Parents try to stop children being taught about trans relationships

[julie333]

As far as I know, parents will no longer be allowed to take their children out of Sex Education from 2020.

The subject was debated in the Halls of Westminster yesterday (25 February).

Whatever parents' opinions may be about trangenderism, I do think ultimately it´s the parents who decide what their children should be taught about this matter and not the State.

"The UK Conservative government is set to announce plans for the introduction of lessons on homosexuality and transgenderism for primary school students, despite an official petition against the move, signed by over 100,000.

The Sunday Times reports that the new curriculum has been finalized after a six-month consultation with the Department of Education, and will be rolled out across UK schools starting from the 2020-21 educational year.

It will be taught to pupils from the age of five, and it will be illegal for parents to take their children out of the classroom for the lessons in secondary school, meaning that at least a term’s worth of sex education classes – and likely far more – will be attended by each student."

If you wis to sign the petition against compulsory Sex Education,then here is the link:

Give parents the right to opt their child out of Relationship and Sex Education

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/235053

'this is what some people believe'. There is simply no other way.

I think 'this is what some people feel' is better.

We can't see 'love'. It's hard to explain, yet we talk about it to our children all the time. We can't see sexuality but again we talk about it.

I've yet to hear a trans person explain it at all, let alone provide any workable alternative definition of the word 'woman' that can include 'man'. 3 years and waiting...

Lots of women aren't 'at ease' with their female bodies, certainly lots of developing girls aren't - that doesn't make then boys, that doesn't make their bodies wrong. Still women, still girls.

Feel, believe - but neither trump reality which is that you can't change sex (and you can't force anyone else to feel your feelings or believe your beliefs).

I agree River but that is not how the guidance is written.
I really feel for schools left to find their way through this.

Oscar you say Schools need to be given the opportunity to talk about this in order to give them the correct information and reassurance as if there is a text book somewhere that sets out what is "correct".

Tell me where teachers are supposed to find this correct information?

They are watching stuff online, some are under the impression that trans is 'common'. One boy said he seen something online that said something like 30% of people are straight, 30% gay, 30% trans. He didn't believe it but kids are being exposed to this.

Where do you think teachers are getting their information from? Most of them will be getting it online in exactly the same way as their students. The DFE Guidance gives absolutely no guidance on how to approach the subject.

Or teachers are sign posted to organisations that have absolutely no objectivity at all.

You seem to think objectors like me want to stop discussions with children but that is not what we are arguing. We are arguing that beliefs as being portrayed as facts and that is a dangerous and unacceptable starting point for discussion.

Lots of women aren't 'at ease' with their female bodies, certainly lots of developing girls aren't - that doesn't make then boys, that doesn't make their bodies wrong. Still women, still girls.

Many women are not at ease because they want to be slimmer, curvier, bigger breasts etc. I'm talking about women who do not want breasts, regardless of their size, do not like their female body at all.
And some, a small number of those not at ease will choose to transition. That is their choice to make, not ours. Their bodies are wrong to them. Again, not our choice. If they want to transition, after have extensive counselling and support, I will call them a woman, she, her etc because I respect their choices. Their chromosomes will remain the same, no one can argue that fact.

Oscar
A Christian could talk to me their experience of letting Jesus into their lives or what it felt like to experience the love of god. They could even describe their soul or their experience of a calling from god. They might be highly eloquent and be 100% convinced about what they are saying but that doesn't mean that god exists or that I have a soul.

Oscar I am talking about the selfsame women. Surely the way to deal with these highly distressing feelings is to teach acceptance of the body, not to advocate the removal of, for example, healthy breasts.

It's a mental health issue. What other mental health issue is dealt with in this manner? Is anorexia, which is closely allied to body dysphoria? No, and anyone advocating such a method would be subject to the horror of society.

If they want to transition, after have extensive counselling and support, I will call them a woman, she, her etc because I respect their choices.

What do you mean by transition?

I'm out of time now, kids to pick up from school etc. I'll try to get back on tomorrow if this thread is still going.

I think we can all do our bit to raise awareness. I suppose things like sending the transgender trend stuff to schools.
It's very difficult to control information sharing and I've seen some dreadful things taught to kids. Like the genderbread person, which was in the standard curriculum in one school I taught in. I challenged some of the teachers who had totally bought into it and they'd never questioned it. Shocking really.
As a science teacher I can get away with some good black and white teaching on the whole penis=male vagina=female (and I do this as often as I can).

School is the place that will reach most children so I feel it's only right it's addressed there.

And this is why Stonewall, Mermaids and their ilk are so keen to get into schools, and why they started a petition to ban the Transgendertrend school pack from being used in schools as a resource.

In my view, this is precisely why “gender identity” beliefs shouldn’t be taught in schools.

Unless it’s as part of RE, alongside other beliefs.

I will be the first to complain if trans is in any way 'promoted' by schools.

