Was I wrong in this argument? I need outside perspective

[notaurewhatusername]

I came downstairs this morning and saw our baby in just a long-sleeve vest, no trousers. I asked my husband to please put trousers on him in the mornings. He said yes.

I then looked at the thermostat and said it was only 18 degrees (thinking that was the temperature shown). He went over and said it was actually 21 degrees. I got frustrated and said “I don’t give a fuck what temperature it is, can you just put trousers on him - you have trousers on and it’s not that warm.”

He responded by saying I’m either “stupid or a liar” for saying the thermostat was 18 degrees. I genuinely misread it by 3 degrees - I wasn’t lying.
We had a big argument. Later he said he’s nasty to me because I’m nasty to him first. He said he was “minding his own business” and I came in and interrupted his day. He also said he WANTS to hurt me when he says things like I’m stupid or a liar, because I hurt him first.

I keep thinking this is my fault - I shouldn’t have checked the thermostat after he said yes about the trousers. I shouldn’t have sworn. Maybe I provoked this?

Am I wrong here? We keep entering into this vicious cycle, he says I’m a bully and just want him to do as I say when it comes to looking after our son. I think my requests are basic parenting, he sees it as bullying?

BTW OP, its called Cassandra Syndrome. Its a term wives of autistic men have coined because when they try to talk about their experiences, they aren't believed. Its what you are experiencing from some poster on this thread. Those of us who have experienced it can understand exactly what you are describing. Why don't you try looking it up - it might help you to make sense of what you are experiencing.

Why can’t he just do the simple parenting himself of ensuring the baby is adequately dressed? Why does the op have to do what he should’ve done in the first place?

Agree with @Noneofus but the op might also have traits. Problems arise when both are stuck in their own wants and needs and neither able to break out of the cycle.

I’d suggest solo counselling if that’s affordable for you @notaurewhatusername to work on boundaries and understanding your own emotions and needs. Marriage podcasts aren’t going to work. You need to talk to someone.

Even your user name suggests uncertainty about yourself, which opens up space for your partner to exploit. Then resentment builds up hence you asking for an apology about his gaslighting you when you were ill. But far too late at that point.

Yes, you provoked it using aggressive language and being quite patronising. I don't think there was any need to even say anything, I would have just put some trousers on him myself if I felt it necessary, although I wouldn't be bothered about no trousers at 21°.
I'd feel like shit if my DH got up and this was the first interaction. If this is usual behavior I'd go as far as saying you are emotionally abusive.

(((HUG))))

Don't pay too much attention to replies from people who only read your initial post. Without the background that does make it sound like you were 'at fault' BUT with the background, definitely not.

Frankky he sounds like an arse & I think your health & mental health would be better off if you divorced him.

if you're not ready to do that, then try to individual therapy to get yourself into a stronger, batter place. Then you might be able to see what a complete bastard he's being.

dont bring famiky/friends into it because individual 'he did x' isn't going to give them the full picture.

(((HUG)))

@Nearly50omgro add, this afternoon after the row we managed to have a calm discussion and he still sticks by that he thinks how can he hurt me when I have in his eyes hurt him (by being bossy or aggressive in his words). But because i start it (and not always IMO) he says this is a reasonable response.

You need to read her other posts

You’re not alone, I get similar. No positive comments are allowed because it’s ’demanding and controlling’ or ‘people shouldn’t be praised for normal every day things’ etc etc etc

i can promise you, OP, any attempt at all to express a need with this man is ALWAYS going to be turned around on you as you having a personality failure or as being controlling.

You are going to spend the best years of your life in a continual cycle of twisting yourself in knots, reacting to his bullshit and being told you’re the problem.

Don’t do it to yourself - or your child.

At the very least drop the rope. Stop expecting even the most basic of things from him.

It's not. He's being abusive.

@Noneofusive already done a lot of research on it, DARVO too. Thank you for highlighting though.

i am so lost I cannot see where the problems lie which is why I posted here - the context of our relationship os necessary to understanding I guess it wasn’t just about this particular argument

It’s a huge problem that your husband takes any suggestion or criticism as a personal attack on par with calling someone stupid or a liar. He should not have been hurt by being asked to put trousers on the baby. Does he take everything as a personal attack? Yeah, you could have just stopped after he said yes, but him INTENTIONALLY hurting you in response is worrying behaviour. Being irritated about your continued insistence would have been warranted, but he massively overreacted. He even admits after things have calmed down that he wants to hurt you.

