Emotional Abuse - can we talk abou t it and what it entails?

[Janos]

If we already have a thread on this then I apologise for bringing it all up again. Perhaps someone can let me know and if so I'll let the thread die quietly!

I just thought it would be helpful to talk about it, and what constitutes it so people who are in an emotionally abusive relationship could recognise what is going on as it can be so insidious and nasty, and more difficult to identify.

This is not for one moment to denigrate or draw attention away from physical or sexual abuse btw.

Macdoodle, I don't have a brilliant answer, just what I suspect you know already. You can't make BF DD see that this man is no good for her until she's ready to see it. It certainly won't happen during their loved-episodes. I think you're doing the right thing by lending her the Lundy Bancroft book and telling her that she doesn't deserve this, but I don't think there's much more you can do. If you push too hard, you may push her away. Keep telling her that relationships don't have to be like this, watch and wait.

therealme, congratulations on getting this far. I'm glad you're getting support. This is the toughest bit. It is terrifying. I can completely understand why you are mourning all the lost years - it's great if this can be an incentive not to lose any more of your life to misery. Good luck!

Hi - I'm glad to see this thread up and running again as it has been a life-saver for me. Macdoodle - I agree that you have done all you can for the meantime. Your friend and daughter know that you are there if needed and you are willing to support. Therealme - you sound really strong and ready for action - good luck and keep us updated. Newlysingle - google the cycle of abuse. Abuse, emotional as well as physical goes through a cycle of a build up, abusive behaviour, apologies and then a honeymoon period. Then the cycle starts again. They do it to stop us walking away and to confuse us - was he really that awful because he is being so nice now? Mine follows this pattern but he seems to miss out the apology bit! I'm logging the cycle with events and dates to get the pattern and help me recognise it.

I could really do with some opinions too. Since I last posted I have had the big conversation with DH. He admitted his behaviour and says he always feels miseerable, negative and only sees the bad in things/people. He has never apologised. He has moved into the spare room and agreed to go to the Drs. The Dr has prescribed prosac but says he feels it is more that just depression. He's been on the prosac for about 4 weeks. I'm seeing a bit of difference since we first talked. He joins in with the family a bit more and checks himself sometimes when he is critical. HE is making a lot more effort with DS2, who he really struggles with. However he still keeps lapsing into the old behaviour patterns - impatience, criticisms, tempers, nagging. He is really losing patience with DS2 - saying he really winds him up - he is too loud and active. I am still really upset about an incident earlier in the week. I didn't get a job I went for the other day, which was an internal interview. On Sunday night, before I returned to work on Monday, he sent my DS1 for a shower and then pulled a chair up next to me. He then started to go on about how embarrasing it would be for me to go back to work on Monday and how everyone would laugh at me. I defended my colleagues, but he continued to say that I would be embarrased and that they are nasty like that in my organisation - this isn't true, they are very supportive and several are personal friends. I said that it would have been nice if he could have been more supportive about me not getting the job, as he had only commented on how much he had been looking forward to my better salary and grunted about the amount of work I had put in (he doesn't like me doing work-related things at home). He then said that I was twisting things again and that he has noticed me twisting things a lot recently. I felt my frustrationg welling up and I asked him to leave the room. He carried on, so I said I couldn't believe he was saying that after the way he has treated my all these years. He then left the room. Later he behaved like nothing had happened. The next day he asked if my wonderful colleagues had been supportive. I was so angry. It felt so mean and so calculating the way he did this to really have a dig at my dissapointment. Sorry to ramble, but I just had to air this. We have been in the honeymoon phase since then until yesterday. I feel it building up again as he gets more irritated with DS2. He is really watching his back as the Dr has said he is contacting SS cos he's worried about DH's treatment of the kids but if this is him being worried and careful, I expect him to return to normal once the threat has gone. I'm just not sure why I'm staying and his slightly improved behaviour makes it harder.

fairy, read the first paragraph of your post and take your own advice.....

you said you're logging the cycle - have you logged the last week?

