There We Are Then - part 2

[mummy917]

Follow on from previous

Don't cancel - go for coffee.
Hard but don't feel guilty. You're not guilty. You're sharing parenting with their dad and grandma who are also family.
Thinking of you today.

I understand, however they need to get used to the new normal. It’s just a sick bug, totally different if something more serious.

Imagine it was the other way round and he was badgering you to keep them at his. They really need to feel secure in both homes.

You didn't choose this OP. Have your coffee, you'll be back at work soon.

Big hugs, I’m actually shocked he insisted on having them, I thought he’d grab the chance not to have them and not have to parent. I do think it’s wrong he’s sending them to his Mum’s though when they are sick. I can’t imagine she’s thrilled. In all likelihood you’ll all get it now, so it will be interesting to see how childcare pans out over the next few days. I really hope he keeps you updated with how the children are doing as it’s going to be especially hard being apart from them whilst they are poorly. I also hope he can find some compassion and understand how hard it must be for you as their mother not to be there to support them.

We don’t move the children around if they are sick. it must have been really hard to hand them over. Once you get some kind of parenting agreement set up ( shared care arrangement) please put this in. Unless there is a court order in place, there is no need to move sick children around :( it doesn’t have their best interests at heart.

But young children might well be desperate to get back to Mum if theyre taken ill at Dad’s house. I’m not convinced that saying they can’t go back to her because they’re not to be moved if unwell is actually in their best interests.

I pressed send to quickly but in some instances when kids have been sick , they have wanted to come home to me, so I’ve picked them up and take care of them. My ex hasn’t minded as he’s not good at taking care of sick children and is quite frankly a lazy shit. I think in cases like this kids should have a voice too, we from their perspective sometimes they don’t like the back and forth from house to house. It’s not the adults moving around so it does impact them. It’s just something to consider as you navigate this and I know it’s very stressful x

No no, I am saying they shouldn’t have stayed or gone to dads in first place. I pressed send too soon, I always want to look after my kids when they are ill. They are teens now but this still stands. That’s why I’m trying to advocate for the children here.

Definitely still see your friend. The DC will be ok. You offered to keep them, so your conscience is clear. The DC have each other’s familiar presence which adds lots of comfort for them, and they will be ok as these bugs pass quickly. As his Mum is on hand, he is cushioned against having to do lots of the practical stuff. I think his insistence on sticking to the pattern confirms how anxious he is about minimising paying any child maintenance, he knows divorces are expensive and minimising his outlay is clearly a top priority. But it is good he didn’t refuse to have them when ill, especially given your imminent return to work.

So if they went to Dads as were perfectly fine then were taken ill at his what would you do? Stay at Dad’s because that’s what was planned, go back to Mum’s because they’re now ill or stay at Dad’s until usual change over time?

@Lizchapman the kids usually say what they want to do and we go based on that or use our judgement as adults and agree something based in work commitments as well. If it’s a little sniffle they are fine to stay at dads but for example my older dd had covid so I brought her home as she was really poorly and I was out of my mind with worry.

He asked me what my plans were today when I rang him to let him know our older daughter had also been sick when she got up, and I said I’d made plans last week to go for a coffee with my friend this morning, his response was “fine you do that”. And when I went on to say that I’d happily cancel and would rather the kids stayed with me he said “if I wasn’t at work and they were poorly, I’d just keep looking after them.” Then he hung up. Then when I was face to face with him, he said he wanted them to go with him to his mum’s as she’d be fine with them. I again said I’d rather the girls stayed with me but we would need to navigate these situations going forward, and that’s when he started becoming confrontational and I didn’t want to cause a scene in front of them.

He’s since said over the phone again (unfortunately not in writing), that he wouldn’t think twice about cancelling plans to look after the kids if they were unwell and basically made out as though I’ve not wanted to do the same 🤯

I have spoken to his mum who has said they are all okay at the moment and she is managing fine but I’ve asked her to ring me if she needs me to collect any of them. She could hear how upset I was and I’ve spent the last 45 minutes crying as I feel like the worst mum ever now. I should’ve stood my ground more and insisted he didn’t take them.

