Married to someone with Asperger’s/ASD/ND: support thread 17

[SpecialMangeTout3]

New thread.
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This thread is for those of us seeking to explore the dynamics of long term relationships with our ND partners. Some of us are ND ourselves, very many of us have ND children. It is a support thread, and a safe space, it does get emotional at times. Avoid sweeping generalisations if possible, try and keep it specific to you and your partner.
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It's complicated and it's emotional.
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The old thread is here.
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/relationships/5355546-married-to-someone-with-aspergersasdnd-support-thread-16?page=10&reply=148665446

Like @Echobelly , I have no plan to leave dh atm.

The biggest turning point was this summer. There was a couple of incidents where I ended up being very blunt. Telling him that if he did xyz again, then I wouldn’t step in to save him. Hed have to deal with the full force of the consequences.
i also made it clear then, that I was at my limit and he had to step up.

And to be fair to him, he STEPPED UP.

He stopped ignoring me for days on end.
He started to be supportive (remembering I’m disabled and housebound so lack of support there very quickly becomes neglect)
He doesn’t automatically react with rejection when asked to do something - which means he has taken responsibility for things he hadn’t for like ever.

So the very big difference is that he changed and made a huge effort.
On my side, I’ve let go of a lot of expectations he is never going to be able to do. Small talk, emotional support, negotiating/partnership.
I have a life that is calm, low affect, little expectation. And as it turns out, due to my chronic illness, this is exactly what works for me atm. (Appreciate that for others, it would be closer to hell).

Thats to say, theres scope for change.
The scope might or might not be enough for you
In my experience, the way you deliver your message re boundaries matters a lot, maybe more than with NT.

Tonight has been an interesting case of something DH and I need to talk about.... DH has had really terrible stomach pain, I think he may be right that on the medication eating heavy food, especially quickly (we all scarfed down takeaway pizza tonight) seems to bring on really bad cramps.

Anyway, he was in the bath in our en suite, I was downstairs washing up and listening to a podcast and suddenly I hear him bellowing my name - apparently he'd been shouting for a bit but I couldn't hear with all the noise (and him being quite far away in the house). At any rate, in a moment of anger he said 'Why do you always avoid me when I'm ill?' and I said I wasn't avoiding him, but the truth is, I do. He's horrible to be around and yells and also groans and complains constantly and is really demanding. I don't want to tell him this now, while he's still feeling sick, but we need to talk about it.

The fact is I feel awful about it - I should feel sympathy for the man I love when he's unwell but the truth is if he's ill, or hasn't slept, my first thought is 'How am I going to cope with him?' and when the kids were younger 'How can I make sure the kids can cope with him/he can cope with the kids?'. TBH he has got better but I still do keep my distance because I don't like the moaning and yelling, it's very alienating.

I think Echo you really need to be honest and say look you turn into a miserable bastard when you’re ill. It’s not that I don’t care but you aren’t pleasant to be around because you get very shouty and huffy so yes I avoid you. Of course I will help you if it’s serious, but being around you when you’re being ill and unpleasant puts me on edge and makes me feel bad so I won’t put myself through that unless I have to.

How can someone have so little self awareness to know if they are being a miserable shouting human or not? Does it really take someone to tell them?

Hello all
I am not a regular poster but have come across this thread and can resonate with a lot of things posters have said.
Im in a 20 year relationship but think I am done. My husband is diagnosed adhd but I don’t feel that is an excuse for some of his behaviours sometimes and I feel extremely resentful and do not want to spend time around him.
We have a 6 year old child who is also diagnosed with adhd and I believe also has a pda profile so as you can imagine a very tricky character at times.2 other children also.
My husband cannot regulate himself when our child is disregulated and it turns into a shouting match. To be honest he is a regular shouter anyway over the smallest things, I would say also has anger issues.
He will admit he is wrong after the fact when pulled up on it but the same thing will happen again. I feel like I’m doing a disservice to the children letting them grow up around this angry man that cannot control himself.
apologies for the long post it’s been nice to get that off my chest!!

I think when he's stressed he didn't have very good awareness of how he's coming over.

As it happened, just after I typed my last post, DH seemed much better so I told him that yes, I do avoid him when he's ill because he's hard to be around and it feels like he's taking it out on you, and that I feel bad for feeling that way but I do feel like my first worry is how to 'manage' him when he's unwell and grumpy.

He acknowledged he was difficult when ill and apologised, saying he could understand it.

@Echobelly my husband is horrible when he’s ill, makes a huge fuss, moaning and groaning loudly. I’ve asked him to take himself off to bed if he feels that bad, I would obviously offer drinks, food etc, but he prefers to make himself the centre of attention and sit in the living room. I go out now and leave him to it.