May I ask, only coming to your story right now, why you're logging it and not acting to change it? Sorry if you've said before...

Fairy, he sounds horrible. But I'm glad you posted because you have just described my partner - impatience, criticism, tempers, nagging. And yes, I know the cycle only too well and you don't enjoy the honeymoon period after a while because you know it's only temporary.

Logging it down is quite powerful because you can't argue wit the facts. Since I started doing it, I've realised it's nearly every day. My question also is why you're not acting on it?

Making a plan and getting the logistics clear in your head is very powerful. As is talking to people in RL. I really struggled with this, but this thread was my lifeline and I've now done it. Even my GP said you have to leave this man now; that shocked me into action as it was blunt and unexpected.

Wish me luck for next week!

Lewisfan - well I thought that I was acting to change it but realise I probably took the wrong action. Told DH he had to go to Dr because he clearly has depression and another underlying issue. I suspected borderline personality disorder. However, other than prozac, it is now 5/6 weeks later and little has happened. The dr has even suggested that it might be me being paranoid, so I've lost trust in him. I now realise that I've been coming at the problem from the point of view of helping my DH when the underlying problem is EA, regardless of whether or not he has a mental health problem. I saw 2 women's aid reps. 2 weeks ago and they said it was classic emotional and mental abuse, covering many of the areas and quite severe in nature. However there is little further help they can offer, unless I want re-homing. I haven't directly discussed abuse with him but rather his treatment of the kids. I feel this is the next step but worry about his reaction. He has made several comments lately, in front of the kids, about abuse including "well , of course, I'm meant to be an abusive father" - looking at me. I suppose I am doing nothing else for several reasons. Firstly, he can't see what all the fuss is about, which makes me doubt myself. He wants to go to relate to work on the relationship (although he is making little effort to push this). Secondly, I worry about custody of kids - he works from home a lot and and takes the kids to and from school 3 days a week. I couldn't bear him having the kids half the time, where I couldn;t see how he is treating them. Thirdly - I'll lose the house, which I love, and my security. I also feel that I have people to talk and listen to me but nobody telling me I should leave and the practical support to make it happen. Queen - you had someone say it to you straight and that shocked you into action. Noone has said it to me. It's all been about what I want to do and I just want it all to go away I guess, although I know I can never trust or really love him again.

Queen - would you be prepared to share some of your DH's behaviour? It sounds like he is similar to my DH. It sounds like you are making a move this week. I really admire you and hope it all goes well. Are you going or is he going? How have you made it happen?

I've had an up and down day today. DH got progressively more aggressive and took most of it out on DS2. Behaviours included DH driving off in a huff, leaving me & DS1 unclear as to where he was going. Telling DS2 to shut up about 10 times and that he is "a useless boy". He then complained when DS shouted at him for not being nice. Asking me what he would "get" if he bought me some facials for my birthday or would another man benefit. Interrupting me & DS2 playing saying he would play with him, then when I was othewise engaged he immediatley left DS2. Tutting at DS2 when he walked into the living room when DH trying to watch TV. Grabbing DS2 when he was doing a little errand for me. When DS2 struggled because he wanted to do the errand for me, DH grabbed him really hard around the arm and DS2 shrieked and cried. I asked him to stop but he didn't. I released his fingers from DS2, so he put the other hand on his arm harder. He didn't leave lasting marks but I'm upset. DH told DS2 when we were all sitting round the dinner table that "mum won't come anywhere nearme. Whenever I go near your Mum she freezes and runs away." DS2 laughed. Am I paranoid or is this unacceptable behaviour?

So sorry to rant on again - but I know I need to do something but seem to be letting it happen around me even though I have tried to get help.

He sounds worse than mine tbh, especially with the pushing and shoving of the kids.

