Emotional Abuse - can we talk abou t it and what it entails?

[Janos]

If we already have a thread on this then I apologise for bringing it all up again. Perhaps someone can let me know and if so I'll let the thread die quietly!

I just thought it would be helpful to talk about it, and what constitutes it so people who are in an emotionally abusive relationship could recognise what is going on as it can be so insidious and nasty, and more difficult to identify.

This is not for one moment to denigrate or draw attention away from physical or sexual abuse btw.

Good luck with your move, cheerful Vicky! I'm at the stage where I need to leave.... the Relate counselling is no good and not working, and we are back to square 1 again... he's being ultra nice and I'm just not talking to him. This of course makes me look like the bad one again, but this is my way of dealing with him. If I talk/act normally to him he will start the PA thing with me and shut down, whilst denying all knowledge of what he is doing.... bloody mind games.... sick of it.

17 years with this man and as others have said it's drip, drip or death by a thousand cuts.... I've decided not to go to Relate with him any longer as he does twist everything around and it's looking like I am at fault all the time. He comes across as oh so great in the sessions and I'm just in tears and angry/frustrated all the time. The counsellor is even having a go at me..... On the outside it's looking good- big house, 3 lovely kids,nice clothes, blah, blah.... lets put on the "act".... and all that immaterial stuff.... on the inside it's arguments, tears and frustration and a very unhappy marriage.
I'm SO tired of it all.
I wish I could find the strength to leave.
I don't want to be alone, but I can't spend the rest of my life like this, I'm only 43 fgs.
Rant over..... sorry all. x

my ex-p was like some of these things. the relationship started off very well but eventually he was continually telling me i was no good (and if i complained then it was just 'banter' and i was being sensitive). he also made a point of always criticising me in front of others when we went out, so i never wanted to anyway where there were other people. one time he said to other people (in front of me) that we had an 'open' relationship which was certainly news to me. I have tried to forget it all so i'm sure there is loadsmore. If i tried to stand up to him he told me i was playing 'mind games' - come to think of it - perhaps someone had said that to him in the past.
to all you women out there still in this situation - please believe in yourselves. whatever you decide to do stay / leave etc - know that YOU ARE WORTH IT

I wonder if insecurity is at the root of all? Because people who behave in this way just can't be happy.

IM personal E there is usually some awful damage early in life that 'turns' a person like this. They can then use this to 'guilt' someone into staying with them and absolving theselves of any responsibility.

Because any kind and loving person wants to help, don't they? I mean that's what you do if you love someone, isn't it?

Janos of course it is insecurity. Any bully is insecure.

Also it is easier to get it out to the nearest and dearest. They wouldnt dare to speak like this to a colegue, would they.

And if you allow theem from the begining and you show weakness then thats it. I ve learnt this the hard way. Once you build a pattern it is very difficult to change it.

The best advice i got was 'IGNORE' dont show weaknes and ignore him

"And if you allow theem from the begining and you show weakness then thats it. I ve learnt this the hard way. Once you build a pattern it is very difficult to change it."

Damn straight. I learned this the hard way too

Any kindness or other 'soft' emotion is interpreted as weakness and exploited.

My XP was lovely to me for the first few years (although I knew deep down he wasn't treating me well at all) but once our DC were born, he began to bully me in earnest. He systematically isolated me from my friends and family, would undermine me in private and in public, belittle me on a daily basis and generally made me feel as if I was walking on eggshells.

I finally plucked up the courage to leave him four years ago and felt that I would never have a relationship again. But two years ago I met a lovely man who has been consistently kind, reasonable and supportive to me and my DC. Now, I can't believe I stayed in a rotten relationship for so long: the contrast between what I have now and what I tolerated for 14 years is immense. Please, all of you who are still being bullied by your P/H, take steps to leave him. There are good men out there: you don't have to put up with being treated badly.

It's amazing to see how much these abusive people have in common the mixture of trying to separate you from friends and family, making themselves look like Mr Wonderful in front of others, finding a million ways to denigrate you, and turning a strong and confident person into an emotional wreak.

By the time I left 12 months ago I had developed an anxiety disorder and felt like I was losing my marbles. I am fine again now (and finding that despite being 'totally incompetent' and 'in need of constant supervision' I am very capable of working and looking after my house and children on my own...)

Have posted this link on another thread, but I really think it is worth putting in here too as this book opened my eyes to what was happening to me and why I would never be able to make my relationship work however hard I tried (and I really tried).

The Verbally Abusive Relationship (Patricia Evans)

books.google.co.uk/books?id=XWgxgogz3aAC&dq=Patricia+verbally+abusive&printsec=frontcover&source=bn& hl=en&ei=BsTGSf-0PIiyjAel99inCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=4&ct=result

The best advice in this book is to respond to the first bit of abusive nonsense with the words 'STOP IT'. Works surprisingly well for something so simple and I still have to use it now as, lets face it, once you have had children with someone they are always going to be part of your life to some extent.

