“D”H, cinema, female colleague- update messages

[Anon1234567891]

A couple of months ago I posted about DH going on the odd cinema trip with a female colleague/friend and how on the most recent trip I felt weird/jealous about it. I didn’t think there was anything physical but didn’t know if it was a bit more than friends and felt that he didn’t prioritise going out with me so was annoyed he was going out with her.
We talked and initially he was sympathetic and said he didn’t want to upset me but I asked if he would show me his phone messages to her and he was defensive and cross and wouldn’t even though he said there wasn’t anything “inappropriate”. There were a couple of other things I found he had hidden from me not directly related to this which I was annoyed about but we tried to move on.

But it still bothered me that he wouldn’t show me his messages so the other day I decided to look at his work phone as I couldn’t see his personal one and found these messages on teams.

Relating to the cinema he sent a picture of one of those double lie down beds you get at some cinema’s and said “we could have done sofa bed but a bit OTT for the first date” - it was the “first date” bit that got me.

Then there was one saying “because seats recline going higher than normal please make sure you have underwear on - this time!” She replied “spoil sport”. WTF was that about.

There were also messages about minor work issues where he replied “you are amazing” and “you are always welcome” and one where he put😍after the message.

So is this work banter or something else, there was nothing like this to anyone else. He has banged on for weeks about how I should trust him but if this is on his work phone what’s on his personal.

And to the people that kept telling me men and women can be friends would this make a difference to that opinion, I couldn’t see him sending this to a male friend.

I feel so sorry for her and a little frustrated. She just can’t seem to see that his disrespect and unwillingness to change his life a tiny bit in order for her to be reassured is just as bad as cheating. In fact I would argue in some cases that it is worse.

I can't believe he's really this thick.

"Why do I keep thinking he’s going to be sorry and glad that I might want to work it out but instead he still thinks he’s right and I’m wrong."
Blame shifting 101, and his behaviour must be driving you up the wall at this point, surely? He knows what he's doing, and he's not going to stop - so whatever your next move, you have to make it knowing that he isn't going to change.

What an embarrassment he is.

The grass will be so much greener for you, OP, on the other side - I hope you will come to realise this.

He’s still gaslighting you - he’s trying to convince you his behaviour is reasonable but we ALL know it isn’t.
Eventually I think you’ll realise you can’t live like this - putting himself and OW before you and family will weaken and destroy you.
Find your courage and anger at this ill treatment and don’t put up with it any longer.

He sounds nasty. He sounds potentially dangerous.
Stop pushing him now OP. You don't want him to turn on you.
You need to quietly find a way out and protect your value and worth. He's appalling.

I think he’s had his head turned, so if you left for apparently “no reason” he could just blame you for the breakdown of the relationship and move on with the OW. It’s a fantasy and it won’t end up how he thinks it will but for now, I think that’s why he’s not fighting for you OP. I’m so sorry.

By not showing you the messages, and insisting he’s got no reason to, he’s still pushing you to be the one to do the leaving and thinking he can appear blameless in it all.

Do you think his colleague could have read your correspondence and helped him pen a calming you down response.

Him reverting back to being a bastard when he came back home supports this.

I do think you should now think about not communicating with him over text, I don't believe he is keeping your conversations private.

Absolutely not! I can’t imagine bantering like that and if DH ever did he would be shown the door. That’s way, way over the line.

Gaslighting 101

Absolutely this. The complete change of tone between the texts and his attitude in person... and it will be from the women who advised him to "be firm with her".

he said "some of my comments were harsh".... some of YOUR comments? Really? after the way he spoke to you recently so "harshly" you were actually afraid of him !! FFS.

He will NEVER admit he's wrong. Or he would have met you half way by now..

The messaging is innocent and harmless. But he is still protecting his phone like mad isn't he. I wonder why? most people would have given in by now and shown you the phone... to prove you wrong.. .but he wants you to say you are wrong without a glimpse of his prescious must be guarded at all costs messages... and anyway OP the ones you have seen are MORE than enough.

Seriously OP... there is no point engaging with him on this any further. You are just going round and round in circles. He won't suddenly cave or care about how much this is hurting you.. He only wants you to back down and he will use threats and intimidation to make you back down and let him carry on as he pleases. And that is continuing to hurt, exhaust and drain you... So Stop engaging on this. He is actually enjoying putting you back in your place. Power trip.

Wise up. Get, as mums net loves to say your ducks in a row. Being as secretive as possible about copying documents, getting your own documents to a place of safety - there is a list on this site somewhere. And start making your own plans.