My partner is very clever and subtle - whenever I brought up how unhappy I was with the contemptuous way he spoke to me or his behaviour, he would deny it, say I was over reacting, unreasonable etc. then finish by apologising and saying sorry but it's so hard for him, if only I could be nicer and more considerate.

Things came to ahead when I had a stress-induced collapse a few months ago and spent a month in hospital. He actually overplayed his hand and that, combined with being away from him, made me see how insidious and awful it was.

He asked me to discharge myself so I could go home and look after our daughter, because he wanted to go on a work jolly to Italy for a few days (don't worry, I didn't). Since I've been home, he's gone on anti-depressants and seeing a counsellor because he's found me being ill so hard and I'm not understanding enough to what he's going through.

WA are telling you to go. Change GP - I did when my partner insisted on seeing the same GP and feeding lines about how awful I am. I would tell you to go as well. The house and childcare are the things I struggled with, but you do realise they don't matter. Do you really want to be there this time next year seeing your kids treated that way? That's your motivation.

Say nothing to him, start a new thread on mumsnet and get support, get a WA support worker to help you plan. And then just leave with a note on the table. Start sorting out clothes and toys for charity shops, in reality get friends to store them. This is the best time as it's the summer holidays.

Please do it.

Queen - thank you for your words of support and sharing your story. I don't plan to leave if possible but want him to move out until we can sell the house. We talked about it recently and he knows it may still happen. I'm not sure if he would really go though. Starting a new thread is a good idea, although I do have long gaps when I can't access the computer without him being around - I have to go on when he goes to bed to do anything in private. He works from home. Strangly enough, I have started a big tidy-out. I must make it more focused. I hope all goes well for you this week. Keep posting to update me and I'll try to get on to reply.

hI fairyliquid123,
I too am working towards getting an abusive man out of the house. Despite the fact he pays no rent/bills this is so so hard because it means I have to ultimately stand up to him and say the words 'I am ending this marriage and I want you to leave'. I am dealing with a man whom I believe has a personality disorder (Narcissistic) so the normal rules don't apply. It is also very hard for people to understand why I don't just tell him the marriage is over and feck him out! Sure if it was that easy I wouldn't be here still after 17 years!

It's all about taking baby steps though. First acknowledging that the way he treats you is not right; then you have to mentally build your self back up again. This doesn't happen overnight - you have had the life force drained out of you over a long period of time, you doubt everything you think and feel and are incapable of making any decisions for yourself. It takes time to make and come to terms with every decision you decide upon; but each time you do it's one step away from the old doormat you were and one step nearer to freedom.

Tomorrow evening I am meeting a free legal advice solicitor and I have my list of questions prepared. I'm hoping that after my meeting I will move another little step closer to finally breaking free from this life of misery. I have 3 children so it's going to move at a slow pace, one that I feel totally comfortable and in control of. The long term plan is within sight and I am determined to get there eventually! But you can't force change until you are ready.

Keep your long term goal in your mind always, slowly work towards that goal by informing yourself about your options, and be prepared to tweak your plan here and there in order to stay in control towards achieving an outcome that is in your and your childrens best interests.
I'm sending you hugs and my empathy xx

I agree with therealme that sometimes you have to move slowly and steadily, and take each step as you feel ready for it.

Fairy, definitely document your h's treatment of the children every time he calls them names, grabbing their arms etc - this will help later if you find yourself having to oppose shared residence. They may seem very minor in themselves, but you will be able to show a pattern of unsatisfactory parenthood. You won't be able to prevent all access, but this might help you put reasonable limits on it.

Hello again, I eventually left my EA ex two years ago and it has been great.
But, I now think I may be suffering from from a kind of delayed shock about it all.
I knew I had to stay strong for the dcs and they seem to be used to it now but I have started anxiety attacks over relatively small things and find I've suddenly started to feel quite down. Maybe it's because I didn't get any supposrt or recognition about what happened at the time (I didn't tell anyone he was EA to me)
Is this anything any of you have gone through?