As per previous poster: Cassandra Syndrome. Been in exactly your position, also with young kids. Was utterly exhausting, bewildering and demoralising. My self confidence ended up in tatters. Now ex husband. We co parent surprisingly effectively and almost always amicably, but that was never going to happen living under the same roof. I am so much happier as things are, and have really treasured the opportunity to parent calmly and peacefully, on my terms. We are both better parents living apart (also divorced now). As an aside, to follow up on one of your earlier points, I have noticed in life that there is not necessarily any correlation between people’s ability to hold down responsible high-level jobs, and their ability to have emotionally mature relationships.

Well op, you got it, peiple now telling you he’s abusive.

🤦‍♀️

Who cares who is wrong?!? The fact is you have a child in the middle of all this and you and the child are what the law considers being abused by your partner! The law now considers that children who are living with a father that is domestically abusive to their mother are being abused!!! Have a think about that and focus on what is the main issue here. Your child. You need to get this man out of your house and your life as much as you can. Whether it’s with the police or women’s aid helping you

@FurChickenI just literally said to him his reactions are way disproportionate - I do something and he ramps it up by being horrifically nasty. He admitted this but feels it’s justified by my constant attacks?!!

This is the last example I will give of his behaviour because some posts seem to think that I’m giving examples to turn people against him. I’m not—it’s just that right now I cannot see the wood for the trees, hence I need external opinions, and this is the only place right now that’s available to me.

Now, there was another big row on Friday. Again, I suppose I started it. He keeps keeping baby in the bath for long periods of time, like half an hour.l and baths him twice a day. This is after baby had eczema patches on his face and arms. I’ve repeatedly asked him not to do this, so yes, I got annoyed and said it’s been long enough now. He also bathes with baby and doesn’t wash first. I think this is disgusting—sometimes he comes from the gym and wants to bathe with baby! I called him out on this too. He didn’t like it, and it basically ended up with him calling me a bitch.

Was I wrong calling him out on this? He also refuses to cream baby despite him having eczema. I’ve asked him repeatedly—I even put the cream in the bathroom. Please, can someone help explain to me what the fuck is going on?

You’re putting a lot of your expectations / standards / interests on him and if he doesn’t conform, you’re viewing him as the problem.

His reactions are defensive and the situation then escalates.

The whole dynamic is quite messed up but frankly if he doesn’t want to work on it and you don’t feel able to be flexible on your expectations I can’t see things changing.

(also bare in mind that young child in this mix makes everything more stressful and emotions heightened)

This is not good. When me and DH went through a tough time with small DC, one positive thing we realised is that neither ever intentionally wanted to hurt or wind up the other.
It's not a good sign he's not willing to be positive.
It can feel forced at first, but then it becomes more natural.
Have you mentioned the posibility that this could ultimately end your marriage ?

@LeavesOnTreesyes a few weeks after DS was born it got real bad. He never took parenting classes and therefore was doing some things universally accepted as inappropriate. It caused a lot of arguments and he said give it two years to improve things

I do think you need to be less critical of his parenting and back off a bit. Him not washing first isn't a big deal.

He might be deliberately ignoring your demands on purpose because you are constantly on his back. This is really not good for your baby.

What has the health visitor/GP advised?

Just put the cream on yourself after his bath to your satisfaction

But o don’t understand why he would actively say he doesn’t want to put the cream on? It’s fucked up, the child has dry patches - if we are looking in best interest of DC he would cream him and yes as someone asked the doctor advised I use cream. If you google how long to bath baby it says everywhere less than half hour, DH still won’t accept this. But fair enough if these things aren’t life or death I’ll just have to not raise them if it means saving the marriage

This. In spite of the pile on on this thread, he has plenty of issues and no interest in working on them, or in fact, in you. You know you have things to work on yourself.

We keep getting crossed posts. Just saw this when, after I replied about the bath situation.
It's tricky, you've fallen into a cycle of:
You saying how it should be done.
Him not listening and /or stubbornly refusing to do it.
You not trusting him, so you are more anxious and critical, even when some things aren't that important.
Which then makes him more dismissive and rude.

It just isn’t working out. This thread has given me a reality check. Because it isn’t working now it doesn’t mean it can never work. I’m going to solo therapy and I will work on what I can and see where it takes us