Speak to Women's aid about being afraid of him and how to protect yourself whilst you research your options. It will make you stronger to be in control of your own actions and stop waiting for him to suddenly give in... from all the examples you've posted, he's not going to stop.

He. Does. Not. Care. You are hoping for a break through that is not going to happen. So take a step back and start researching how to protect yourself physically, emotionally and financially. From everything you have said about him.. the situation is not going to get any better. It will only get worse... so make a start on researching your options at the very least. If he did miraculously start behaving like a faithful husband again, then no hard done. If he continues as he is then at least you have prepared yourself.

Yes the "some of my comments were harsh' was him getting validation from another person agreeing that you were being unreasonable.

Op this sounds like a smear campaigne, he is editing what he wants others to know, he is portraying you as crazy and unreasonable. It could be either his confidente or this ow but you need to back away from this situation, he is clearly enjoying your pain, it's very sadistic.

I know it's extremely hard because you can't believe it yet, that someone could be so cruel, especially your h but there are many men that do this. It's very difficult, it's very unfair and you are hurt and angry and want him to at least aknowledge what he is doing to you, but he won't , he will just double down and it is this what makes this man very unpredictable and dangerous.

You must try to stop hoping he will love you or even like you at this point, he doesn't deserve your love, forget about him liking you, at this point who cares if this complete disloyal git likes you or not, that's where your thinking needs to be.

You are essentially begging for a piece of shit to like you, you will understand soon he really doesn't deserve any decent human being, let him mix with the trash, lose him and disconnect, don't ever let him look you in the eye again, he's garbage.

You are definitely too good for him.
Keep safe.

OP, he was apologetic and said all the right things right up until the point where you said, okay, maybe we can work through this. Then he immediately reverted to anger and contempt.

He doesn't care about your feelings. He just wants to win. Be in control. Have the upper hand.

He's not going to change. He may say all the right things, but only if he thinks he will be able to maintain control over you that way.

Actions speak louder than words. He can say anything, but look at what he actually does. Has anything changed in his behaviour and attitude? Has he made an appointment for therapy? Has he wanted to sit and talk things through? Has he given you his phone and passwords? If he hasn't actually done anything, it really doesn't matter what he says.

I would say that the very fact that he still doesn’t understand at all how you feel despite you spelling it out to him, he thinks the truth you have pointed out to him is ‘harsh’ (it’s just true, not harsh or anything else. The truth is just simply the truth and if he doesn’t like the truth about himself and his behaviour he needs to change) and is still hinting that you are overreacting, is why you would consider leaving.
His appalling attitude is now a far more pressing reason to leave than any of his pathetic messaging and grim
flirting.
He’s clearly confused because you’ve started to stand up for yourself. He’s not used to an assertive you that he can’t manipulate so stay strong. Keep it up and get yourself protected with a plan moving forward.

OP, ultimately this is about how you feel and whether you can trust him. It doesn't matter what we think and you don't need us to validate your feelings - trust your feelings yourself, whatever they are.
Let's give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he's had an ill-advised minor flirtation as opposed to anything more serious. Can you live with that and move on? Can you accept that he may never see your point of view? What if he continues to message and see his colleague? Can you trust him in future?
These are the questions you should be asking yourself.

Thanks the answer to those questions is no, I don’t think I could trust him now and it’s about the context of what was going on with us at the time whether or not the messages were innocent. I think it’s irrelevant about if it was right or wrong it’s about how his attitude has been throughout this. As someone put on another post if he had sat me down and said ok you’ve took it out of context but perhaps the messages were a bit OTT, I’m sorry i won’t do it again and here’s my phone for you to see it’s all innocent then it might have been different but he hasn’t done that.

He certainly hasn’t tried to do anything to reassure you. The problem is he just won’t accept how it’s made you feel. Not acknowledging the hurt things like this cause just leads to ongoing mistrust, regardless of whether or not you actually move on from the incident, there will always be that thought in the back of your mind that things are still happening between them. You either accept that and all the misery it continues to cause, or you do something about it that demonstrates your determination not to be destroyed, which, sad though it may feel, probably means leaving

I don't even think its a lack of understanding or empathy, but rather he actually doesn't want to acknowledge how she feels because he wants to maintain the status quo of a marriage where he is able to be as free as he likes with his seat-reclining, underwear-free movie sessions.

when he came home he wasn’t happy, said some of my comments were harsh and he didn’t think it was serious enough to be considering my future and didn’t understand why I was so hurt as he thought it would need to be something worse to have that reaction

Well, yeah. He said this after work. She's at work, isn't she! I'm sure he did feel sad and worried at 9am and then lit up like a sad little Christmas tree when she was about.

