don't like the topic, there are plenty of others to talk about - if you're not interested in a subject, why keep clicking on it? Plenty of us are interested enough to want to know more - you can see by the subject title that you won't like it, so it's easy enough to avoid.

[oliveoil]

Is there an inflamatory ad on the Mumsnet Homepage? Why wasn't I aware of this?

Pah.

[mumtosomeone]

I like to see your opinions. maybe i will pick up something that makes me interested?!

[WigWamBam]

Fair enough, mumtosomeone. But you appear to be complaining about the fact that we are expressing our opinions as well ... you said "let it drop" so I assumed that you have no interest.

[LIZS]

Interesting link from over on another thread -Baby Feeding Law Group -referrign to current M A campaigns and highlighting the Independent and Mumsnet itself. To quote :

"However, the advertisement still promotes the full range as all bear the Aptamil name and are similarly packaged, as shown below. The case of Birmingham Trading Standards v Wyeth/SMA in 2003 established that it is not necessary to explicitely refer to the infant formula to be in breach of the law. In any case, follow-on milks are breastmilk substitutes and their promotion is prohibited by the International Code "

Is the Internet governed by UK law (if site UK registered) or the International Code of Practice ?

[Toothache]

The whole reaction to this ad is interesting... rather than the reason behind it.

[caligula]

Not true QoQ. They may just look around for other sites.

TBH I remember working on a pitch for Milupa (this had all been blissfully erased from my memory until the last few days) and they genuinely did want to promote bf. The idea being that those who "wanted" to give up, would turn to Aptimil, and those who could sort their problems out with the help of their helpline, would have a warm and fuzzy feeling about Aptimil and recommend it to their non bf friends and buy the other products, such as jars, when the babies are older. Also may consider them for mixed feeding and in the future for other babies.

It wasn't a theory based on "let's get as many mothers as poss to use our formula" - they're not so unsophisticated as that - it's based on "if we help them with their feeding problems, even if it's not a short term gain for us, the work we're doing in terms of long-term brand values, is an investment". They're not stupid enough to want to risk their brand by being associated with the sabotage of breastfeeding. Which is what will happen to them if they don't sort their helpline out.

And of course, it's also a strategy based on an ignorance of the realities of bf. After all, why should a marketing director know anything about its complexities? And since then, they also appear to be going in for this aggressive loophole advertising.

[Toothache]

Oops... forgive me for posting what has probably been posted a million times:

Is it remotely possible that Milupa offer a helpline to help Mums with breastfeeding..... but they also offer advice on what happens if you can't breastfeed? This helpline might just provide the approach that some women need, the approach that It's actually OK to stop breastfeeding if it isn't going well, it isn't a reflection on you as a bad parent? I don't think there are many NCT helplines that would do that.

I for one was crippled with guilt when breastfeeding my ds didn't go well. I was in agony, ds was screaming all night coz he was so hungry, my entire family were abroad on holiday and I felt like a total failure. I was slumped in a deep PND for 18mths after that. Perhaps having a means of getting advice that wasn't all disapproving would have really helped me..... and perhaps given me the strength to keep trying breastfeeding. With the attitude, "Just give it another couple of days, if that doesn't work don't beat yourself up about it..... you can always move him onto formula and get yourself mentally healthy again!"

Noone did that for me. Just got sighs and tuts when I told the midwife I was deeply depressed about the way bf was going.

[snafu]

Now I really wish I'd posted on all those tedious, mind-numbing, irrelevant Big Brother threads that kept appearing on my active convos screen

[Tinker]

Tik Tok would have supported you without tuts and sighs toothy. For free on here.

[Toothache]

I didn't know about MN then though. SO whats the alternative on offer?

Disapproving midwives and HV's and GP's. Doesn't sound very supportive does it?

[snafu]

Toothache, I think it's a totally fair point that you should have been offered practical, unbiased and compassionate support, of course it is. But it is surely a joke to assume you might get that from a 'helpline' run by a company whose sole purpose is to make money out of selling formula?!

[caligula]

Exactly. It's bloody awful that bf counsellors can't do it without tuts and sighs and make people scared to ask them for help. But a good bf counsellor shouldn't be doing that - the one I had didn't. She just always said to me: "what do YOU want? Do you want to breastfeed?" And if the answer was yes, then she'd help. (And it wasn't done in such a way that if the answer was no, it meant you were a pariah, iyswim)

[Tinker]

I'm pointing out the loss to mn.

[caligula]

Well that's why lots of us go on and on and on ad nauseum about the need for properly trained bf counsellors toothache.

Funnily enough, I can't seem to let that subject drop either!!

[mumtosomeone]

but she will not now will she!