I can’t understand this really. I have it on my side also. The inability to see their behaviour and the behaviour and the needs of others and emend their behaviour. For example not reading when someone is feeling left out and emending their behaviour a little to counter this. Mine would just go oh that’s a them problem, I’m feeling fine so that’s all that matters. The judgment of others without the knowledge of why or how or even that judging is pretty shitty. I can’t sit with mine for very long at all. I sometimes feel judged for my behaviour or opinions when they are pretty standard and expected given a situation. Mine has no interest in exploring anything and I can’t stand the narrow mindedness.

Thinking about it it must be so difficult to not know what you are like. You don’t get the chance to change, grow and you just loose people because you annoy people, dig heels in and never change and people get fed up. I limit time now which they mustn’t really understand why. Or they just blame myself and think fine of themselves.

It’s a really hard one.

Its totally possible that he is finding really hard to stay regulated in emotionally intense situations. I’m assuming this would happen at others times though, not just with the dcs…..

I think the fact he is regularly angry and shouting is a bigger issue tbh,
Is it a regular occurence?
It sounds like you have personally reached the end of the road if you dint want to spend time with him anymore. And it’s ok. The fact he is ND doesn’t matter there.
And YY re the dcs. Both what they learn about what’s acceptable or not and from living in a house full of tension/shouting.

In the best world, what would you like to see happening?

Sometimes, it can take a long time to realise what’s going on/your behaviour etc…. even when you’re insightful and want to change things/yourself. Blind spots are called that fir a reason.

Yes and in the meantime what happened to the other person over that time. What have they had to minimise etc, how much have they changed and lost. I suppose we all have different levels of tolerance. Some of us hold on for too long and become changed. I’m trying to regain myself, it’s hard. I don’t see the world the same way as mine. I can see none of us are wrong, just different, but I’ve seen myself through the eyes of someone who sees the world differently. It’s hard seeing yourself through your own eyes. I think that’s the damage done by a parent who is so rigid, they have different rules. It’s a shame that mine can’t accept my differences as I can accept theirs but I suppose that’s part of the disability and why it effects relationships.

@SpecialMangeTout3 Thank you for your response.
He does have a very short fuse and gets irritated by little things at times. It’s not all the time but I feel I’m so used to it now I don’t even take any notice unless it’s towards the kids. To be honest I don’t know what I want to see happening but I’m tired of feeling like the only adult in the house at times and having to regulate everyone including a grown man. It has come to a head so many times, conversations have been had and things are fine for a while but then back to square one. Rinse and repeat. He does want to do counselling to work on ‘us’ and sees his short temper with the kids(mostly is the one with adhd) as a separate issue but I don’t think he gets that my resentment has stemmed from his behaviour with the kids and that I can’t get over that. Am I in the wrong there? Is it possible to get over it?

Part of me worries that when the kids leave home (which is in the distantly foreseeable future) the grumpiness will rebound more on me again. Honestly, if he gets as grumpy as his father, I would leave him! I think I have told him as much.

I think I’ve warned mine about turning into his father, who is a lovely man but the random stuff my lovely MIL has to cope with sometimes, he got very obsessive about bins. But DH has had to learn his behaviour isn’t acceptable FIL came from a generation I feel where smart ASD men didn’t necessarily get pulled up for bad behaviour like he has been, DH has more emotional intelligence.
@Perspectives123 you’re not wrong to have reached the end of the line, my DH struggled with our son at one point but he recognised his behaviour wasn’t helpful and learnt to step away, plus DS has got older so that helped too. We talk a lot in this house about being responsible for our own behaviour and recognising how it can impact others. Your DH needs to recognise that he has to deal with how he behaves towards the kids, perhaps if he could change that…..counselling might be helpful, you can be clear that the anger towards the children is one of your main issues, he can accept and work on that or not, I think I’d be tempted to give that a try first, but only if I actually liked/loved him still. If you don’t have anything left to give then it’s very tricky and you’re totally allowed to call it quits.

Raising ND children is hard. I’ve read that many relationships end when ND children are involved. It’s hard and I’m in this situation. I’m ADHD and my partner is undiagnosed ASD and we both struggle with eldest, he more so being that he struggles to empathise. Both of us don’t always behave in a regulated way. It’s a hard situation especially when the kids are young and struggling themselves. There is such little support.

Just checking in as I am so so done. In a really difficult period with DD (year 11, out of school, GCSE stress, EHCP, EOTAS etc etc). I am shouldering it all as DH just cannot. None of the organisation and none of the emotional support. She is home all the time. I work FT in a demanding role. He does so little. It all blew up this weekend as I just cannot any more (he works 0.8 FTE and when at work, is at work). I am so broken by it all and he had just not done one of the small tasks that he is responsible for. Likely my fault for raising it in the way I did (I can see it was naggy) but I cannot do any more and have said this (tears, anger, exhaustion), he does not respond.

Anyway, he got angry and punched the wall, scared the kids, hid upstairs for hours and the buggered off out until late. Both kids freaking out as worried meaning already difficult school situation was on a bad start for year 11 DD (and it's precarious already).