Just wondering, flowerpot and others who have left or tried to leave, did your XP/Hs try to keep you or get you back. Have been astonished to see how apparently devastated my XH has been once he beleived it was over, considering he seemed to think i was a load of rubbish

Makes me think that these people, whilst appearing to be strong and dominant characters are actually very weak and dependent on the partners that they claim to have such a low opinion of.

I am back

Mummyella.,
thats a very good question i think

In my case yes. He begged me to go back (ha)

He kept calling and texting for nearly 2 years.

Until i got married to my wonderful DH

These men dont get it until they loose you. But of course never crosses their mind that you will leave. When i was saying i will leave he was laughing . They think you are a sheep just because you loved them and trying to be understanding.My ex had the shock of his life when i left him

I dont have any contact so i dont know if he has new partner and how he is with her

Yes, XP tried to keep me/get me back (and still does to some extent). Like your XH, he thought I wouldn't be 'strong' enough to manage without him. Also like you, I have 'coped' well: I run the house, earn the money (with no financial help from him) and bring the DC up with very little input from him. It's so much easier - and less stressful - without him!

And before i go to bed can i just say welldone to all of you.

As i said earlier i didnt have children with the ex so my case was very easy comparing to yours.

You had children with those men but you found the strenght to leave and you are now doing well. So WELLDONE!!

'It's so much easier - and less stressful - without him!'

So true!

And really good to hear that it is possible to find someone to love after the end of an abusive relationship. Most of the time I think I need another relationship like a hole in the head, but just occasionally I think maybe with the right person.... And I won't be making the same mistake again.

How you get there with two toddlers in tow though I am not sure

Thanks for the conratulations Sfendona. I feel I deserve it .

Bed...

interesting....my dh's dad (his hero) had a heart attack (near fatal, but he survived) when he was 45 and dh was just 12. I think he has issues concerning this that he has never explored. I did not (and would not, I think) have put up with this kind of behaviour from the beginning, but his dad then had a fatal heart attack when we had been together just two years. I saw changes after this but ascribed them to grief and TO MY ENORMOUS REGRET let him off with the anger/tantrums/controlling behaviour because I felt sympathetic to his loss. I believe this was when things really started to change. It is 3 years to the day today that his dad died. Having bought a mothers day card for me (I accidentally found it hidden last week), he then did not even acknowledge the day today. I believe now that this was intentional and to make me bite, so that he could have a fight, because he was feeling stressed about something beyond his control. when I eventually did say something (i tried to bite my tongue and failed) he launched into "of all the days to have a go at me, how could I be such an abhorrent human being as to pick today" etc etc. I am convinced this was deliberate, and he was just waiting to goad me into a fight through which, by the manner of his insidious nasty, ppintscoring manipulation, he turned into me being the bad guy. (apologies I cross posted part of this story on an AIBU thread about mothers day expectations. Mine were not that high, but to get nothing at all on my first ever one, when I know its normally the kind of thing he would have made a bit of effort over, is hurtful)
He also witholds sex and tells me its because I am so awful to him. Incredible if i have been so awful since last March, that he is still around really. [hmmm] sorry should not be flippant, its quite serious really.

Congratulations on your first Mother's day Namechanged, and a hug from me.

Mummyella, you're probably in bed but just wanted to reply to your penultimate post: what has amazed me is that it's so EASY having a relationship with someone normal who respects me and really wants the best for me.

It was so DIFFICULT being with my XP, who behaved erratically/irrationally (and even cruelly at times) and made me feel as if I was incapable of anything. It's so hard to escape from that cycle, but once you do, there's no limit to what you can achieve. It took at least a year for me to stop shaking inwardly and rebuild my confidence, but things are getting better all the time. I think it's good to have some time on your own, though, and I echo your comment about not making the same mistake again. This time, I was looking for completely different qualities in a DP.

Ditto congratulations. The only way is up.

thank you. Is it just toooo sad that I have bought a card and will write it myself? I am normally not sentimental about these things AT ALL, but becoming a mum hs been so huge and amazing (and tough!) I really, really wanted a little metaphorical pat on the back in a card, so to not get one was....well .... y'know.....

of course, if this row ends up in actual separation, it will be told as me throwing my marriage away over something as insignificant as him "forgetting" a silly mothers day card and me thinking that was the end of the world. Of course there was so much more to it than that, but that is how it will be reported, and THAT is why these emotional abusers are so bloody insidiously nasty.

I think my XP has never forgiven me for having the temerity to leave him and not only that, but to manage on my own.

Something else - he was always a lot keener on marraige than I was. Within 18 months of the relationship ending he was married to a new victim someone else.

I too had a child with XP. This means that he will be part of my life for the next, I don't know, 14 years at least (DS is 4).