Please sit and watch this youtube video with insight from Lundy Bancroft. I know it’s long but it will hopefully give you the insight and validation I think you are seeking that he doesn’t respect you and is abusive.

At the end of the day it is your decision what to do here and you will know in your gut when you have decided to actually leave, are ready for it, have the confidence to see it through without regret, and can see him as a different person to the one he wants you to see.

It may seem to you as though many posters here are being excessive in trying to open your eyes, and I am very aware that you don’t know them, their biases or their intention. Please understand these posters are likely to have gone through this themselves so can spot it clearly. I am one of those people.
Your husband is familiar and has always offered safety, so it’s understandable you want to believe him. It’s through this perceived trust that he's is pulling you back, although he has made it clear that deep down his concern of your emotional wellbeing isn’t a priority to him. He is attempting to by placate you with a text message which has been cleverly written to win you back over with false hope. This is such a common tactic called hoovering- and one many of us know well and can spot a mile off. He has done you a massive favour though by letting the mask slip immediately as he walked in the door rather than offering you a false sense of security and hiding his tracks for long enough for your nervous system to settle and for you to feel safe and trust him again- but that trust would always have been eroded and you will never feel completely secure anyway.

The easy option here is to stay- for the sake of avoiding the inevitable emotional exhaustion and turmoil of starting a new life. To leave is a massively brave decision and one that will take enormous mental strength- it is vital you get yourself strong. Please prepare yourself for this battle- keep seeing your counsellor, and reach out to people you trust who are not linked to him in any way- friends who don’t contact him, your immediate family and if you don’t have this support then absolutely contact women’s aid. Abuse isn’t just bruises, the law now considers emotional, verbal and financial abuse too, however these can be harder to prove so keep records. Write down anything you can remember of incident which have made you feel victimised in the past- I am pretty sure this won’t be the only time he has made you feel unsafe. Also as others have said speak to a solicitor and do all the necessary admin to prepare for a split to give yourself the best chance of financial and mental stability.

Sadly this is most likely true - you are way down his list of priorities.
You do seem to be in a much stronger place emotionally now - you can have a happy life!
It may not be easy but you can do it OP - stay strong and use your anger to do what you have to do. Good luck, we’re all rooting for you!

I'll be honest, maybe this is starting to get to the stage where you are being unreasonable and a bit controlling by keep demanding to go through his phone. If nothing happened between your DH and this woman beyond a bit of banter and happening to like the same films, then he doesn't really have anything to apologise for. He'd be admitting he was guilty of something if he did apologise. And then you still probably wouldn't be able to move on because you'd still be suspicious that there's more that you don't know about.

At this stage you need to either get over it and work on reestablishing trust, or end the relationship. Carrying on in circles like you are isn't helping you or him.

@Anon1234567891

Please listen to your therapist.

Your DH does NOT need the benefit of the doubt- he's had it all his own way this entire time and STILL won't accept any responsibility. Hundreds of us have told you that your aren't being unreasonable. That what he"s done and is doing is wrong. He knows it hurts you, but won't stop. Won't even try to compromise or reassure you.

This has been going on for such a long time now. Please don't let any of us confuse you further. Your therapist is trained for these exact circumstances and will help you find a realistic way forward. You deserve peace of mind and a calmer, more stable future.

Please listen to the therapist. 🌹

It's like you haven't even bothered to read the two full threads by the OP at all. 🙄

You don't need proof

Going to say this in the nicest possible way love, you have to stop hashing over ‘then he said this but then I said this and then later he said THIS’ and get your head properly around the fact he’s a weapons grade cunt and make actual plans to leave, not hover about waiting to see if he’ll actually apologise or acknowledge you like someone waiting to be picked for the netball team. Find some self respect under all this and make quiet, concrete plans to separate.

I've said it before everything you've said is exactly what my ex did and said, down to the cinema, the phone the comments. And that was all abuse.

Ultimately it sounds like you're going to stick with it all. You can lead a horse to water etc as the saying goes.

OP, youre in an abusive relationship with a gaslighting narcissist. Only you can end that by leaving the A hole. He will never change. Even if he stops talking to the woman at work it'll only be once hes got what he wants from her and she leaves him, then he will just find another.