I cannot leave as I cannot accommodate my work any more (I am always coming out of stuff, dealing with things, tutors, LA) any more than I am. I am working eves, weekends to make up for this. Leaving would make the situation even worse for me and also, would cause so much distress for kids at critical exam time.

I am so angry at him, why can't he do such small things when I carry so much? I know communication is hard for him (he is autistic) but that does not mean that I need to break down even further. At what point do I actually even matter?

@lostmywayrightnow

i discovered when i became ill i don’t matter at all.

I think many of us in here need to wake up and realise that it’s us or them. And they are going to take you down with them, so the only option is to leave.

Someone who punches a wall is not modelling a safe and loving relationship to your kids.

Tell him to leave. He sounds like he adds more to your life in stress than he gives in help and joy.

please people, don’t end up on three drugs just to function like me. I deserved so much more and so do you. I’ve never had anything like this before but my body broke through the stress and then my mind followed…

When you are dismissed and subjugated over and over again it’s a form of self erasure and it’s so so damaging. High cortisol will do bad things long term and that’s because of all the suppressed anger you feel because you are having to do EVERYTHING.

I've just done parental report form for ND assessment for oldest, but I don't think he'll get a diagnosis. I think he is more autistic than ADHD but, although I do think he is on autism spectrum, I don't think he'll meet the criteria as, at the end of the day our answers (and I'm sure his teachers as well) just don't show 'deficits' socially or educationally.

It was funny going through the questions as there were some about making friends, annoying their peers and stuff like that and the answer really was 'Yes, he's good and making friends and he doesn't annoy them but then he's good at approaching people who will get on with him, namely other ND kids'.

In other news, DH started to get interviews offered, which is encouraging as he's only been applying for a few days.

I really want something to look forward to, but don't want to spend much money so have pencilled in doing a long weekend in Cornwall mid May, mainly to see a friend down there. I figure if DH has a job by March we'll book an airbnb - if not we'll just book a campsite. I'm rubbish at being in a tent,and the weather will probably be crap but it's a cheap getaway and will only be 2 nights!

@Mini2025 I hear your pain, I’m sorry you didn’t get what you needed 💐❤️‍🩹

@Echobelly am in a similar situation with my eldest who I think may be AuDHD and has exclusively ADHD friends!

Is it a demand to expect some acknowledgment of an emotion from a person with ASD? Im just wondering if this is why my parent has raised emotionally detached children. She doesn’t want the demand of our emotions as it takes her autonomy away? None of us will go to her with any problems, we both hide them.

I can imagine it might feel like a demand on them, something they don't know how to deal with so they avoid it. That sounds very difficult to have to grow up with.

Talking of difficult to grow up with - DS is starting therapy soon (frankly mainly to deal with his father, but let's face it, I accept it could be me too). DH and I have an initial meeting with the therapist, and without DS, to discuss what's going to happen. Well timed, as yet again DS found it impossible to start a task this evening, and yet again DH starts sniping that it's a 'behaviour', and at least I'm able to say 'Well you can park that until we speak to the therapist next week and can ask about how she can help him with that' and he accepted that. I will also ask her how much, if anything, she will communicate back to us - obviously it is confidential in detail but from what I recall child therapists can still give parents some general feedback.

I want to be clear to DS he can say things to her he might not want us to hear and she won't tell us, in fact I would encourage him to tell her things he wouldn't want us to hear!

Does he have a hard time accepting that his son’s brain works a different way to how he believes it should? I’ve had some issues with my child’s school and the way it feels like they shame children into behaving a certain way. I have erased school from my memory but I remember it being so difficult. I was a very good masker and I went under the radar as I had the intelligence to achieve, my child doesn’t so struggles. It’s not stood me on a better ground as hiding and pushing has made me breakdown a few times in my life. Pushing children and using shaming to avoid them from future suffering just back fires in the end because they are wired how they are wired. But then being different is shaming in itself, it’s a hard world.

Thank you @Pashazade problem is is that he won’t step away, he has to ‘win’ I think it’s a control thing. My son won’t step away either but it’s not his responsibility to do that as he is 6 and stuggles with his extra needs. I then have to step in because a grown man cannot regulate himself and that is his responsibility. This is where the resentment has set in and I no longer think I even like him. Anytime separating is discussed and I don’t like the idea of couples counselling he will start ranting that I have issues and need to see someone myself. Most recent is discussion about separating is him
ranting he is worried leaving the kids with me and is thinking of contacting my parents and that I am selfish etc for wanting to separate. Yet the next day quite happily goes into work with me at home with the kids. I think my eyes have finally been opened. Apologies for typos I’m on my phone x

Oh and that I would have to explain to all the kids that it’s all my fault that the family is breaking up. Has also said he would ask the eldest if he wanted to live with him. I’m guessing because he is easy work and he’s almost at an adult age so very little actual parenting would be involved 🙄