Impossible question - but do you think children in private schools are ‘happier’?

[Diddlysquatty]

I’ve posted a bit about my yr 8 Dd.
High flier confident and bright and primary, she’s not enjoying her large (1500) ofsted outstanding state academy secondary.
She’s become quite down, self conscious, and had friendship issues. She’s not very motivated with school work and tends to do the minimum. Dismisses a lot of subjects as boring and says they don’t matter as she won’t do them for gcse anyway. Marks are ok but achievement has slipped a bit. Obviously impossible to say what role lockdown has played.

I’d offered her the option of changing schools at the height of the friendship issues (she’s in a bit of a toxic foursome) but she said she wouldn’t like to start again somewhere.

We’re coming into some money that means private would probably be possible and my mum apparently said to my husband over xmas, when asking after Dd, that they’d like to help if we wanted to move her.

He’s keen on the idea from an academic perspective. I think he thinks in a smaller, private school they’d pick up on and help with lack of motivation, and filling any gaps from lockdown.

I’m just not sure whether we should even consider it.

The pressure at school is one of the things she complains about - she’s in top sets and in a tutor group that’s doing a special language immersion stream (supposedly) so is with generally more able people.
Surely this aspect would be worse at an academically selective secondary?

Could they really help with motivation or would it make no difference?

It does sound like the teachers are beaten down where she is but there’s no guarantee this would be different at private is there?

I know that some people choose private for academic or social reasons, but what about well-being? Are kids more likely to come out well balanced and resilient, or is the opposite true if there is more competition, issues of wealth etc?

I know I’m asking the impossible but would appreciate thoughts.

I went to a small private all girls school and there were definitely lots of mental health issues going on there!

I know my husband doesn’t agree but I’m not so fussed about grades - apart from the extent to which this would boost her - but most of all I want her to be happy and feel like she’s fulfilling her potential

It's about the right fit rather than a state v private issue.

Not quite the same but we've moved our primary aged kids from state to a small non selective private.

The difference in them is staggering, especially DC2 who is anxious and tries to hide at the back in classes.

The smaller class sizes has meant that the teachers have a great grasp of my kids and know them really well, in a way that the (very good and hard working) teachers at the state school just couldn't do. They are in classes of 15 rather than 32.

So whilst it is non selective, they are getting a lot out of our kids, not just academically. DC2 now sings around the house and is giving presentations at school without a week of panic induced insomnia.

I would do it again without hesitation.

Look at your options. Speak to anyone you can at the school, specifically re class sizes and pastoral care. Narrow the choice down to a school who has shown genuine interest in your daughter and making sure she is looked after.

Then discuss it with your DD. Go see the school, so a taster day (obviously not until the summer term due to covid).

Completely agree @ConfusedcomMum. I’m not personally sure about viewing the happiness levels of any poor people from a third world country as a) we’re seeing it from our privileged Western perspectives and there is a tendency to project and b) it has a bit of the ‘simple but happy’ Victorian folksy stereotyping of the rural poor - I just think it’s a hell of a lot more complex than that (apologies @flourandeggs, no offence meant in the least, I just have ??).

I think Confused is spot on re contentment - children need to feel secure, loved and engaged to be happy, along with content at school. Any family of any background can provide that. DHs background is hugely different to mine (single parent household in a rather grim area of S London, Down syndrome elder brother, everything bought ‘on the tick’) but we both had very happy childhoods (or I did until I was shipped off to board at age 10), Obviously parental stress due to not being able to pay bills will impact on a child - but so will better off parents redundancies, bankruptcies and divorce. A single parent relying on a food bank on a semi regular basis might/might not very well providing her children a happier environment than a well off couple going through a really nasty separation. There are just no hard and fasts here, at all.

Again, I appreciate State children come from all income backgrounds (something I like) but you can’t stick parents of either into either a ‘well off’, ‘less well off’ camp. It completely takes out of consideration the children on bursaries or with parents cutting corners to pay fees. If also excludes completely the middle class left wing liberal professionals choosing State out of principle/good local provision - there are rather a lot of us!