@mummy917 it’s ok, this is the first time it’s happened, I am sure next time you will be prepared for his bullshit x

But I’m noting that he didn’t take time off work so he could look after them himself despite all his self righteous talk

In writing say you didn’t seem to hear me either on the phone or again in person today when I said I would prefer to keep the girls today and I can cancel my plans, instead you had a go at me for not cancelling my plans? It’s normal to have plans and I was happy to cancel, as I’ve told you twice today. Please let me know how the girls are when you see them after work.

just always come back calmly in writing with the truth so he knows you see him. Tosser.

That’s why I carefully included in my message suggestion that he’s at work not seeing them 😁 He needs to know he is seen!!

It’s ok you’ve behaved maturely and kindly. He is falsely making out you wouldn’t have kept them as part of his classic narrative, demonising you will always be the only way he can justify what he has done.

1.Also he no longer has the right to ask or know what your plans are.

2.It’s insane logic to say he’d do the right thing and keep them when ill, but he’d drop them like a hot potato to get a haircut or a tattoo.

This is the kind of argument I can just never win with him. He makes out I’m all of these things and when I try to explain or defend myself, he just shouts over the top of me.

I gave him calpol and ibuprofen as he said he didn’t have any and reminded him of that when I spoke to him on the phone afterwards (even though he said yesterday he’d be going to pick stuff up that they needed, when I told him our youngest daughter had been sick). And all I got was “I would just give it to you without any complaints”. I then said that these are basics, the same as the potties that he should have because the kids need them and it’s been me so far to make sure they have, at which point he shouted more and then hung up. Whenever I try to stick up for myself and stand my ground, I’m just met with aggression and verbal abuse.

This is perfect, especially the part about him seeing them after work.

This is the hardest lesson to learn - that you don’t need to win this argument with him. He can think what he likes as it no longer is any of your business. Arguing back just confirms that you care what he thinks. Let him think or say what he likes just fall back on There We Are then. This will infuriate him much more than any actual response you can make and he’s never going to see things your way anyway.

This is part of being divorced. I know you didn't choose it, but this is the new world you are now in.
He is an equal parent, and in this new world they stay with him (i.e. his mum) on his days, even if they are sick.
To insist you keep them against his wishes would be overbearing and out of line.

You have nothing to feel guilty about. It is fine to miss them and worry about them, but it is not fine to feel guilty for something that is not your fault, and when you are doing the right thing in very difficult circumstances. Drop the guilt.
Have a good cry, then go out as planned.

Whenever I try to stick up for myself and stand my ground, I’m just met with aggression and verbal abuse.
Don't stand your ground in face-to-face conversations. It is a waste of time and energy. Instead, always send written messages, factually outlining events.
Keep Notes Of Bullshit.

You are doing so brilliantly, in such a short time. Of course there will be times when you get drawn into pointless arguments that you don't want, but overall you are winning this.

OP, would it be possible to only communicate with twat by text? I know a quick phone call is easier, but i think he might be aware that he has to be more careful with written communication - when you communicate verbally he let's his guard down more.

I think you said he's also a key worker? I'm wondering if he's in the police force?

Yes, All very virtuous, but
He didnt take time off did he? He farmed out to Mummy
He didnt supply meds, he didnt have any, he took yours, having said he would go to get some yesterday, when you said you would keep the girls initially..
Can you see the pattern?
He is one big gaslighting expert.
Then when he knows hes wrong he shouts over you.

”Funny how you stoop to bellowing, when your gaslighting fails miserably”

I’m still trying to find that balance of what is the best thing to do in these kinds of situations. What is best for them? Staying with me when they’re poorly which impacts his and his mum’s quality time with them and goes against the agreement, but is showing flexibility on my part. Or saying to him that these are situations that he now also needs to navigate as part of his 50% parenting and then looking and feeling like an awful mum because they have still gone to him when they’re unwell and I could’ve and would’ve cancelled my plans.

No, I haven’t mentioned before he’s a key worker, he isn’t. I’ve mentioned key workers when talking about the kids’ nursery key workers and conversations I’ve needed to have with them about the separation. I know there’s a lot been talked about over these threads so it’s so easy to lose track!

Yes I will do my utmost to communicate with him via text only going forward. I know I must sound pathetic to some of you, it doesn’t take much to make me cry on a good day to be fair!