so it's a no to Indyref2

[HeraldicBlazoning]

And I'm quite glad. My mental health was shot to pieces by the first one.

I confess that I actually feel vitriol for Indy supporters! Who could be that stupid? Take a look at the finances of this country, and how much extra money we get into our budget through being part of the union and try to imagine how the poorest in society would fare under an Indy Scotland. Get your head out of the gaslit cult nonsense pumped out by the SNP and use it.

I like to think I keep that vitriol under wraps though, and would never say anything unfair to anyones face. I would just feel so much less of them.

Point out the vitriol please?

That is just being goady though, isn't it?

But at least I don't need to go through the thread again to point things out for @Rainbowshit 😊

the SNP are the least democratic party I have ever come across so how NS has the brass neck to hurl that accusation at Westminster is mind boggling. Anybody watching the GRA 'debates' currently going through chambers will see there is no place for democracy in NS's SNP

It must feel like a runaway train if you don’t want it and you’re in Scotland. I know it will cost us too but over time the next generations in Scotland will bear it more. So people’s dc and theirs.

And it’s just an easy target for a politician who has worked out how to stoke hate to keep power.

Only 1/3 rd of the voting population voted for the SNP so 2/3 rds did not .

so it’s not the people of Scotland speaking it’s a fraction of them .

Has she blamed this on the English yet ?

Plus - we can’t blame the Scottish Government for the state Scotland is in . They are second rate regional administrators who have been promoted way beyond their capabilities and are floundering on the big issues that are truly important such as Education and Health. It’s shocking that a few transgender operations take place costing vast amounts of money when hundreds of people are having their lives ruined awaiting knee and hip ops .

Wee nicky liar will be loving it, another reason not to do the day job ( that she isn't fit to do)

I hope so too.

Hardship, poverty, racism, cronyism, tax loopholes, foodbanks, hatred of immigration and refugees, laughing stock on world stage, liars in power & more abuse of power to come. The UK is two steps away from a fascist regime.

All of those things can be levelled at Holyrood too though, and many of the issues around hardship, poverty etc sit within the devolved powers already in place. There are few things more fascist than the compelled speech which rests at the centre of discourse around the GRA, for example. I’m no fan of Westminster but Holyrood is no better.

The Scottish Government don’t have a good track record at the Supreme Court so no surprise the decision went against them.

i think this is exactly the outcome sturgeon wanted. If she got a referendum and actually ‘won’ independence, she wouldn’t be able to use the union and unionists as a bogeyman to distract from her government’s many failings.

This way she gets maximum martyrdom without the risk of more confirmation that the Scots aren’t with her when she loses a referendum or that she might have to put her money where her mouth is and actually govern a state.

Curses, I had been offered a job rebuilding Hadrians Wall if they had got independence 😹😹😹👍

Just to keep some perspective here : 38 pc of Scots voted to leave the Eu . By no means a small amount .

@goldenshoe, ha typical but there really were no vitriolic posts before that that I could see apart from those from beach directed at unionists.

@beachcitygirl

Just in case you missed it, I'd like an answer to this from your "feminist" point of view please.

I don't for one second believe everyone on this thread is actually in Scotland. Folk can't help loud mouthing their opinion when they don't live here at every opportunity on mumsnet.

Nicola will get louder and so will we. There are thousands of people out tonight across our capitals and further afield. If you think this will shut us up think again.

What the PP said was hate speech @Venetiaparties ? I don't think so. You'll find an awful lot of Scots that feel exactly that. Go to any street here and you'll find people who feel this way. My English friend who has emigrated to Spain uses similar language and left England for that reason.

there are lots of Scots (born and bred) living both in and outside of scotland who aren’t impressed with sturgeon and the SNP.

I was going to point out the contradiction of @beachcitygirl being sympathetic to someone who'd suffered abuse while using phrases such as "knucklescraping engerland fascists" and calling us all stupid and antifeminist but @Venetiaparties beat me to it.

And yeah call me petty but finding spelling errors does give me a warm glow - makes me feel less stupid.

Half of my family belong to this category. They now live in England, vote Tory and think less fortunate people should pull themselves up by their bootstraps. The lack of compassion is a big problem.

As an Indy supporter I'm not actually in snp and have plenty of issues with them. But they were voted in on a mandate - this is simply bad for democracy.

How is it bad for democracy to have vote and for that result to be respected ? That is democracy.

Feckless alkies the lot of them

I got told I wasn't a Scot living in Scotland on the other thread. It's all a bit 'No true Scot', isn't it. Wrongthink and all. This is why I hate the division of it all so much, despise the SNP and hate the way my country (Yup, it's mine as much as it is yours) has descended into vitriolic nastiness. The accusations that you can't be Scottish if you don't want independence .