I haven't RTFT, but would say that if your DD is finding a big secondary school too much to cope with, then a reasonable smallish independent school may be a better environment for her. We moved DS too many times for school. He attended four in total but we didn't move house. It has ended up okay, but in retrospect, it wasn't good at the time. However, at 21 and in his first year at uni, he is socially fluid in a way that few people are. He has good mannners and knows how to behave around our very ordinary, very middle class friends, but understands the hunting shooting fishing aristocracy/plutocracy from prep school. Unusually he also knows the reality of how people live in very rough. gritty deprived areas (both urban and rural) from school and work in hospitality and kitchen work, and gets on pretty well with them too. And, the thing I am proud of, he takes everyone as he finds them, and you get the same treatment if you're a Russian oligarch or buying a slice of pizza. Duke or dustman, my son will speak to you as himself. Now if he could learn to be tidy...

I did have another chat with dd about it and she said again that she wouldn’t like to ‘start again’
I think there are lots of interesting points to think about but some of them are more relevant if looking for a school from day 1, I think the push and pull factors have to be quite significant to outweigh the issues for a self conscious/currently negative/not socially confident child moving at a time when she’d probably be the only new girl.

Supplementing with good extra curricular activities outside school, and building/maintaining friendships outside school was the theory but her attitude at the moment means she’s given up stuff and it’s so difficult to encourage her to try new things.
She isn’t naturally sporty although was very into ballet
She is naturally musical but I don’t think made enough progress quickly enough on her instruments to get to the enjoyment stage
She’s a great singer and has done one off choir bits in the past but now refuses to sing infront of anyone or join a choir (having previously happily done things like a solo verse of once in royal infront of a church of 250 people!)
Her interest in art that has always been here has really taken off over the last year and she spends a lot of time drawing

She is incredibly negative and very ‘glass half empty’ which really gets me down.
But I will continue supporting her and hope that’s just a phase.
Once lockdown eases I will redouble my efforts to get her to at least try out a local church youth group with kids from different schools, and again suggest the school choir. Also see if we can find an out of school art club (sadly the school art club she enjoyed never restarted)

the whole extra curriculum thing.

Of course it varies from school to school, and some state schools have award winning drama/sport teams, and some have nothing and some private schools offer a broad spectrum and the award winning teams etc and some don't.

I think the thing that stands out is that regardless of state or private, for most things if it is on offer, you probably have to pay for it (when I did horse riding at my private school on pe afternoon, my parents paid for it, despite it being one of the pe options on offer.) only things like football/rugby are likely to be free.

If you are going to pay, then you can pay outside of school too. Ds was part of a local football team (never made it into school football team at his state school) dd1 was part of a local brass band, that was (and still is) amazing and has been life changing for her I think, one of the advantages is that it is mixed age, from 7-97, literally. She was also a keen scout for a while and did a massive overseas trip with them, again life changing, both of those were not only out of school, but could not be done at school in the same way.
But now, covid allowing, she is going to join a joint cadet force run at their state school. That is one we don't have available outside school.

It really comes down to what the schools you look at offer, and what is available locally, and how much it is worth to you that it is afterschool and on site (ie provides childcare)

Again and again it has been said - it depends on the school!

I moved to private from state in year 9 and was incredibly lucky. My whole year group seemed very down to earth and I found everyone easy to get on with. Thinking about it, some other new girls joined at the same time but left as they didn’t like it at all and they’d come from private already . So it’s really just pot luck. I sometimes see posts about the school and it seems to have a current reputation of being posh and rich. Not sure if it’s because of SM and mumsnet, reputations can be created and spread more easily .

I think it depends on the child. My DD was at a state through primary, had a god awful time through-out. Labelled as ''difficult'' / ''behavioral issues'', 'trouble maker'', lazy etc.. did well across the board (exceeding in most areas) despite this. Was made fun of and bullied on several occasions, endless friendship issues. She hated school and getting her there was often a challenge. She's a smart but very sensitive kid, asks a lot of questions, challenges things and a bit of a geek really (likes sport, science and maths, thinks art is a waste of time ..).

I moved her to a selective private for secondary - they can't praise her enough. She's done so well, and the change in her in frankly shocking. Her drive, commitment, quality of work, enthusiasm, self-motivation, participation in the many things on offer means she loves what a selective environment offers and it has had a hugely positive impact on her wellbeing. She loves school now. It's financially a huge struggle and she is the ''poor'' kid among mostly upper middle class high earner families, military, and ''super'' rich families - however most of which are incredibly down to earth. DD's not ''materialistic'' in the slightest so any 'money' talk goes over her head and it's not impacted her social integration one bit. I'd do it again in a heart beat for the benefit it's brought.

Moral of the tale, if the school fits the child they are happy. If it doesn't then it's a tough journey but not insurmountable.. if you can afford it then I'd say be very careful about choosing the right school for your child.

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