so it's a no to Indyref2

[HeraldicBlazoning]

And I'm quite glad. My mental health was shot to pieces by the first one.

Good

@SirChenjins ah you're the type that gatekeeps womanhood. Gotcha.

Well Nae luck - the GRA will pass ✅ and decent feminists and ALL Scotland's feminist third sector are delighted.

GO educate yourself on what feminism actually means.

I'll leave with a quote by the mother of feminism Mary Wallstonecraft

"I earnestly wish to see the distinction of the sexes confounded in society"

So do I & thank goodness that the Scottish government agree.

Good
I hope they focus on the more pressing matters at hand
Once in a generation referendums dont mean keep coming back again until you get the answer you want

@MichelleScarn I think a future agreement could (like the Northern Ireland agreement ) have inbuilt right to revisit at previously agreed timescale.

Brexit was a major change in circumstances post 2014 vote & as such it's only democratic to allow people a choice.

Those stamping their feet on top of democracy by celebrating the UK being confirmed as an involuntary union are being incredibly short-sighted.

I've never understood why there's a level of vitriol on nationalist/ unionist threads that I never ever see on any other topic on Mumsnet.

There are other political debates (Tory/Labour, Brexit, immigration, anti semitism, abortion, euthanasia etc) that people feel just as strongly about but there's never the derogatory language used against the opposing side that you get in these debates.

Why?

I voted yes last time. I was a paid-up member of the SNP. Not any more. I can't trust a party that allows male-bodied people into women's safe spaces.

@beachcitygirl At least get the spelling correct - it's Wollstonecraft.

@Jacopo - same here

The SNP’s adherence to the GRA will lose it masses of votes. It is deeply unpopular throughout Scotland with SNP supporters and non-SNP supporters. Promoting it is the price the SNP paid for the green MSP’s votes in Parliament, and it will prove incredibly damaging for the SNP. They come across as totally out of touch loony’s.

@readsalotgirl63 I'm dyslexic & have dyspraxia. I regulerly make spelling errors. But if that makes you feel good to point out, go ahead, hope you get a warm glow

Yeah, damn right I'm the 'type' of woman that gatekeeps the protected characteristic of sex. It comes as no surprise that you're not.

The SNP has form for the most ludicrous of legislation and diminishing the rights of women as it scrabbles for the Green's vote - the same rights that suffragettes fought so hard for, and the same rights that women will continue to fight for in Scotland because it's obvious that it's very much needed. As for your ALL Scotland's third sector feminists are delighted - what absolute rubbish. You don't speak for every feminist woman working in that sector, save your empty claim for your nationalist echo chambers.

It's Wollstonecraft btw.

So not a union of equals then... gotcha!

The vitriol can be even worse in real life. I’m not sure why - I guess because it’s such an emotionally charged debate? Scottish people in general are v proud to be Scots so both sides care a lot about the outcome and the future of Scotland.

Indeed. Every person with common sense knows penises don’t belong in womens changing rooms, on female leaders of brownie packs, in woman’s prisons etc. the GRA doesn’t argue on these matters but in supporting it the SNP shows that it is in the camp of the crazed gas lighters that think penises do belong in woman’s changing rooms etc, and that’s why their continued support of ‘trans rights’ will help sink them as a party. So incredibly out of touch!

I'm not sure where you were during Brexit @caroleanboneparte but I can assure you, it was - and continues to be - a very divisive, very bitter topic with plenty of derogatory language flung about on here and elsewhere.

@SirChenjins ah you're the type that gatekeeps womanhood. Gotcha.

oh the chortle I've had at this gymnastics!
(Apologies @SirChenjins!)

I really feel for women in Scotland who don’t want this.

Yuck.

@Letsgetreadytoblackcurrantcrumble the penis isn't the problem.
As educated feminists have always known.

As even you must surely know? Or you would never be alone with a boy or man.

There is a choice to being a rapist or abuser.

It's got nothing to do with possessing a penis.

Oh and please someone tell me where these safe spaces for women are ? Because as far as I can see (a woman raped every 3 hours) going back decades. NONE exist.

Blindly doing the same over & over again & not trying to change societal norms and expectations and rigid gender expectations is the lunacy.

@StrychnineInTheSandwiches x

And for the women who are hounded, torn to shreds, dragged through the courts, have their home addresses posted on the TRA platforms, who are silenced in the workplace and more. Being called bigoted and transphobic has all the impact of a gnat's fart in comparison to what the brave women fighting to retain their rights in Scotland face.

the penis is exactly the problem! Get out of your echo chamber and ask people!!! See, you are just showing how out of touch you are, perfectly illustrating the problem the SNP is having with pursuing this legislation!

It is the exact definition of gas-lighting to tell women that do t want penises in female areas that ‘penises are not the problem’! Gaslighting the electorate. We see it in black and white. We are not impressed.