GIRES is an organisation which promotes the idea of transgender children. They have produced 'teaching materials' for schools. This is for children aged 3-6:

www.gires.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Penguin-Story-Trans-Boy.pdf

This is what GIRES say about their materials:
Lesson Context: Most schools are subject to the Public Sector Equality Duty, and all are required to abide by the Equality Act 2010. Understanding gender diversity starts here, at primary school level, before children’s views become influenced by the prejudices of the adults around them.

www.gires.org.uk/classroom-lesson-plans/

More about what's going on in schools here:
lilymaynard.wordpress.com/2017/11/08/when-is-a-girl-not-a-girl/

In my view, this is precisely why “gender identity” beliefs shouldn’t be taught in schools.
Unless it’s as part of RE, alongside other beliefs.

I agree with this. Gender dysphoria is a separate issue and should be covered at the same time as they teach about other mental health issues such as anorexia or self harm.

Hopefully good schools will teach this appropriately - ie with a brief comment and that it. However, schools that use GIRES, Mermaids, Allsorts , similar materials /speakers will be told to do the following:
Breach safeguarding guidelines - see the GIRES training that tells teachers to promise confidentiality to children
Remove parental responsibility / rights from parents - these groups tell schools that they can allow children to transition without talking with parents
Allow self harm in the form of normalising breast binding and use of hormone blocking drugs in children of all ages

The training offered to schools by these organisations places this group of vulnerable gender non conforming children outside the normal safeguarding systems that we use to protect all other children leaving them isolated from their families and outside safeguarding systems.
Catastrophically dangerous.

I really don’t understand how you can teach trans anything to children and teens.

As you grow up at some point I would say the majority of perfectly happy adults hated their bodies.

It doesn’t mean they were born in the wrong body and needed to change gender.
It was just growing up.

You might be a boy and like dolls/pink/fairies or a girl who likes football/blue/wearing trousers again it doesn’t mean anything. No one needs to do anything other than wait a few years for them to grow up and grow out of it.

You'd get along with the people at stop rse.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/primary/3505248-who-should-educate-your-child-state-or-you?pg=3&order=

JohnWicksDog

You do understand that LGB and T are two completely different issues, don't you? And that transgender ideology is inherently homophobic? A few gay people have spoken up about how they might have been affected if this ideology had been around in their youth.

www.theguardian.com/film/2016/jun/19/rupert-everett-dangers-of-child-sex-change-operations-gender

“I really wanted to be a girl. Thank God the world of now wasn’t then, because I’d be on hormones and I’d be a woman. After I was 15 I never wanted to be a woman again.”

quillette.com/2019/01/31/homophobia-and-the-modern-trans-movement/

"If someone had told me as a child that I could actually be a little girl, I would have jumped at the chance. Anything to escape the pressure cooker of an active boyhood crammed full of sports and rough play."

PSHE lessons are delivered by non-specialists. At my (secondary) school, this means woefully unprepared teachers are required to give lessons about transgenderism by spouting nonsense downloaded from the internet. It’s truly shocking.

No one needs to do anything other than wait a few years for them to grow up and grow out of it.

I know a trans woman who transitioned when she was over 50. When would she have grown out of it, 60, 70, 80 ?

I know a trans woman who transitioned when she was over 50. When would she have grown out of it, 60, 70, 80 ?

Was she previously a gay man who hated her male body, or a man who had fathered children in a heterosexual relationship, and enjoyed a bit of cross-dressing? Most late transitioners fall into the latter group.

Was she previously a gay man who hated her male body, or a man who had fathered children in a heterosexual relationship, and enjoyed a bit of cross-dressing? Most late transitioners fall into the latter group.

She was previously a man who had had a few short term relationships with men.

DauntlessFaction

So 1 person. How many children think they are trans and then grow out of it.

I know 2 girls who said they were trans between the ages of 15- 18. Insisted they were called the correct names etc.

Both now no longer believe they are trans.

Shudder to think if they had parents who bought into the whole trans ideology and stuffed hormones down their dc’s face where would they be now.
Fortunately both sets of parents any time they thought their dds were trying to shock them they both came out the line
“That’s nice dear. Now what do you want for tea”

Whilst there might be a tiny amount of people who believe they were born in the wrong body. The shear amount who now seem to have come out is a tad unbelievable.

If the criteria to being trans means boys playing with dolls and liking the colour pink and girls playing with train sets and liking to wear jeans. Then virtually everyone is trans or just that you are a boy who likes stereotypical girls things and a girl who likes boy things.
Nothing wrong there

Presumably the option to transition was there for this person at 20, 30 and 40 - not sure that they are an example of why children need to be supported to transition as children.

not sure that they are an example of why children need to be supported to transition as children.

She is an example in response to the pp who wrote:

No one needs to do anything other than wait a few years for them to grow up and grow out of it.

I never said 'children need to be supported to transition as children. I just think that schools need to touch upon trans issues as they are aware of them.

The shear amount who now seem to have come out is a tad unbelievable.

I don't know how many kids think they are trans compared to 10 years ago or 20 years ago. It may be that there are more trans people than we thought and people are feeling more confident to say they are. It may be that children are confused because of shit stereotypes and the Internet. Of course it's ok to not fit stereotypes and it doesn't mean you're trans. Either way, it something kids are coming into contact with so I'm good with it being talked about as a small part of the curriculum if it's done well.

I'm good with it being talked about as a small part of the curriculum if it's done well.

I agree, but there's no evidence that it is being done well, when the people who are writing the teaching materials for schools are all pushing transgenderism on children who are gender non-conforming. See the GIRES materials I posted earlier.