I had dreadful PND after DS was born and he acted as tough I was doing it deliberately as an enormous inconvenience to him . Despite HV, doctors, and CPNs and (when I was admitted to hoispital) Psychiatrists being involved. He knew better than all of them of course.

I remember also on the day I was admitted, running around trying to organise for a friend to have DS so the he could get some rest. He told me I would have to do it because he needed to rest too!

Sorry should be 'as though', not 'as tough'.

namechangedforhelp I did a search for your name after you posted on my thread, so i could apologise for my post back to you as it is clearly more complicated than just the card thing . I do try desperately to see both sides of "arguments" as there usually is two. I can say this because mine and DPs relationship has been abusvie and controlling and can slip in that direction at times of stress. Luckily I have an excellent counsellor who helps me recognise when i am slipping back into that pattern of behaviour and nip it in the bud. It was ME who was doing the controlling and emotional abuse. It is a hard thing for me to admit.

The whole card thing sounds like something I would have done too. I have said such awful things to my DP in the past, I am lucky he is still with me. The worst thing i think i ever did was the manipulation and the guilt trips - i took over his life and made it my own and piled all my self hatred onto him. When i read the posts on here i am deeply ashamed of my behaviour and i feel like i want to ring him and say, look, im sorry im so sorry for putting you through this - he will be as he lives in the here and now and thankfully doesn't dwell but i know i have done lasting damage deep down.

Why am i telling you this? for this reason - the reason i was so vile to my DP was because i hated myself, no other reason than that - it provoked reactions in him that meant i could make HIM the bad person, i have pushed him to the point where it must have taken every ounce of his self control not to hit me - and strangely i wanted him to hit me. I wanted him to hate me because i wanted to hurt myself, no other reason - being vile to him made him be vile to me and it would become a vicious circle. Him on the defensive, looking for ulterior motives all the time. Every little argument spewing into horrible rows with me saying "well, leave, you obviously don't love me" (Who the hell am i to tell him how he feels!"" The pain it caused me was cathartic, i felt justified in then revelling in self pity.

namechanged Im not defending your DH, just putting over the other side of the coin. None of what i said above justified what i i did to my DP, i behaved abominabally and its a difficult thing to live with, but whilst i hate myself for what i did, i still believe i am not an evil bitch and i love my DP more than life, he is my everything - it is such a horrible truth that we always hurt the ones we love, because it hurts us even more

Janos, thanks for starting this thread. I felt quite alone amongst my freinds being in an emotionally abusive marriage and this has made me realise how many relationships are affected. My ex-H is a narcissist and tried to control and manipulate everyone in his life - I got it the worst. He left me 2 years ago and since then I've slowly regained my true self - a feisty, warm, capable and intelligent woman. He'd managed to turn me into an anxious wreck who doubted every move she made. I suppose I shouldn't blame him and I wish I'd had the strength to walk away but we had a young child and I wanted to make it work.

The good news is that since I started healing from this toxic relationship, I've met a man who's right for me and who loves me for who I am and I've never been happier. The hard thing about being with an emotional abuser is realising what's going on and being able to act on it -I'm so thankful my ex decided to leave me because I would never have been strong enough to leave him.

I think, by the time you realise what is going on your self esteem, confidence etc have been so damaged that you just don't feel able to make any decisions.

For me, it happened because my XP met the woman he's now married to (I had made attempts to leave before but they failed). I thank god he met her, although it was utterly horrendous for me at the time.

I am crying reading this thread.
For our entire marriage I have been(I now realise) abused in this way.
Myself and my children dread him coming home,we never know what mood he will be in,or if something will be wrong.
He withhold money from me,evw3n though he earns in excess of £100k. I work part t ime,but struggle to make e nds meet.
He never praises myself or rthe children,nothing they do is good enough.
He has never told them he loves them,although he is occasionally physically affectionate.
He has never told me I am beautiful,or praised me in any way.
He regularly sulks,turns situations around to blame me,then doen't speak for days.
He regularly lets me down over social arrangrments,leaving me to make excuses.
He is constantly critical of others,even so called 'friends'.
Nothing I do is ever good enough.I am now mentally ill,and I dread to think what damage this has done to the children.
I sometimes dream that he dies,and we are happy,then I feel guilty.
Sometimes however he is lovely,and I am lulled into believing all is ok.

Namechanged, you could put your baby's fingerprint in the mothers day card and consider it to be from her/him. At least as a mum you know that someone adores you unconditionally!

LEMAGAIN it must take a lot of courage to admit to being on the other side of this. With my husband I feel that his behaviour comes from being dominated and manipulated by his mum as a child. He went to a counsellor for all of two sessions before deciding it was a 'load of rubbish'. I think he wasn't ready to dig up the can of worms, and now it is definitely too late. I am so happy that my children are no longer being brought up in a poisonous family environment where this is being perpetuated. Hoping you can find your way through.