I'm not two years out mamas, so can't really answer you. I definitely find myself looking for validation (by posting on threads like this, for example!) and I think it would be quite hard never to have got any support or recognition. I hope you'll find some here.

hello, what's happened to everyone?

Hi One life! I often wonder whats happened to everyone on here too. (actually I read some of the other threads and wonder if they're name changed).

Everything much the same here, H still living here, but I think he's started to accept its over - although he is still wearing his ring and still manages to get me to mother him any time he puts his 'little boy lost' voice and attitude.

How are you at the moment?

Well I was on here as sick of the rain, first post March 09 and now I'm on the way to being free - hooray! It makes me feel ill re reading my earlier posts, it was a horrible and loveless year which culminated in him having a fling while working away. Once those final shreds of trust had gone, I realised I was absolutely fighting a losing battle and am preparing to divorce him.

I hope everyone else is doing well, I often think of this thread and am glad it's popped back up.

Hi again, glad you're still about, and things improving.

We've been in a refuge for the last 2 months. His behaviour was getting worse and worse, and it culminated in him spending 5 hours trying to make me lend him £100. He'd been being horrible all day, expecting me to run around doing whatever he wanted, then once the kids were in bed, it just turned worse. He took my phone, when I tried to take it back, and wouldn't let go, he dragged me through the house, through water all over me, said that's what you'd do to a dog. He tool my glasses off me, pretended he was breaking them, said he'd broken various things round the house, clapped, sang and dance (bonkers!) right near my face when trying to get the baby back to sleep, insulting me, threatening me etc etc.

Next day, said I must enkoy his behaviour if I was still saying no to him. Threatened to break my shoes if I tried to go out, tried to make me leave the baby with him. Night before I left he paid me £7 back of the $15 money I'd lent him over the weekend, just so he'd take dd1 out and I could arrange things, immediately demanded it back and started threatening things again. So the next day we escaped.

He's now telling me how he's changed, but he hasn't at all. Still told me that evening would never have happened if I had only done as he said. Tells me he's trying to be nice, but I have to help him, and if I'm going to be destructive/aggressive (putting down the phone on him when he started listing my many many faults_ then he will too.

He got into my house after I left and is still there now, though claims he'll leave this weekend.

He is still being controlling, telling me what i have to do

Well done one life! I'm so proud of you for going to the refuge!! You must be finding it such a relief there to know that he's not just giong to turn up.

That paragraph you've written about how he thinks he's changed really says it all doesn't it? "I've changed, but it's all your fault not mine anyway" I'm so glad you're out of there.

Glad you got out, onelife. It "would never have happened if I had only done as he said". That's the classic abuser's line right there.

please read my thread, I still have my inner core xxxx it may help

Only just seen this thead, thanks to Miggsie's link from "Isn't it great that we never really argue darling"

Thought it well worth a bump.

just re:found this thread now too. Loads of useful info for those in this situation!

Bump!

I'm so glad I have found this thread and MN in general about EA over the past couple of months as I can't believe I have been so stupid and have only just realised I have been EA'd by my H of 16 yrs. I have grand plans in my head re leaving but cannot go yet. This is because I cannot leave with my children as he would refuse to look after them when I go to work, I work shifts Inc. Nights. I simply cannot leave them with him either as he will not let me see them and will pull them out of their private schools. So I have in my head to leave in x yrs when DD2 has turned 18 and then will take great delight in just walking away. Money has been a massive factor in that he has lots and I only have my 2 jobs- I am constantly called lazy ( yeah right when I work 40 hrs a week ) but in order not to fuel his low opinion of me I will walk away with my salary only and be very happy with that! My friend in RL thinks I am a mad as box of frogs with my plan but she has managed to get her husband to leave, look after the kids every weekend and to get a divorce really quickly- I'm glad for her, but my life is very different. I find this threads useful to keep me strong and some strategies for surviving my life.

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